Feedback and Suggestions (Path of Exile 1) - I'm Unhappy I Put As Much Money As I Did In This Game - Forum

Loot tables for bosses and uniques are a good idea. It allows non-trading and casual players to focus their energies on a target without resorting to trade while also giving players a sense of superficial control (something POE lacks and is a source of much consternation). Interestingly, Ambush league has brought chests with loot tables - why not add monsters with loot tables? e.g. a gem goblin, ring bearer. Loot tables also add a soupçon of depth to vendor recipes. I can't think of any game praised for it's crafting that doesn't use loot tables (POE gambling aside). Want to Fix the Economy, Bad Loot, Trade and Legacy PvP? pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/548056 Open Letter to Qarl on Crafting Value pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/805434 Biggest Problem with Mapping: Inconsistent Risk to Reward pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/612507	Posted by Veta321#3815 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:04:47 PM Quote this Post
yeah ggg really doesn't grasp the whole carrot on the stick thing. Alot of the mechanics offer way more challenge than they are worth. there is a reason why people skip kole or any unique mini boss for that matter on their way to piety/ mervil / brutis / dominus etc there is a reason why certain map bosses are out right skipped there is a reason why people say "skip the corruptions until you are twinked" there is a reason people sell vaults of atzri rather than run it Last edited by Saltychipmunk#1430 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:08:02 PM	Posted by Saltychipmunk#1430 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:07:51 PM Quote this Post
I think the problem here is a sense of ownership... You have to take 2 things into account, the 4 month leagues and the permanent leagues... To me the game is focused towards this new leagues. It is always a fresh start with a fixed ending date... ...that great unique item or excellent rare set you got on your OP build is going to be merged to a permanent league and than another cool league will start which will have new mechanics... The point is, the idea is, to play on the new leagues, to value the time spent enjoying getting through the content, and the only caveat is that your stuff goes to the parent league when it ends, so that you can hoard your items... I sincerely enjoy the new races from scratch, inventory management is too painful when merging the items from other leagues, so much that I have stopped, I probably have a billion items stored that I will never use... like I've said before, either the ability to vendor directly from stash or the ability to delete a remove only tab that is not empty would be nice. I myself tend not to trade a lot, since I have a group of friends, we made a guild and share the good loots, unique includes. And since this time there's no challenge to play all the characters, I can focus on one solid build, and have fun with that, less stash management. I just think that GGG should separate Race mode from Story mode, to me, only the Challenge of the Champions, or Descent are fun, because is a content that you don't have regular access. As far as difficult bosses they are there for the thrill, it is not something that you just wing it and go for it, sure, if you are in standard and have enough portals you can beat almost any boss in the corrupted areas, but the idea is not that. The idea is to give you a new layer of challenge, so that you can learn to adapt your party/char to resolve the situation. Like I've said in a previous post, I almost never had a 5L (got one in the previous 4 month), never had a 6L, so trying to get a build from a website and follow it is stupid. Now playing and learning and planning, using the website passive tree, that's fun. And seeing good results in-game is much more fun. So far the reward is only the Challenge of defeating the boss, I guess having a great loot would an extra challenge, but I really don't like the idea of a boss loot table, which chances of specific items dropping, that would be boring, repeating a content over and over. And maybe that is a challenge of the end-game, I confess since I started exclusively on HC on closed beta, I have since migrated to SC, since I live in Brasil and my ping is 180-200ms, my game experience does not allow high risk play on HC, had some bad encounters with Vaal, and so on, and I was unable to "enjoy" the end-game, so I decided to go to SC to see if I could get there. And one thing I was wishing for, was for GGG to introduce some way to map on lower levels, I mean, mapping was always end-game only, and since you have to clear 3 times the game it would be fun to have some lower level maps to do in normal and cruel. This expansion solved that IMHO, creating map-like areas during the progression creates a change of pace, and a break on the repetition of farming area X until you can progress. Anyways a rambled a lot. TL;DR - Play the leagues - Don't worry about hoarding items/chars - Pretend that every 4 months you have a new game to play - Try other games from time to time, anything you do too much gets boring	Posted by fabio#5933 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:28:06 PM Quote this Post
If GGG plays their own game, I would like to see some video how THEY kill the uber-bosses. Solo/self found and without any cheating of course. ;) Balancing a game is not easy, however if you PLAY a game, you just feel what is right and what is wrong designed. That#s the point that worries me a little bit because GGG seems to do not feel the right balance. Or they are really a bunch of Hardcore Gamers that want to fight against impossible bosses and do not care if they die countless times. Before addinge new game content, I suggest to balance the existing content first. And I mean balancing for solo and Party play, not only for party play at the disadvantage of normal solo palyers. (Everything in PoE is compared easy in partys, except sharing the loot maybe, and the game perfromance of course. ;) )	Posted by Fusion_Power#0294 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:34:27 PM Quote this Post
