[3.17] Beerleague's Shockwave Cyclone Slayer - Optimized with Options

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Sleeya wrote:

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Bigböss wrote:

Hey,

Just trying this build out at the moment, but one thing in particular confuses me. In terms of belts, you favour an elder leather belt for the "increased melee damage during flask effect", effectively choosing to not have a vise with "adds phys damage" jewel in it. However, for rings you say that steel rings are the best. I find this odd, as I do believe an elder iron ring with "increased melee damage" would yield a higher dps increase than a steel ring. I cannot test this myself yet as my toon is still not fully geared, but I checked it in your PoB and it does in fact increase your dps.

2h physical damage builds scale way better from % increased phys dmg than flat phys dmg.

Steel rings in general are quite a minor upgrade,i believe my tooltip moved by 3k ingame per steel ring.
Not sure about the increased melee dmg scaling, Flashback league was too short for me to even begin to consider such elder items :)

Hi,

Yeah, I agree, and that's exactly my point. I believe an elder ring with %melee damage is better than steel rings. Speaking of belts, I actually managed to chaos spam my way to an elder leather belt with %melee damage and %attack speed during flask effect. It's pretty cool :)

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Bigböss wrote:

Hey,

Just trying this build out at the moment, but one thing in particular confuses me. In terms of belts, you favour an elder leather belt for the "increased melee damage during flask effect", effectively choosing to not have a vise with "adds phys damage" jewel in it.

OP is probably satisfied with his endgame dps that he probably prefers to invest in some defense with life recovery and faster leech. And unless you're rich enough to buy an elder stygian, leather belt's the alternative. Unless you want to be a dps warrior and stick with a normal stygian. It's player preference I guess.

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Bigböss wrote:

Hey,

However, for rings you say that steel rings are the best. I find this odd, as I do believe an elder iron ring with "increased melee damage" would yield a higher dps increase than a steel ring. I cannot test this myself yet as my toon is still not fully geared, but I checked it in your PoB and it does in fact increase your dps.

Things like this isn't always the obvious choice nor black and white. You also have to look at it from cost to performance. With elder bases being the new and "in" thing compared to regular steel rings, is it really worth paying an absurd amount for a 5k dps increase compared to a nicely rolled steel?

Also, the elder mod "inc. melee damage %" is a suffix. Cyclone builds require intelligence from conc effect. Not only that, if you look at beer league's character, his resistances are very tight so he needs resists on his rings. If you can fit the elder mod in with your gear, of course it would be BIS from a min max perspective. But like I said, it's not always black and white nor straightfoward. We'd all love to stack offensive mods on builds with the elder bases out, but that is simply not possible. You have to pick and choose.

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illmtk wrote:

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Bigböss wrote:

Hey,

Just trying this build out at the moment, but one thing in particular confuses me. In terms of belts, you favour an elder leather belt for the "increased melee damage during flask effect", effectively choosing to not have a vise with "adds phys damage" jewel in it.

OP is probably satisfied with his endgame dps that he probably prefers to invest in some defense with life recovery and faster leech. And unless you're rich enough to buy an elder stygian, leather belt's the alternative. Unless you want to be a dps warrior and stick with a normal stygian. It's player preference I guess.

I only mentioned the belt to make my point about the rings. I agree with the choice of belts. Although I dont think what you say about investing in life recovery is correct, as the build uses vaal pact. In fact, if it was about going defensive, I believe another belt with high life and res would be a much better choice. The elder belt is about the %melee dmg.

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Bigböss wrote:

Hey,

However, for rings you say that steel rings are the best. I find this odd, as I do believe an elder iron ring with "increased melee damage" would yield a higher dps increase than a steel ring. I cannot test this myself yet as my toon is still not fully geared, but I checked it in your PoB and it does in fact increase your dps.

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illmtk wrote:

Things like this isn't always the obvious choice nor black and white. You also have to look at it from cost to performance. With elder bases being the new and "in" thing compared to regular steel rings, is it really worth paying an absurd amount for a 5k dps increase compared to a nicely rolled steel?

