Evelyus' tourbilol tank || Tank 40K DPS || Video

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Evelyus wrote:
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love the 2 new videos you added

you dont need an ev / es chest, get an es chest. Then you dont need to buy a mirror

the armor you lose is insignificant imo

and you can perhaps modify tree a bit and take amplify nodes, to solve the carcass jack aoe issue.

Also, ES helm and dream fragments would be crazy, 9k ES at level 90? but alphas howl too strong, 700 evasion and +2 auras :/

Also, try get jade of reflx and granite of iron skin flasks, because 2x reflex or 2x iron skin dont stack, but reflex and iron skin stack and thats where the 100k armor comes from. Its just cool to have anyway, even if you might never need that much. lol

Let me know what you think


Thanks for video, was funny to face tanking double dominus.

Without Eva on my chest, I lose 4.6K armor, so 184 ES regen per block.
I can't reach +16/20% AOE on the tree, shortest way for that (except 12% on spawn of Scion, but I don't think it's enougth) need 7 point, 7 points ... What do I lose in tree? 10% block? or 10K armor? or 800 ES?
I can't optimize it (for 20% AOE) without losing important things.

So far the only "optimisation" I can see is losing 2% block and 20% "defense from equiped shield" to win 1 passive point.



So, the only wait for me without Carcass Jack, it's use infernal blow. For that you need RRRRRG ... find that on a Eva/es, harder on pure ES armor ... GL. Castablanca use RRRRRG.

ES Helm, can't, 8% mana reserve, 4.6K armor (on my build), +2 lvl for 3 auras, can't be frozen, 25% chance avoid chilled ... this helmet is completly OP.
And dream fragment = -1 ring. For my build, this ring just give "cannot be frozen" ... I lose strength (I need it for Determination), ES, Evasion, res, intel, no dream fragment, I can't.




Some very valid points you raise, but we could consider some things

(1) Yes to get amplify its a lot of points and you sacrifice important things, I agree 100%. That would be a bad idea. I didnt know there is the 12% aoe in scion part of tree. Yes, *I think* it should be enough. Some players even use conc effect without +aoe ... its all playstyle preference though.

Question ... you were planning on change to Infernal blow or not run conc effect if you get that mirror chest?

(2) 184 refresh out of 1400 is not that much. (arguably and in my opinion) And your armor will increase as you go up. For really tough situations if your ES drops fast after a bad rng string of no blocking , you have the crazy armor we talked about using jade and granite flasks. From the videos I watched, it doesnt seem you like to use flasks at all, even when your ES drops to very low.

(3) 8% mana reserve ... for 3 points, there is 13% to be had in total that you left out(5% scion area, 4% x 2 templar area). The most important thing that I see when I look at aplhas howl is the CBF. Chilled avoidance 25% is low, it still happens a lot with it. The other problem is the evasion loss from alphas howl ... you could try without it, see how the refresh is still good or not. And again, the armor will increase as you level.

(4) The things you lose from that ring, mainly str and res, can be made up on a good helm, and a different belt. Yes, you lose some int and +ES but since we get so much base ES on helm and chest, the ES gains will be huge anyway and nothing is lost in terms of ES. It really leaves resists and str. This build can cap resists easy. And for str, between level 17 and 20 determination its 3% ... I wouldnt fuss and call it must have.

(5) With these changes, (ES chest and helm) we are getting TONS more ES anyway, so more sustain big damage spikes and more ES leeched per second from ghost reaver, too, because the 20% cap is now bigger with 8k ES+.

Ultimately, I am not telling you what to do. The build is pretty damn good as it is. And its your build, so you do what you want. I am just trying to optimise it. I think getting more ES ... and lots more of it, is always good :)
Last edited by theamazingjojo on January 1, 2014 10:55 PM
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Some very valid points you raise, but we could consider some things

(1) Yes to get amplify its a lot of points and you sacrifice important things, I agree 100%. That would be a bad idea. I didnt know there is the 12% aoe in scion part of tree. Yes, *I think* it should be enough. Some players even use conc effect without +aoe ... its all playstyle preference though.