" Saltychipmunk wrote: yeah ggg really doesn't grasp the whole carrot on the stick thing. Alot of the mechanics offer way more challenge than they are worth. there is a reason why people skip kole or any unique mini boss for that matter on their way to piety/ mervil / brutis / dominus etc there is a reason why certain map bosses are out right skipped there is a reason why people say "skip the corruptions until you are twinked" there is a reason people sell vaults of atzri rather than run it Well, the reason seems to me is the same as "don't spend currencies until you are in merciless act3"... ...because the currency you accumulate in the beginning is good in the end as well... And maybe GGG could change that in some way... ...right now when there is a new league, you try not to spend a lot of the currency on your items, because a 5L low level item is crap anyways, you save for end-game, but that is the main problem because it causes the difficulty curve to be bigger, if you are not geared to get to the end-game what use is there to having a stash full of chaos orbs... The mentality should be to encourage people to spend their currency early on, so maybe a tier level currency might be good, so that you know that you are safe to spend it before cruel, because it would roll small affixes, like, let's say you have itemlevel in the currencies, so a normal alch would have a smaller good affix chance than a merciless alch. Now that would help with hoarding, and would serve as incentive for people to spend their normal currency early on to get good enough items on their levels, that would make players learn early on about how to spend the currency and rolling items and all that other part of the game that you normally don't do and avoid the "it is better to save chaos and alchs for trade instead of spending it culture". So Rhys, if you are watching this thread, please comment on this. Btw, talking tech, i really like how PoE was coded, I mean, to have such a pleasant experience playing the game, under the kind o ping that I have is phenomenal, the way I read they simulate the game on the server and sync it with the game that is happening on your PC. It is a great experience, even with the Desync, but that is an external factor when you are playing with different people on different connections and regions. I'm a Senior Developer and I really like and appreciate the work you guys put in the sync aspect and the whole gateways etc. People don't realize that if they had put separate instances (EU, Americas, and Australia) and didn't allow cross region partying that it would drastically reduce the desync issues, but it would segregate and make it a worse game, and it would be a cheap way to "solve" the problem. Anyways, as always I overextend on my posts. GG	Posted by fabio#5933 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:42:01 PM Quote this Post
" fabio wrote: I think the problem here is a sense of ownership... You have to take 2 things into account, the 4 month leagues and the permanent leagues... To me the game is focused towards this new leagues. It is always a fresh start with a fixed ending date... ...that great unique item or excellent rare set you got on your OP build is going to be merged to a permanent league and than another cool league will start which will have new mechanics... The point is, the idea is, to play on the new leagues, to value the time spent enjoying getting through the content, and the only caveat is that your stuff goes to the parent league when it ends, so that you can hoard your items... I sincerely enjoy the new races from scratch, inventory management is too painful when merging the items from other leagues, so much that I have stopped, I probably have a billion items stored that I will never use... like I've said before, either the ability to vendor directly from stash or the ability to delete a remove only tab that is not empty would be nice. I myself tend not to trade a lot, since I have a group of friends, we made a guild and share the good loots, unique includes. And since this time there's no challenge to play all the characters, I can focus on one solid build, and have fun with that, less stash management. I just think that GGG should separate Race mode from Story mode, to me, only the Challenge of the Champions, or Descent are fun, because is a content that you don't have regular access. As far as difficult bosses they are there for the thrill, it is not something that you just wing it and go for it, sure, if you are in standard and have enough portals you can beat almost any boss in the corrupted areas, but the idea is not that. The idea is to give you a new layer of challenge, so that you can learn to adapt your party/char to resolve the situation. Like I've said in a previous post, I almost never had a 5L (got one in the previous 4 month), never had a 6L, so trying to get a build from a website and follow it is stupid. Now playing and learning and planning, using the website passive tree, that's fun. And seeing good results in-game is much more fun. So far the reward is only the Challenge of defeating the boss, I guess having a great loot would an extra challenge, but I really don't like the idea of a boss loot table, which chances of specific items dropping, that would be boring, repeating a content over and over. And maybe that is a challenge of the end-game, I confess since I started exclusively on HC on closed beta, I have since migrated to SC, since I live in Brasil and my ping is 180-200ms, my game experience does not allow high risk play on HC, had some bad encounters with Vaal, and so on, and I was unable to "enjoy" the end-game, so I decided to go to SC to see if I could get there. And one thing I was wishing for, was for GGG to introduce some way to map on lower levels, I mean, mapping was always end-game only, and since you have to clear 3 