Also, the elder mod "inc. melee damage %" is a suffix. Cyclone builds require intelligence from conc effect. Not only that, if you look at beer league's character, his resistances are very tight so he needs resists on his rings. If you can fit the elder mod in with your gear, of course it would be BIS from a min max perspective. But like I said, it's not always black and white nor straightfoward. We'd all love to stack offensive mods on builds with the elder bases out, but that is simply not possible. You have to pick and choose.

No need to get defensive. One of his steel rings barely even has resistance on it, so I doubt that is the case.
My point is that in the guide it says "steel is best", and I believe this to be wrong. At the very least, elder rings should be mentioned, no? Constructive criticism is good, I am not trying to insult anyone.

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Bigböss wrote:

I only mentioned the belt to make my point about the rings. I agree with the choice of belts. Although I dont think what you say about investing in life recovery is correct, as the build uses vaal pact. In fact, if it was about going defensive, I believe another belt with high life and res would be a much better choice. The elder belt is about the %melee dmg.

You realize the mod "%increased life recovery rate" affects not only regen, which obviously we dont have because of VP, but also leech and life flasks? And because this mod is hard to get anywhere else, if you can cap resists on your other slots, this is definitely the defensive mod you want to aim for. Also who said you can't spec into high life with this mod? Life recovery is a suffix, so you not only can get high life but max %life on your belt. You can also get % attack speed and melee damage for the two remaining mods. That is pretty much mirror worthy for phys based cyclone. The OP clearly min maxed his build so he can use %life recovery on his belt.

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Bigböss wrote:

No need to get defensive. One of his steel rings barely even has resistance on it, so I doubt that is the case.
My point is that in the guide it says "steel is best", and I believe this to be wrong. At the very least, elder rings should be mentioned, no? Constructive criticism is good, I am not trying to insult anyone.

Not being defensive and I don't care what OP said. I'm just merely giving my opinion for you to consider if paying an absurd amount for an elder iron ring is worth the cost compared to a steel just to get a 1% increase of dps? I don't think so. Is an elder base iron/steel ring something you should consider once you have all your gear and want to further min max? Sure why not if you really love this build.

And, you may say his ring barely has resistances on it. Well it's because he min maxed his build. He doesnt need to overcap his resists because he has an anticurse flask. His build is so tight he is forced to wear a two tone boots, which is unfortunate imo because I tend to favor the attack speed boot enchant.

No point arguing with you, can go back and forth till the end of time. I just think elder rings should be mentioned as a ring choice in the guide.

it is possible farm uber elder with this build ?
not just kill once or twice.
or just slayer will be more safe ?

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isimak wrote:

it is possible farm uber elder with this build ?
not just kill once or twice.
or just slayer will be more safe ?

Totally possible, although I still sometimes die to well timed combos from shaper/elder.
If you can find a way to use Kaom's Roots while still being capped on resistances it would be much more consistent.

As long as you can dodge shaper balls you're mostly safe (I can tank 1 or 2 but 3 is always death)

Thx for answer. :)
Last time i was zephri flask with poet pens. Now no flask as no perandus mode.
Looking for another safe build to farm uber elder:)

Sorry boys,

Took a break after finishing the last league. Can start to answer questions about the build again.

The ones that came up in the last week or so about the rings a belt:

Belt:

Life recovery is OP as hell. It works with VP. It is much better than having a vice with an extra gem socket. With that said, buying a belt like that is not always easy.

Rings:

Elder rings are good, but even a well rolled one (not steel) is barely better than a decent steel ring. Either way, IMO, if you have currency to burn, rings are not the slot you want to look at with this build. You can get pretty GG rings for 5-10ex and even spending 100+ isnt going to net you a crap ton more dps. Currency w/ this build should be blown on GG jewels, or alternatively, a super GG elder Astral Plate.

Great build and nice guide! I have some questions though.
1 - Do you know if arakaali vp bug is fixed?!
2 - Looks like monsters in incursion will do tons of chaos damage. if thats the case, do you think we can go tumbfist and bubonic trail ontop of the other uniques and still have high chaos res?
3 - What your thoughts on vaal and normal skills in one gems? gem set up stays the same with the vaal versions as well?
I know its a lot, sry about that. I wanna try this build this league and i'm wondering about those.

edit: one more thing i forgot, the enchant in gloves, war is the best one for this build?