Undying Alchemist and Undying Incinerator

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Crevox wrote:

I am willing to accept those as counters to my build or just being tough mobs, but I just can't in this situation.

So are you willing to accept this or not? Very confusing statement.

Everyone seems to just keep pointing at my HP and ES. It's not the issue here.

Yes, I understand it's low. That's fine, however, I find it silly that nothing in the entire game is a threat to me except for ONE specific mob type, and it's not even really a "counter." Nothing in this game does anywhere near as much damage. You seem to think I'm generalizing or having difficulty with multiple mob types, but I'm not; it's only incinerators. Yes, I said alchemists as well, but if you read my main post, I already stated that those can be understood due to my low HP and chaos resistance. However, incinerators simply cannot be.

Nothing in the game does anywhere near as much damage to me as that incinerator. Like I said, it kills me in one hit, despite it being enfeebled and me having 77% fire resistance. The fact that it kills my minions is one hit is just further showing how much damage it does, because NOTHING ELSE can. The complaint here is how much damage this ONE mob type does; nothing else. It does an absurd, extreme amount of damage compared to anything else in the game, despite maxing out resistance against it.

I play with my friend almost exclusively and he agrees, because he gets decimated by them as well, and he has more HP/ES than I do. It's ridiculous.

well that's because IT IS THE ISSUE. You can dance around it all you want, but realize that three pages of people are all telling you this.

And also, they're bombs. They wouldn't be doing their job if they didn't mess you up bad.

Oh, and they are your counter.. big counter. Like, they of all mobs are your counter. They do aoe. They can hit all of your summons at once. I think you'd be better off talking about minion survivability in this situation because that's a better topic. Your minions shouldn't be able to be one shot by an aoe of all things. Single target, maybe. But definitely not an aoe.

I wouldn't be opposed to a bit slower projectile speed on them though.

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oopomopoo wrote:

well that's because IT IS THE ISSUE. You can dance around it all you want, but realize that three pages of people are all telling you this.

And also, they're bombs. They wouldn't be doing their job if they didn't mess you up bad.

Oh, and they are your counter.. big counter. Like, they of all mobs are your counter. They do aoe. They can hit all of your summons at once. I think you'd be better off talking about minion survivability in this situation because that's a better topic. Your minions shouldn't be able to be one shot by an aoe of all things. Single target, maybe. But definitely not an aoe.

I wouldn't be opposed to a bit slower projectile speed on them though.

Nothing else in the game "messes me up bad"; nowhere near. Most things won't even break my energy shield in one hit, but not only does this break my shield, but it also destroys all of my health in the same hit, in addition to being a fire attack that I have maxed resistance against.

There is something in this discussion that actually needs attention...

Is this OK that a white mob does as much damage as the last boss of Merciless, if not more? I can take some hits from Piety, but it's quite possible I die from the white poison bomb thrower in one hit, especially if I happen to cast something and remain in the cloud for 1 sec or so.

Overall, I think the damage should scale "properly", as in white trash>blue>rare>boss. As of now, I have a much easier time with all the 66-67 map bosses I have encountered, compared to a cheap white Alchemist. Sure, a boss alchemist should obviously be hard, but a white alchemist... trash mob is trash mob.

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Undon3 wrote:

There is something in this discussion that actually needs attention...

Is this OK that a white mob does as much damage as the last boss of Merciless, if not more? I can take some hits from Piety, but it's quite possible I die from the white poison bomb thrower in one hit, especially if I happen to cast something and remain in the cloud for 1 sec or so.

Overall, I think the damage should scale "properly", as in white trash>blue>rare>boss. As of now, I have a much easier time with all the 66-67 map bosses I have encountered, compared to a cheap white Alchemist. Sure, a boss alchemist should obviously be hard, but a white alchemist... trash mob is trash mob.

Obviously its not much of a 'trash' mob if its killing you....

The fact is they throw slow moving, easy to avoid 'bombs'. If you get hit by said bomb you go boom. Seems good to me.

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Crevox wrote:

Nothing else in the game "messes me up bad"; nowhere near. Most things won't even break my energy shield in one hit, but not only does this break my shield, but it also destroys all of my health in the same hit, in addition to being a fire attack that I have maxed resistance against.

Can you think of an attack that's easier to avoid?

I know they do a ton of damage, my marauder can die to them if not careful and he has 80% Fire resist and 4.5k hp with 300hp regen/sec. However, I don't die to them because they are easy to avoid.

@thepmrc:
In a group you don't even see the bombs, common, be reasonable, you just see your health pool dissapearing. They're not slow, not really avoidable, and do a crapton of damage.
The mob is WHITE-->TRASH.
All around the forums, you seem to be supporting each and every aspect of the game that inconveniences players. Nothing else matters for you, if it kills and annoys the player, you seem to be happy. Is there something I am missing here?

To put it simply: in HC I do not run maps where monsters have multiple projectiles. I have 4.5k life, 75% elemental resists and -33% chaos resistance as a ranged character. Multi-projectile Alchemists just nuke me when they get a single volley in. The risk of Alchemists appearing is just not worth the reward in my book. Now please, don't take this post as a complaint. I am fine with uber powerful monsters like these. I just wanted to share how I handle them: don't ever do multi-proj maps in HC.

edit: Here's a suggestion, though. Make "map has many Undying Alchemists and Incinerators" (similar to "map has bandits") a map-mod with a big quantity bonus, to give a better reward for the danger these monsters present.

I play solo or duo the majority of the time and a lot of times I don't even see them, or they're thrown off screen. In a very tight dungeon situation with tons of mobs, if there are incinerators or alchemists in the back... they will throw and it is difficult to dodge or even see it coming. This is a bigger problem for me personally because they will hit my minions in the face, and that explosion is sometimes large enough to reach me. If it doesn't, well, my minions are still ALL dead.

Again, not a problem with minion survivability. They have 13,000 health and can survive other things just fine, but this ONE mob just does way too much damage.

I feel your hurt man...
When I roll a map with those alchemist sobs I immediately leave that map then and there.
2/3 of my gear is summoner based uniques.
(shield is for necromantic aegis)
I have NO POSSIBLE WAY of reaching ES & HP values some posters said they have without stripping my gear and/or investing 20+ skill points in HP & ES nodes on skill tree, and that is something I will simply not do because it would destroy my summoner build completely, especially not because 1 mob in the game that is ridiculously imbalanced.