2.4 and the CoC nerf - what to expect ?

Just add lab traps to the core game nobody will want to play CI coc discharge at all.

buff literally everything else so it all surpasses coc
fuck the power creep we already one shot everything

:^)

Cats on crit was already nerfed. GGG nerfed it before there were even cats.

I have never played CoC, but i see it as a superior over self cast which is sufficient to nerf it.

I have seen many, many people claiming it's better and for a really long time, and on paper it's seen as well.

Let's just talk about links- first two links are 1) attack gem; and 2) CoC.
with those two attack/hit time usually is 0.12-0.15, while good casters with spell echo have around 0.25 sec (except freezing pulse).
Comparing those two CoC gems to two self cast support gems with already included spell echo (included in mentioned cast time):
CoC- 2x cast speed difference and x0.7 from coc gem;
self cast- echo was already included in cast time, so 1x and average support gem in second slot x1.35.
so its 1.4x vs 1.35x

Here they are basically equal, but speaking about other gem slots- coc has advantage, it can slap-in other active spell gems which basically results in 2x damage multiplier as a second active spell gem, and as third- 1.5x which are quite stronger than average support gems. Also CoC has access to intense discharge spam and low mana costs.

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Vhlad wrote:

Cats on crit was already nerfed. GGG nerfed it before there were even cats.

Actually CoC has been nerfed 3 times over.

1st nerf CoC was added to have a 10ms proc crit (from no proc cap which means there's was no need to stagger hits, a cleave attack hitting 10 targets could result in 10 instantaneous procs) GGG added a 20% proc chance to make up some difference from the proc cap.

then at 1.2.0 GGG nerfed the proc chance of CoC by 20% across all levels.

then at 1.3.0 GGG increased the proc rate from 10ms to 50ms.

Currently the only CoC that has insane power is cyclone discharge variant, which requires a voll's devotion. Even if we ignore all other gear, voll's devotion along costs over 20ex which is enough to buy like 8 voltaxic.

Despite the higher cost of cyclone discharge build, it's still limited by reflect and since it's a melee oriented build it only clears stuff around your character. Voltspark on the other hand has full reflect immunity, much much cheaper to build and could clear mods from 3 screens away.

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Andrius319 wrote:

I have never played CoC, but i see it as a superior over self cast which is sufficient to nerf it.

I have seen many, many people claiming it's better and for a really long time, and on paper it's seen as well.

Let's just talk about links- first two links are 1) attack gem; and 2) CoC.
with those two attack/hit time usually is 0.12-0.15, while good casters with spell echo have around 0.25 sec (except freezing pulse).
Comparing those two CoC gems to two self cast support gems with already included spell echo (included in mentioned cast time):
CoC- 2x cast speed difference and x0.7 from coc gem;
self cast- echo was already included in cast time, so 1x and average support gem in second slot x1.35.
so its 1.4x vs 1.35x

Here they are basically equal, but speaking about other gem slots- coc has advantage, it can slap-in other active spell gems which basically results in 2x damage multiplier as a second active spell gem, and as third- 1.5x which are quite stronger than average support gems. Also CoC has access to intense discharge spam and low mana costs.

This is very flawed argument.
Only thing CoC has it going for them is cast speed.
Selfcasting is different beast. You free up 2 slots minimum for attack and coc gem. This means your spell could be supported further.

My coc freezing pulse has average damage of 3.2k tooltip, while my selfcasting freezing pulse has average damage of 25k.

Selfcast also completely ignore accuracy this means you will have a lot more passives points in spell damage/crit ect.

lastly, there's this meta build called Voltaxic Spark which is in fact a selfcast build which makes all other CoC look slow in clear speed as well as the added benefit of reflect immunity as well as higher effective dps.

Dude, why are you even wasting your breath arguing with a guy who starts off with 'I've never played CoC' and then explains how OP it is :)

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Andrius319 wrote:

I have never played CoC, but i see it as a superior over self cast which is sufficient to nerf it.

See this is the problem right here.... People who think COC needs a nerf yet has NEVER even went through what it takes to make a COC build...

First off Self Casting a spell will ALWAYS be superior to COC casting for major reason..
On COC you are casting UNLINKED spells.. Spells that are based on their core stats alone.
Thats the point of scaling your APS so you can get all those casts up to a maximum of 20 CPS.

Because you are always casting weak gimped versions of the spells. Otherwise when you self cast you have 5 other supports to add to the spell which results in spells that will one shot damn near everything.

Not to mention in order to even have COC work you have to invest in Crit, APS, Spell, Spell Crit (depending), Gear to make it all work correctly, and after ALL that.. Defenses which is where most COC builds beging to have issues.. Its pretty hard to invest in all these things just to get the build itself to function THEN still invest in proper defenses.

So before jumping on the nerf something ive never played bandwagon.. Try playing it first.. You might find the build is ALOT more balanced already just because of investment and everything it takes to even make the build in the first place alone.... On top of finding out all the drawbacks that come along with such a build.. Like ive said before if you invest large amounts of currency into a build it damn well better do crazy things.. otherwise why the hell would you invest in it? And you sure as hell are not gonna slap together some OP as fuck COC build that destroys the content in a few chaos...

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Bars wrote:

bDude, why are you even wasting your breath arguing with a guy who starts off with 'I've never played CoC' and then explains how OP it is :)

LMAO that's fucking GOLDEN. Signature worthy right their

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I_NO wrote:

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Bars wrote:

bDude, why are you even wasting your breath arguing with a guy who starts off with 'I've never played CoC' and then explains how OP it is :)

LMAO that's fucking GOLDEN. Signature worthy right their

I've already generated at least one forum signature, careful or my ego will get inflated :P