why is the tcp timeout still 6 sec after all these times?

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Char1983 wrote:

I like the idea of having lower and upper bound be the same. I really like it, for a variety of reasons.

We know you have a shitty connection, thats not my fault or anyone else's fault.




@ScrotieMcB

It doesn't make your proposal any better on those that don't have issues, again it makes it worst to the point of it currently being a large negative of a change that is just as @pneuma mentioning would need a complete rebalance of the game to accommodate it, for something when you think about it that the player can at least somewhat control. Most places should have multiple ISPs, you can get better PC hardware, you can have a BBU so that your internet doesn't cut off when there are brownouts or whatever the cause of issues the end user could prevent.


I can't prevent my character in your situation from taking damage for 1.8 seconds or however long. How is it a good suggestion to punish those under better circumstances then somehow try and solve the issues that the people under worst circumstances are having. Something like being able to custom configure the TCP logout of a player wants, is a vastly better option then suggestion a massive change that not only affects those having issues, but those that don't because it creates many more issues in the process.

Its like trying to fix a car and instead of replacing the actual broken part in the car you are doing something that requires a complete car rebuild, because in the process of tearing down and rebuilding the car you can fix the issue with the "shocks" or as mentioned you could just fix the "shocks" and leave the rest of the car the way it was.

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goetzjam wrote:

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Char1983 wrote:

I like the idea of having lower and upper bound be the same. I really like it, for a variety of reasons.

We know you have a shitty connection, thats not my fault or anyone else's fault.

[...]

I can't prevent my character in your situation from taking damage for 1.8 seconds or however long. How is it a good suggestion to punish those under better circumstances then somehow try and solve the issues that the people under worst circumstances are having. Something like being able to custom configure the TCP logout of a player wants, is a vastly better option then suggestion a massive change that not only affects those having issues, but those that don't because it creates many more issues in the process.

It would be better because it would make the game more fair.

But I guess you don't want the game to be fair, do you? ;)

Just want to point out that I'm not disagreeing with anything pneuma said (that I noticed, anyway). I already acknowledged that equalizing what pneuma calls upper and lower bounds would lead to rebalancing of many aspects of the game... and yes, that's a project of daunting and borderline unrealistic scope.

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Char1983 wrote:

"

goetzjam wrote:

"

Char1983 wrote:

I like the idea of having lower and upper bound be the same. I really like it, for a variety of reasons.

We know you have a shitty connection, thats not my fault or anyone else's fault.

[...]

I can't prevent my character in your situation from taking damage for 1.8 seconds or however long. How is it a good suggestion to punish those under better circumstances then somehow try and solve the issues that the people under worst circumstances are having. Something like being able to custom configure the TCP logout of a player wants, is a vastly better option then suggestion a massive change that not only affects those having issues, but those that don't because it creates many more issues in the process.

It would be better because it would make the game more fair.

But I guess you don't want the game to be fair, do you? ;)

More fair because you live in a country that has shitty connections? Its not fair that I would have to experience a subpar method of disconnecting because you have "shit" internet.

Again if you read the arguments that I or pneuma said you would see the implementation of a universal disconnect time would require a large amount of work because it would require the very rebalance of the whole game.

"

Just want to point out that I'm not disagreeing with anything pneuma said (that I noticed, anyway). I already acknowledged that equalizing what pneuma calls upper and lower bounds would lead to rebalancing of many aspects of the game... and yes, that's a project of daunting and borderline unrealistic scope.

Ah ok yeah perhaps he had addressed it in a "better" way then my concern, regardless the concern of negatively affecting some because current people have a negative experience in terms of disconnects is extremely concerning. This isn't even the level of desync vs no desync argument, but the amount of effort to "fix" this would take more then I think the devs are willing to put forth.



Obviously the bandaid solution would be allow custom logout time if possible so that those that have connection issues can set their threshold for dropout shorter and those that don't can leave it the same so they don't experience disconnects when they don't want to.

In the current state of the game I am on goetzjams side... strange enough x.X

Trying to help people with problems leads to "let's make other peoples experience worse" makes my day.
Just wow...

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kcstar wrote:

In the current state of the game I am on goetzjams side... strange enough x.X

Trying to help people with problems leads to "let's make other peoples experience worse" makes my day.
Just wow...

For some reason I feel like this isn't the first time you've said this.

I say let people choose this as a client value.

If I hit 1000ms lag, then I don't want to be there anymore. Sry. Bye.

Heck, if it was a choice, I might even say 500ms is too much for me. I usually play at 30-120ms or less.

By making it a client option people can consider what works for them and their connection. Some people playing in bad places on standard might choose 10 seconds (more instead of less).

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goetzjam wrote:

More fair because you live in a country that has shitty connections? Its not fair that I would have to experience a subpar method of disconnecting because you have "shit" internet.

No, just in general better (and more fair). Logout macros? I mean, seriously? Can you, realistically, flee the battlefield in no time, like, anywhere?

In your HO the logout would not be any different at all. Neither would it be in town. It would only be worse in the middle of a battle. Which is somewhere that you should not log out anyways. If you need to log out urgently, just find a quiet spot in the map and log out. Will take less than five seconds.

And yeah, I know that GGG has said that this is intentional before. My feedback is: It would be better for the game if this wasn't possible. And would solve a few other issues as well.

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Char1983 wrote:

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goetzjam wrote:

More fair because you live in a country that has shitty connections? Its not fair that I would have to experience a subpar method of disconnecting because you have "shit" internet.

No, just in general better (and more fair). Logout macros? I mean, seriously? Can you, realistically, flee the battlefield in no time, like, anywhere?

In your HO the logout would not be any different at all. Neither would it be in town. It would only be worse in the middle of a battle. Which is somewhere that you should not log out anyways. If you need to log out urgently, just find a quiet spot in the map and log out. Will take less than five seconds.

And yeah, I know that GGG has said that this is intentional before. My feedback is: It would be better for the game if this wasn't possible. And would solve a few other issues as well.

Realistically......let me just point out this is a VIDEO GAME.


You mean when you aren't in danger or there are no mobs around its not any different, I mean technically it is the risk factor is different obviously when there are mobs around.

It would be better for this game if we didn't make the experience worst for those of us that can play the game in the intended and designed fashion just to make it more "fair" for those that do have those issues. Again you are completely neglecting the massive difference in what the game would have to be with your "fair" method vs what it is today. Read what @pneuma said regarding the amount of work and the cascading effect the change you are supporting would have. Its not realistic to change the DESIGN OF THE GAME to meet people that have subpar situations. Again this isn't even the same level of difference with desync which was a massive issue for some, while a non issue for others.

In a perfect world you would have a better connection and not experience these issues, because that is true the "perfect" game design is to support people that have issues by allowing a customization timmer to be set to meet those "imperfect situations" rather then punishing those that have no issues of the related sort.

I would be in favor of a solution where the minimum logout time would be 1.5-2 seconds even if I had a perfect connection, because it would make the game experience better for me (because I would not feel like I have to use logout in sketchy situations because it is the best decision even though it feels like cheating).

Not really the point of the topic though.