times the game it would be fun to have some lower level maps to do in normal and cruel. This expansion solved that IMHO, creating map-like areas during the progression creates a change of pace, and a break on the repetition of farming area X until you can progress. Anyways a rambled a lot. TL;DR - Play the leagues - Don't worry about hoarding items/chars - Pretend that every 4 months you have a new game to play - Try other games from time to time, anything you do too much gets boring Hey Fabio, I like your thinking towards the game, it's a good way to look at it, and I believe that I mentioned earlier, I think that the game up until mapping has the most potential for fun. I also enjoyed racing and new leagues the most, inventory management is a pain and having everyone start fresh is fun. As for your comment about loot tables, I respectfully disagree, as people are already only farming Merveil and Piety for their orbs. Adding loot tables would help break that up, and you have the choice to farm those bosses if the loot interested you, as you could just as easily skip it. And while I agree with you on the difficulty, the bosses shouldn't be easier or able to be cheesed out, they are through various methods, and often are imbalanced. The bosses that have cool mechanics are fun, but often non-accessible due to the quality of dropped items. For instance, the fight against Queen Atziri has a lot of attacks that are avoidable but highly punishing if you get hit by them. This is great! However, you have to have such immense crazy stats from doing stale content for a chance to even see that fight. If you're going in with less than 9,000 hit points and full fire resist, you are guaranteed to die on her, this is where the issue lies, stat bloat and being one shot. As for " fabio wrote: - Try other games from time to time, anything you do too much gets boring I completely agree, I was hoping this expansion would pull me in, but it happened to do the opposite. I would just like the fun parts of this game, not struggle with the luck or imbalanced content. Guide - How To Get Started in Path of Exile - https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1297390 My Feedback Analysis Thread - https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1270724 Last edited by Jaxxxson#4420 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:42:57 PM	Posted by Jaxxxson#4420 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:42:42 PM Quote this Post
" Veta321 wrote: Loot tables for bosses and uniques are a good idea. It allows non-trading and casual players to focus their energies on a target without resorting to trade while also giving players a sense of superficial control (something POE lacks and is a source of much consternation). Interestingly this is exactly what the Atziri fight is, if only for a small subset of exceptionally powerful uniques. It does make one wonder whether GGG has a plan like this in their greater agenda, without the exclusivity card the Atziri uniques carry. Have you made a cool build using The Coming Calamity? Let me know! Last edited by ephetat#3689 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:55:25 PM	Posted by ephetat#3689 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:54:26 PM Quote this Post
" jaxxxson wrote: " fabio wrote: I think the problem here is a sense of ownership... You have to take 2 things into account, the 4 month leagues and the permanent leagues... To me the game is focused towards this new leagues. It is always a fresh start with a fixed ending date... ...that great unique item or excellent rare set you got on your OP build is going to be merged to a permanent league and than another cool league will start which will have new mechanics... The point is, the idea is, to play on the new leagues, to value the time spent enjoying getting through the content, and the only caveat is that your stuff goes to the parent league when it ends, so that you can hoard your items... I sincerely enjoy the new races from scratch, inventory management is too painful when merging the items from other leagues, so much that I have stopped, I probably have a billion items stored that I will never use... like I've said before, either the ability to vendor directly from stash or the ability to delete a remove only tab that is not empty would be nice. I myself tend not to trade a lot, since I have a group of friends, we made a guild and share the good loots, unique includes. And since this time there's no challenge to play all the characters, I can focus on one solid build, and have fun with that, less stash management. I just think that GGG should separate Race mode from Story mode, to me, only the Challenge of the Champions, or Descent are fun, because is a content that you don't have regular access. As far as difficult bosses they are there for the thrill, it is not something that you just wing it and go for it, sure, if you are in standard and have enough portals you can beat almost any boss in the corrupted areas, but the idea is not that. The idea is to give you a new layer of challenge, so that you can learn to adapt your party/char to resolve the situation. Like I've said in a previous post, I almost never had a 5L (got one in the previous 4 month), never had a 6L, so trying to get a build from a website and follow it is stupid. Now playing and learning and planning, using the website passive tree, that's fun. And seeing good results in-game is much more fun. So far the reward is only the Challenge of defeating the boss, I guess having a great loot would an extra challenge, but I really don't like the idea of a boss loot table, which chances of specific items dropping, that would be boring, repeating a content over and over. And maybe that is a challenge of the end-game, I confess since I started exclusively on HC on closed beta, I have since migrated to SC, since I live in Brasil and my ping is 180-200ms, my game experience does not allow high risk play on HC, had some bad encounters with Vaal, and so on, and I was unable to "enjoy" the end-game, so I