Donald Trump and US politics

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Laurium wrote:

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Budget_player_cadet wrote:

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You and I will never agree about this. We perceive party strategy in completely different ways.

It's difficult to understand why you would ignore the major defeat this last election. When you go from control of Presidency with sure-thing candidate to lowest representation since the 1920s, I don't see how you can state I am pretending that there was a huge defeat. It wasn't a huge defeat...it was a historically gigantic defeat, never before seen when considering all the circumstances.

For someone who demands numbers, sources, facts, and justifications from anybody making so much as a whisper in this thread or the other, you're quick to qualify away the obvious and ignore reality when it's on your terms. That same economic power has always been there, still 85% of counties were nevertheless lost among the other numbers that can't be wished away. Petulant shots against Bumblefuck Texas doesn't change any of this.

Things are not hunky dory within the DNC because millennials of progressive persuasion have a monopoly over Twitter trends on any given day of the week. That's not how you win representation and enact real, substantive change in this country. You need districts beyond the coasts. You need candidates. You need leadership whose collective age doesn't exceed 200 years. We have none of that. We have "the resistance", promoted by a person who may not win re-election in 2018. For my money, that's not a strategy with a purpose of electing the future, but it does carry with it very big risks. Could be wrong, never know.

It doesn't matter. You and I have said what we have to say. It's run its course. We just don't perceive current action or reflect upon the last six years the same. C'est la vie.

It is a great strategy, besieged with their backs against the wall. Losing is the new winning. I am more worried about the republicans. They are getting comfy in that chair.

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Laurium wrote:

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Budget_player_cadet wrote:

Snip

You and I will never agree about this. We perceive party strategy in completely different ways.

It's difficult to understand why you would ignore the major defeat this last election. When you go from control of Presidency with sure-thing candidate to lowest representation since the 1920s, I don't see how you can state I am pretending that there was a huge defeat. It wasn't a huge defeat...it was a historically gigantic defeat, never before seen when considering all the circumstances.

For someone who demands numbers, sources, facts, and justifications from anybody making so much as a whisper in this thread or the other, you're quick to qualify away the obvious and ignore reality when it's on your terms. That same economic power has always been there, still 85% of counties were nevertheless lost among the other numbers that can't be wished away. Petulant shots against Bumblefuck Texas doesn't change any of this.

Things are not hunky dory within the DNC because millennials of progressive persuasion have a monopoly over Twitter trends on any given day of the week. That's not how you win representation and enact real, substantive change in this country. You need districts beyond the coasts. You need candidates. You need leadership whose collective age doesn't exceed 200 years. We have none of that. We have "the resistance", promoted by a person who may not win re-election in 2018. For my money, that's not a strategy with a purpose of electing the future, but it does carry with it very big risks. Could be wrong, never know.

It doesn't matter. You and I have said what we have to say. It's run its course. We just don't perceive current action or reflect upon the last six years the same. C'est la vie.

And I'm not sure how much clearer I can make this. The strategy the democrats are following now is both fundamentally different from the strategy they followed in the 2016 election and modeled after the party who used it to great effect over the last eight years. Yes, the democrats lost the last election. How, exactly, is their current strategy substantially the same as their strategy during the election? How is "obstruct, block, and point out the flaws in everything Trump does" a losing strategy when Trump is so phenomenally unpopular? It'd be one thing if he was consistently gaining in popularity. Then we could say this strategy isn't working. But he isn't. His popularity is hovering pretty consistently in the lower 40s. And the more mud is slung, the more people wake up to the idea that Trump is actually not working for them. That Trump is not fulfilling his promises, or that his promises cannot realistically be fulfilled. Assuming the people in question even listen - and if they don't, then they're not listening, so it hardly matters to begin with.

I will freely admit that there are real structural problems within the DNC, however.

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deathflower wrote:

It is a great strategy, besieged with their backs against the wall. Losing is the new winning. I am more worried about the republicans. They are getting comfy in that chair.

The only Martyr the left had was Bernie, but Hillary ganked him (election wise) herself, and his loss became more fuel for Trump's bonfire. The left tried to make Hillary a martyr, but she's so corrupt that no one is buying it. Then the left tried to make themselves all martyrs with the woe is me crying and shrieking.

Put succinctly - the left can't even lose properly. The side opposing Trump will have to look inwards and recognize their own mistakes before they will be ready to defeat him. This is true of any loss, whether it's a game, a sport or a business. Learn, Adapt and Succeed.