Question ... you were planning on change to Infernal blow or not run conc effect if you get that mirror chest?

(2) 184 refresh out of 1400 is not that much. (arguably and in my opinion) And your armor will increase as you go up. For really tough situations if your ES drops fast after a bad rng string of no blocking , you have the crazy armor we talked about using jade and granite flasks. From the videos I watched, it doesnt seem you like to use flasks at all, even when your ES drops to very low.

(3) 8% mana reserve ... for 3 points, there is 13% to be had in total that you left out(5% scion area, 4% x 2 templar area). The most important thing that I see when I look at aplhas howl is the CBF. Chilled avoidance 25% is low, it still happens a lot with it. The other problem is the evasion loss from alphas howl ... you could try without it, see how the refresh is still good or not. And again, the armor will increase as you level.

(4) The things you lose from that ring, mainly str and res, can be made up on a good helm, and a different belt. Yes, you lose some int and +ES but since we get so much base ES on helm and chest, the ES gains will be huge anyway and nothing is lost in terms of ES. It really leaves resists and str. This build can cap resists easy. And for str, between level 17 and 20 determination its 3% ... I wouldnt fuss and call it must have.

(5) With these changes, (ES chest and helm) we are getting TONS more ES anyway, so more sustain big damage spikes and more ES leeched per second from ghost reaver, too, because the 20% cap is now bigger with 8k ES+.

Ultimately, I am not telling you what to do. The build is pretty damn good as it is. And its your build, so you do what you want. I am just trying to optimise it. I think getting more ES ... and lots more of it, is always good :)



1 :

I tried infernal blow, I do prety bad damage (probably cause my 75% accuracy ..), forbidden infernal blow.
I tried with a Tabula Rasa, Cyclone without Concentrated Effect and with WED, I reach 3.5K tooltip, with 20/20 gems, I think reach 4.3K.
So, RRRRGG.

I must try with +12% AOE of Scion spawn, concentrated effect and no Carcass, but it's 4 point ...

Ya, I know some players use concentrated effect on cyclone without + AOE ... but me I don't love take an AOE skill and hit monster 1 per 1 ...

So, I need again a lot of try to be sure about my final gems.

Maybe castablanca's armor in RRRRGG, and use only this armor for crazy are boss with cyclone + WED, and keep my Carcass (I need it for my Shadow Reave) for more DPS in Cyclone + Concentrated Effect.


2:

I don't need flask (except dispel shock), my jade flask is just a "panic button", press it and instant refull all your ES in 1/2 block block.


3 :

Yes, I can take reserve on tree ... it's 2 more point (I'll take 5% near of scion to can cast 3 x 60% + 1 x 40% + 1 x 25%, like it reach 72% block with tempest).

I can't lost Alpha howl + Eva on chest, it's 9/10K armor lost.

4:

Ya, more ES is a really good idea, but I can't lose Alpha howl the 8% reserve is really usefull, and I'll can't cast 40% + 25% except if I take 2 more reservation node .. 2 points ... again.


5 :

Ya, i know, a really good ES chest could be very good ... but again, actually I've 7 exa ...


No problem wanna optimise that build ... but I can't buy ton of stuff to test, I'm really poor.

I try (in eternal lab) with a 288 ES helmet, I lose my capacity to cast a 40% aura, so it's very bad ... need 2 point to counter that, can maybe win 1 point with the optimisation i said in my previous post.

I reach 5.9K ES, win 800 ES. But I down to 33K armor, I lose 7K, so 280 ES regen per block.
And 300+ ES helmet, with strength and resist ... don't exist, they all want intel ... or it's mirror service.

This build can reach 9K ES and 50K armor if you have 2 mirror, but I don't.