decided to go to SC to see if I could get there. And one thing I was wishing for, was for GGG to introduce some way to map on lower levels, I mean, mapping was always end-game only, and since you have to clear 3 times the game it would be fun to have some lower level maps to do in normal and cruel. This expansion solved that IMHO, creating map-like areas during the progression creates a change of pace, and a break on the repetition of farming area X until you can progress. Anyways a rambled a lot. TL;DR - Play the leagues - Don't worry about hoarding items/chars - Pretend that every 4 months you have a new game to play - Try other games from time to time, anything you do too much gets boring Hey Fabio, I like your thinking towards the game, it's a good way to look at it, and I believe that I mentioned earlier, I think that the game up until mapping has the most potential for fun. I also enjoyed racing and new leagues the most, inventory management is a pain and having everyone start fresh is fun. As for your comment about loot tables, I respectfully disagree, as people are already only farming Merveil and Piety for their orbs. Adding loot tables would help break that up, and you have the choice to farm those bosses if the loot interested you, as you could just as easily skip it. And while I agree with you on the difficulty, the bosses shouldn't be easier or able to be cheesed out, they are through various methods, and often are imbalanced. The bosses that have cool mechanics are fun, but often non-accessible due to the quality of dropped items. For instance, the fight against Queen Atziri has a lot of attacks that are avoidable but highly punishing if you get hit by them. This is great! However, you have to have such immense crazy stats from doing stale content for a chance to even see that fight. If you're going in with less than 9,000 hit points and full fire resist, you are guaranteed to die on her, this is where the issue lies, stat bloat and being one shot. As for " fabio wrote: - Try other games from time to time, anything you do too much gets boring I completely agree, I was hoping this expansion would pull me in, but it happened to do the opposite. I would just like the fun parts of this game, not struggle with the luck or imbalanced content. Jaxxsson, Maybe the next time, instead of playing to win, try playing for fun... ...I mean, make a fun stupid build, just for the heck, maybe not to get to merciless, just for fun with friends. Heck if you add me ingame I would play with you, if our hours match that is... Dunno make a shockwave totem build... ahuahauha I would like to see that work... A group of friends make a discharge build with conduit for fun and go blasting monsters with never-ending charges... What I've yet to do is try the PvP content, lag normally kills this mode of play for me, since the guy with 50ms ping has 3 attacks on me before I can react on a 180-200ms ping, but I dunno maybe it will be fun. Maybe you could play on the Cut throat content that is coming in the next couple of weeks. Look at my current char, it is a Witch, that uses Ice Nova, I stand in the middle of packs and keep freezing them, for party play is good enough since I help stop dmg to other players, and in solo play the dmg is good enough to kill most monsters, it is not a perfect build, but it is a fun build, which I made in the other league, trying to go for CI, and never got there. This time I've invested in life + eldritch battery and it is going well. I am currently playing on the Ambush league, hope to play a little bit on the Invasion league as well, with a beefier lag-resistant character.	Posted by fabio#5933 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:55:27 PM Quote this Post
" ephetat wrote: Interestingly this is exactly what the Atziri fight is, if only for a small subset of exceptionally powerful uniques. It does make one wonder whether GGG has a plan like this in their greater agenda, without the exclusivity card the Atziri uniques carry. Yup, good point. Some positive feedback may encourage them to take it further. Want to Fix the Economy, Bad Loot, Trade and Legacy PvP? pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/548056 Open Letter to Qarl on Crafting Value pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/805434 Biggest Problem with Mapping: Inconsistent Risk to Reward pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/612507 Last edited by Veta321#3815 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:59:35 PM	Posted by Veta321#3815 on Mar 11, 2014, 1:58:29 PM Quote this Post
" ephetat wrote: " Veta321 wrote: Loot tables for bosses and uniques are a good idea. It allows non-trading and casual players to focus their energies on a target without resorting to trade while also giving players a sense of superficial control (something POE lacks and is a source of much consternation). Interestingly this is exactly what the Atziri fight is, if only for a small subset of exceptionally powerful uniques. It does make one wonder whether GGG has a plan like this in their greater agenda, without the exclusivity card the Atziri uniques carry. Need to stress the exclusivity aspect here though. So far nobody on the new leagues has beat her at all and probably only a handfull of people will till the end of the 4 months. So I really hope they expand this idea of loot tables to the rest of the game and stop catering to a handful of players only. @OP, very nice thread. Sums up most of the biggest problems the game has rather well. " Fabio wrote: Maybe the next time, instead of playing to win, try playing for fun... There are just different types of players. Power gamers need to win to have fun. ARPGs kind of cater to them perfectly. You cannot just force someone to have fun in different ways. There is some rather well thought out articles on the net about different playertypes and the collisions between them in online games, which sum this up perfectly. I am too lazy to find them right now though :P	Posted by Burgingham#3085 on Mar 11, 2014, 2:03:58 PM Quote this Post