Pros and Cons - Death Penalty

...you know that we're not really SUPPOSED TO die, right?

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Wladicorist1 wrote:

of course im going to die lol

It was your decision to play a glass cannon, so stop bitching. [Removed by Support]

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Wladicorist1 wrote:

of course im going to die lol
but if i have to play every single build on defenses then the game has a problem in its balances ...

No, it doesn't. There's a huge difference between getting 20-30% damage reduction and getting 90%, and the former can be expected from any player without issues.

Every single build needs a minimum of defences to survive a single hit in order to not die, and punishing people for denying this is alright.

If you play well enough to never be hit at all, ever, then running around with no mitigation is not a problem. If you're aware that what you're playing is a glass cannon and are fine with the repurcussions including the occasional death and resulting penalty, there are no issues.

However, when you refuse to take options that are available to you for no other reason than a notion that it shouldn't be necessary, you really can't blame the game.

I play glass cannons all the time, and I do die regularly. Some people check their deaths in videos about meme builds and they still have fewer deaths than most of my characters at that level. But I have never gotten the idea that somehow something or someone else was responsible for this.

I can't evade all the damage -> I'm the one who failed evading all the damage. I don't say "well, the game shouldn't have hit me that hard".

Of all the boss fights in the game, Act 10 Kitava (and its map equivalent, wherever that was, Lava Lake, I think?) is the worst telegraphed, I believe, and I still haven't figured out how to do it deathlessly. I honestly think the fight could be made easier to understand, but countless HC players prove that it's my mistakes that actually kill me. Or my laziness in researching and practicing the fight.

While I do think, that this fight in particular is not proportional to the difficulty of the rest of the game, I don't think I shouldn't lose exp if I die to it, or that my glass cannons should face tank it.

Use defense to survive is some kind of joke in this game. See your zombies, they have 20K HP and 2000+ hp/s regen but still fragile, especially in dangerous mods maps.

My 50K hp, 20k hp/s regen stone golem had even ever died several times in dangerous mods maps. (And ever got instantly killed by malformed Piety)

Even if you have very high defense, you're still probably one-shot or killed in 0.1 sec by multiple mobs hits or goddamned DoT in dangerous mods maps.

So, to level, glass canon or high defense bd is no difference -- just play like a coward, skip damage mods and skip dangerous bosses.

6 portals is penalty for death. Did you ever concern about exp lost for fighting uber elder? No, you just concern about numbers of remaining portals.

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smtad wrote:

Use defense to survive is some kind of joke in this game. See your zombies, they have 20K HP and 2000+ hp/s regen but still fragile, especially in dangerous mods maps.

My 50K hp, 20k hp/s regen stone golem had even ever died several times in dangerous mods maps. (And ever got instantly killed by malformed Piety)

Even if you have very high defense, you're still probably one-shot or killed in 0.1 sec by multiple mobs hits or goddamned DoT in dangerous mods maps.

So, to level, glass canon or high defense bd is no difference -- just play like a coward, skip damage mods and skip dangerous bosses.

6 portals is penalty for death. Did you ever concern about exp lost for fighting uber elder? No, you just concern about numbers of remaining portals.

*laughs in gladiator*

btw, you used examples of high hp (and not defense) minions as some sort of example of defense not making a difference. *facepalm*

Funny, my flame golem barely ever dies and I'm not even a summoner. Just flame golem + empower + minion life + minion and totem resists -- good to go for at least a map usually, which is far longer than he has to survive to be useful. And my totems, almost never die regardless of the map mod, and they don't boast more than 20k hp.

I'm not saying that there aren't dangerous one shot mechanics (there are), but defenses are extremely useful.

I wouldn't mind the death penalty nearly as much if it wasn't for all the one shot mechanics you simply cannot counter for.

Like what? A souped up Minotaur can hit me for like 8k damage which barely brings me down below 5k ES? Shaper slams which are usually very easy to gear for because Shaper doesn't have map mods? What one shots are you talking about? Of course in delve things are different as they should be.

That said Malachai's one shots are indeed something that I think cant be countered, they simply deal too much damage.

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philosoaper wrote:

I wouldn't mind the death penalty nearly as much if it wasn't for all the one shot mechanics you simply cannot counter for.

...such as?

The 'make build that doesn't die and learn to play' argument in my opinion just derails the topic -if you are so f*cking keen on doing that, why not go play HC?

Oh, that's right! Because instead of go play which mode they want, people come bitching to SC players that SC players essentially do not want to play HC leagues on level 95+ either any more than before reaching those levels. This is where HC players believe they are entitled to have the whole game balanced around their chosen mode.

The reason I referred to rules changing after level 95+ is that essentially anyone wanting to get those last levels need to play the game as if they were playing HC mode. That's pretty much a fact. Don't go derailing topic with all the 'git gut' or 'get better defenses' arguments there. People don't want to play HC, that is why they didn't choose HC button on the starting screen.