For example, this helmet could me so crazy : http://poe.xyz.is/search/eonokamkoriniw

Edit : A lvl 17 Determination, was a good idea, I can win 1 ring, or 1 passive point with that. (I take the passive point, cause I don't have better ring/helmet combo)

Last edited by Evelyus on January 2, 2014 7:13 AM
I was also thinking along the line of "why not go CI for an Aegis build?" but haven't started one yet. Will study your guide more :)

Ty
IGN: _UlteaR_
Yeah I know you dont need the flasks most of the time, I really like +10 max res on topaz / ruby flask though hehe ... and on -max with boss its great. I dont use topaz just for remove shock :)

You are heavily overcapped on resists without them rings, even though I know you have purity with ~50% aura effect in the screenshot. With -max or ele weakness, you got flasks and purity / specific element purity.

The moonstone ring would be the best to lose. Cold res - no problem, +es / int - we gain much more ES with swap so no problem, str - as discussed no problem, evasion - is not that much really.

280 ES is around 15% of your refresh, its quite a bit. But I have seen life build (dragons) do crazy maps and bosses with 800 / sec total, and you have 1600+. These things have to be tested though, to see how they are in practice. As for the theory, get ready for wall of text lol:-
Spoiler

Your armor at around level 90 without any flasks:

~300 base (40 and 3/lvl)
22 grace 2166 and all aura / buff nodes x 1.91 = 4137
helm 743
rings 273
chest 775
gloves 366

armor shield 438 x 1.75 = 766

114% armor only increase
274% evasion increase

22 determination 53% and all aura / buff nodes x 1.91 = 101% more

evasion 6594 x 3.74 x 2.01 = 49,569
armor 766 x 2.14 x 2.01 = 3294

52863 armor = 2114 ES refresh


Your armor at around level 90 after removing moonstone ring and alpha howl, with level 17 determination and level 20 grace, without any flasks:


~300 base (40 and 3/lvl)
20 grace 2016 and all aura / buff nodes x 1.91 = 3850
ruby ring 124
chest 775
gloves 366

armor shield 438 x 1.75 = 766

114% armor only increase
274% evasion increase

17 determination 48% and all aura / buff nodes x 1.91 = 91% more

evasion 5415 x 3.74 x 1.91 = 38,681
armor 766 x 2.14 x 1.91 = 3130

41811 armor = 1672 ES refresh

This is assuming ES helmet, with EV / ES helmet, say 300 EV another ~ 2k armor for 80/second refresh. I wouldnt bother with EV / ES helmet either.


You could also try without cannot be frozen - test it for a while. I know some players who can do CI with just remove freeze flask.

Really, all you need is those 2 points into 4% reserve nodes and DF and an ES or ES / EV helm. No str, no resists, int would be nice but not needed.

So in summary, all it comes down to is

-1500ish refresh vs 2000ish refresh (25% loss, BUT remember 1500 is already huge and for the tough boss fights, flasks ... and more ES = more sustain and leech).
-you can theoretically lose cannot be frozen, if you dont want dream fragments and you test it out and see its ok without it.
-ES gain, I will spare you the full math so not another wall of text, but at level 90 its like this, after taking into account loss of ring and +2 discipline, that is +77ES and 9% ES going from 334int to 289 int (45 / 5 = 9):-

ES now = 5438
ES with 400 ES helm = 6402, and 6700 with 500 ES helm

1k ES gain is quite huge, its good vs fights like - max piety / dominus and that crazy torture chamber boss whose laser attack cannot be blocked.

One last thing:-

Without EV on the chest as well, thats ~220 ES per second loss from losing the armor, with second example around 1450 ES / block ... still a real lot!

ES with new helm and new 700+ ES chest = 8300 O_O


I feel like I am bothering you tho, let me know if its so ^^ Really, I can be a pest I know, but I just like your build a lot and want to see it with 7k ES and just tanking -max extra dmg shrine, courtyard, palace etc, lol ^^

Oh, and yes 'extra cast / attack speed' and 'extra monster damage' or 'extra dmg as fire / cold / lightning' still work on bosses in maps :)
Last edited by theamazingjojo on January 2, 2014 9:32 AM
"
0nlyl0vE wrote:
I was also thinking along the line of "why not go CI for an Aegis build?" but haven't started one yet. Will study your guide more :)

Ty


Thanks guy, good luck for your build :p.