Does anyone reading this thread honestly believe people are worried about whether CNN's feelings are hurt by Spicer? Some might be concerned about whether the fourth estate can properly do their job at informing the public, but the press itself has put that subject in jeopardy all by itself.

The Vault 7 releases don't really show anything that people didn't suspect anyways. Computers and connected devices can be hacked. Hacking occurs. Big Brother is watching. Hacking origins can be spoofed.

Dove tail that with the "Russians" and you have people simultaneously trying to deny and confirm conspiracies and facts that are mutually intertwined.

The left has not yet begun to lose. No flask will staunch the bleeding should they continue to run in no direction at full speed. The only hope they have is that their opponents on the right continue the infighting and bickering and come to a screeching halt.

None of this is new. It's just another political chess cycle with different players. The only potential difference is that on this 2017 chess board, the king can move any number of spaces and jump over any other piece.

Naturally, that has the left freaking out.

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DalaiLama wrote:

None of this is new. It's just another political chess cycle with different players. The only potential difference is that on this 2017 chess board, the king can move any number of spaces and jump over any other piece.

Naturally, that has the left freaking out.

Donald teaching Barron 4D chess. Or is it the other way round?

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Xavderion wrote:

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Budget_player_cadet wrote:

Meanwhile, here's Steve King:

https://twitter.com/SteveKingIA/status/840980755236999169

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Wilders understands that culture and demographics are our destiny. We can't restore our civilization with somebody else's babies.

A congressman said that. A fucking congressman said that. Yeah, white nationalism isn't something we need to be worried about at all.

How is that white nationalism? He's right, you can't solve your demographics issues by importing culturally incompatible people and letting them handle it.

"Culturally incompatible people" in this context meaning...? The answer, for those who can't recognize a dog whistle if it's blown through a bullhorn with David Duke standing next to it applauding, is "not caucasian/christian". Even interpreted as charitably as one can, it's still pretty darn unamerican. Never mind the American ideals of multiculturalism and the melting pot, never mind how well many groups have and continue to integrate into America and who have enriched our culture, we have to be worried about those darn immigrants who just don't integrate*! Seriously - this is white nationalism. This is extremely blatant white nationalism.



*Not exactly sure where Steve King found them, to be honest...

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Budget_player_cadet wrote:

"Culturally incompatible people" in this context meaning...?

Islamists, for example. It's literally the context of that tweet.

In other news, Russia hacked some migrants.

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Xavderion wrote:

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Budget_player_cadet wrote:

"Culturally incompatible people" in this context meaning...?

Islamists, for example. It's literally the context of that tweet.

Bit odd; last I checked, we weren't trying to repopulate and solve our demographic problems with islamists. Are you sure you aren't confusing "islamists" with "people who practice islam"?

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In other news, Russia hacked some migrants.

It's not exactly beyond the pale. Putin's done worse, and Russia has a history of meddling in foreign elections with eyes on destabilizing nations. He also really doesn't like Merkel, because Merkel is one of the voices in Europe calling for stability and sanity. Obviously, to actually pin any such attack on Putin, one would require more than just conspiratorial guesswork, but it is something to potentially watch out for. Something similar has already happened in Sweden.

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Budget_player_cadet wrote:

Merkel is one of the voices in Europe calling for stability and sanity. .

https://youtu.be/LGcaNY5eBWw?t=28

It's pathetic to blame a third party on your own problems and faults. Speaking in general, not about Germany in particular.
First it was the US elections, now those in Germany. Are you fucking kidding me? Those evil superhero russians...
Russia was turned once again into the boogeyman supposed to scare and distract the masses, while their governments can't put their shits together. The comfortable excuse for all the continuous failures.

EU has never been weaker and is slowly falling apart. And if there's someone to blame, it's the headliners - France and Germany. BTW both, taken separately, had more international and regional authority just 20-30 years ago, than the whole union has these days.
America isn't in a good shape as well.
Alright then, there's Putin to blame.

Oh, was about to forget - you ARE actually trying to solve your demographic issues by importing these aliens. And you are actively attempting to incorporate them into the economy and the german society by breeding them with locals. It's an official policy of your government.

Typical liberal media such as CNN, "researching" and "reporting" while wearing blinders. Either they were completely naive about Clinton and Obama doing the same thing, or just wanted to skew the public's opinion on the matter because this time the target is Trump. My bet is on the latter.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/03/13/media-pivots-on-trumps-prosecutor-purge-after-learning-clinton-obama-did-same.html