Game is Dead. RIP POE 2014.

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Xtorma wrote:

When I read this thread, I get this picture in my head of a town. It has fields of grain and vegetables growing nicely and a lot of healthy livestock. The people are happy and engaging. then on the outskirts of the town are a few vultures waiting for the day when the people starve to death so they can feast on them.

Tired of waiting, the vultures begin picking castor beans and dropping them into the village, hoping the people will eat them. when the people notice this, they say to the vultures....we will let you have some livestock if you stop dropping poison beans into our village. The vultures reply NO! nothing with satisfy us short of feasting on the flesh of the entire village, because once this place was only for vultures, and now there are people here, and we do not want you here defiling our land.

Riveting fable, comrade.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

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Antnee wrote:

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Trading = pvp mechanic

I think that's... a stretch. If we're being intellectually pure, you're right.

Hey, you were the one using a slippery slope argument. This is not a case of "if there is ANY PvP element, Antee won't play." You're saying you like it minimal, and I can respect that.

Okay, so next question: imagine we had a completely PvE loot tension mechanic. For example, item is allocated to you, but after a timer expires the Hand of Hades springs forth from the ground and drags the item under, never to be seen again. You can still lose a Shav's this way, it's just that instead of another player getting it, no one does. What would you feel about such a mechanic?

(Related tidbit: mushrooms in the original Super Mario Bros move right instead of staying still because it means you need to chase them, potentially avoiding enemies as you do. Old school loot tension.)

Still anticipating Antee reply.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Okay, so next question: imagine we had a completely PvE loot tension mechanic. For example, item is allocated to you, but after a timer expires the Hand of Hades springs forth from the ground and drags the item under, never to be seen again. You can still lose a Shav's this way, it's just that instead of another player getting it, no one does. What would you feel about such a mechanic?

No, I would not be ok with that either. Your SMB analogy is fair, but we aren't talking about a game you can plow through in ten minutes, we're talking about a game that can be brutally unfair over long periods of time.

If I put in two years and never saw a decent, top-tier drop (which does happen, and we all know it), I would be infuriated to the point of quitting if the loot I had been waiting for all this time was just ripped out from under me.

So, PvP/PvE loot tension is just two means to the same frustrating end. In one instance, I begrudge someone I am supposed to be cooperating with. In another, I feel ripped off because I simply wasn't able to get there in time. It adds nothing to the game, hence, I want no part of it. And, from a glance at the party boards at any given moment, neither does anyone else.

Look at it this way, Scrotie. FFA is a definitive playstyle with a niche audience, much like PvP itself. I would argue (although, I'm clearly yanking this out of my ass...) that the amount of people who truly want to play FFA is probably equivalent to the amount of people who want to PvP. You do have the option to FFA if you want to, and you do have the option to PvP if you want to.

Given that the FFA crowd is so insignificantly tiny, why would it be in GGG's best interest to force everyone to party that way? In my view, it would be like eliminating PvE altogether just to satiate the PvP folks.

I know we're getting way off the fuckin rails here, but you know, this thread wasn't that interesting to begin with. Sorry to anyone who was hellbent on talking about POE DED OMG STEEM CHARTS

edit: sorry scrote, work's a bit hectic today.

It is refreshing to have a debate with someone who discusses the topic fairly. Thank you.

[remaining content remade into new thread]

I think what we keep revolving around is the need, or want, to have loot tension at all.

I'll have to think more on what you're saying, because I do think it's interesting, and I don't want loot tension to not be an option... I just don't want it to be the only option.

Edit: I also think this warrants its own post, because at the moment there really isn't much else to talk about. And I feel weird contributing to this crappy fucking thread.

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Antnee wrote:

Edit: I also think this warrants its own post, because at the moment there really isn't much else to talk about. And I feel weird contributing to this crappy fucking thread.

Done.

I don't think it's dead. I do think it's unlikely GGG will be getting any more of my money with this engine. I doubt I'm the only one who feels as such. One of these things will lead to the other.