"
Yeah I know you dont need the flasks most of the time, I really like +10 max res on topaz / ruby flask though hehe ... and on -max with boss its great. I dont use topaz just for remove shock :)

You are heavily overcapped on resists without them rings, even though I know you have purity with ~50% aura effect in the screenshot. With -max or ele weakness, you got flasks and purity / specific element purity.

The moonstone ring would be the best to lose. Cold res - no problem, +es / int - we gain much more ES with swap so no problem, str - as discussed no problem, evasion - is not that much really.

280 ES is around 15% of your refresh, its quite a bit. But I have seen life build (dragons) do crazy maps and bosses with 800 / sec total, and you have 1600+. These things have to be tested though, to see how they are in practice. As for the theory, get ready for wall of text lol:-
Spoiler

Your armor at around level 90 without any flasks:

~300 base (40 and 3/lvl)
22 grace 2166 and all aura / buff nodes x 1.91 = 4137
helm 743
rings 273
chest 775
gloves 366

armor shield 438 x 1.75 = 766

114% armor only increase
274% evasion increase

22 determination 53% and all aura / buff nodes x 1.91 = 101% more

evasion 6594 x 3.74 x 2.01 = 49,569
armor 766 x 2.14 x 2.01 = 3294

52863 armor = 2114 ES refresh


Your armor at around level 90 after removing moonstone ring and alpha howl, with level 17 determination and level 20 grace, without any flasks:


~300 base (40 and 3/lvl)
20 grace 2016 and all aura / buff nodes x 1.91 = 3850
ruby ring 124
chest 775
gloves 366

armor shield 438 x 1.75 = 766

114% armor only increase
274% evasion increase

17 determination 48% and all aura / buff nodes x 1.91 = 91% more

evasion 5415 x 3.74 x 1.91 = 38,681
armor 766 x 2.14 x 1.91 = 3130

41811 armor = 1672 ES refresh

This is assuming ES helmet, with EV / ES helmet, say 300 EV another ~ 2k armor for 80/second refresh. I wouldnt bother with EV / ES helmet either.


You could also try without cannot be frozen - test it for a while. I know some players who can do CI with just remove freeze flask.

Really, all you need is those 2 points into 4% reserve nodes and DF and an ES or ES / EV helm. No str, no resists, int would be nice but not needed.

So in summary, all it comes down to is

-1500ish refresh vs 2000ish refresh (25% loss, BUT remember 1500 is already huge and for the tough boss fights, flasks ... and more ES = more sustain and leech).
-you can theoretically lose cannot be frozen, if you dont want dream fragments and you test it out and see its ok without it.
-ES gain, I will spare you the full math so not another wall of text, but at level 90 its like this, after taking into account loss of ring and +2 discipline, that is +77ES and 9% ES going from 334int to 289 int (45 / 5 = 9):-

ES now = 5438
ES with 400 ES helm = 6402, and 6700 with 500 ES helm

1k ES gain is quite huge, its good vs fights like - max piety / dominus and that crazy torture chamber boss whose laser attack cannot be blocked.

One last thing:-

Without EV on the chest as well, thats ~220 ES per second loss from losing the armor, with second example around 1450 ES / block ... still a real lot!

ES with new helm and new 700+ ES chest = 8300 O_O


I feel like I am bothering you tho, let me know if its so ^^ Really, I can be a pest I know, but I just like your build a lot and want to see it with 7k ES and just tanking -max extra dmg shrine, courtyard, palace etc, lol ^^

Oh, and yes 'extra cast / attack speed' and 'extra monster damage' or 'extra dmg as fire / cold / lightning' still work on bosses in maps :)


For start : "I can be a pest I know", yes, I know, few friends warned me about that. But you want make this build better, I want too, but you must understand that : your ideas are very good, and I think it'll make the build really better with an eva/ES helmet + a 600+ eva and 600+ ES armor ... but actually I can't test that, I can't buy that, I've 7 ex ...

I wanna reach 7/8K ES, but for that I need big items ... and i can't buy it actually ... if you want give me 2 mirror of kalandra, no problem :p.

With 7/8K ES, I don't think be frozen is really bad ... my survivability isn't base on my attack :p.
Just maybe keep a Dream Fragment in stash for -max res + extra cold damage maps.
And without purity of cold, I've 80% cold res (aegis aurora), only extra cold damage isn't a big problem.

So, I think this Helmet could be so op http://poe.xyz.is/search/eonokamkoriniw with castablance's armor, with this 2 items I think reach 9K ES ... but it's 2 mirror + 2 fee cost.

Edit : I think reach this build at lvl 94


If I find good stuff eva/es, I'll use 2 point in 8% mana reserve before RT and elemental adaptation.

But, I don't think found 1/2 mirror before my lvl 100 ...
Last edited by Evelyus on January 2, 2014 10:16 AM
You dont need ev on helm or chest though or resists on them, since you are capped without the ring and you will have 1400 ES per block, which is crazy enough. Its why I did all that math, I thought you would read it at least. Going for mirror items is of course setting the bar very high, they are nice but not needed imo.

Good luck with your build anyway, I must *really* quit posting now, lol
Last edited by theamazingjojo on January 2, 2014 11:13 AM
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You dont need ev on helm or chest though or resists on them, since you are capped without the ring and you will have 1400 ES per block, which is crazy enough. Its why I did all that math, I thought you would read it at least. Going for mirror items is of course setting the bar very high, they are nice but not needed imo.

Good luck with your build anyway, I must *really* quit posting now, lol


I read your post. But I wanna max armor possible.

And it's same problem, with a pure ES armor ... in 6L in 700+, it's a lot of ex, probably 70+. And another problem on a pure ES, I need 5 or 6 off color (with/without concentrated effect) ... on a eva/es, it's 3/4 off color (with/without concentrated effect), it's easier. To take 6 off (GGRRRR) on a pure ES armor ... GL, 4 off will be so hard ... 6 I can't imagine.

Really thanks for help me on this build, you have really good idea, but I can't buy it :/.

Stay look my video and wait upgrade of the build with time :p.

I'll post a funny video ... afk on dominus residence with 81% extra fire + ele weakness :p.
Hello Evelyus,

ic your passive skill lvl 58 and u turn on CI without any regen and any life steel how it work?

is that right?

how much energy shield i need to active CI? and regen and life steel?
"
xarcopian wrote:
Hello Evelyus,

ic your passive skill lvl 58 and u turn on CI without any regen and any life steel how it work?

is that right?

how much energy shield i need to active CI? and regen and life steel?


Hi, I used life leech gem with Ghost Reaver. I had a good chest and gloves, so I reached 2.5K ES at lvl 60.

At lvl 62, you can take Aegis Aurora + Carcass Jack, all survivability (except few leech from blood rage) is on Aegis Aurora.

Do you understand how Aegis work?

But if you haven't good ES stuff at lvl 58, don't take CI. It's a guide, but you don't must follow it without think. Don't take CI point it yo uhave total 500 real ES :p. Wait your good ES items to switch.

I think carcass + aegis is enougth to start CI, so wait lvl 62 ;).

I'm probably change it in guide, it's true, change to CI at lvl 62 is better cause you have carcass and aegis.
Last edited by Evelyus on January 2, 2014 6:33 PM
very nice build.

slow clear? i don't think so. put on dominating blow + ms + splash + inc duration.

with soul taker, dominating blow massive mana cost is not a problem. Would be much faster for clear speed, and safer.

try it out and see how it goes
ign: Pandartt

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