Why Poe is becoming PAY TO WIN GAME - free discusion

This is the only F2P game where I have felt good about my purchases. I'm still a pretty *fresh* player with only 200 hours, and spent the $110 on the Challenger pack. Less than $1/playtime hour is generally my standard, and this game meets that. Whereas something like Doom, which is $60 (not hatin'), I got 10 hours out of (for now) which works out to $6/hr.

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This is the only F2P game where I have felt good about my purchases. I'm still a pretty *fresh* player with only 200 hours, and spent the $110 on the Challenger pack. Less than $1/playtime hour is generally my standard, and this game meets that. Whereas something like Doom, which is $60 (not hatin'), I got 10 hours out of (for now) which works out to $6/hr.

Not to derail this too hard, but I think you should also take into consideration the quality of those playtime hours. There are some games out there that I consider to be absolute masterpieces which yield a pretty high dollar/playtime ratio. SMW2: Yoshi's Island is widely considered to be one of the best platforming games of all time. Yet, even doing a 100% completion will barely get you into the ten hour mark. If I'm just to consider how long I played vs the money I spent on it (which at the time was a brand new game...) you'd come out of that equation thinking it was a terrible purchase.

But nothing could be further from the truth; it's a fucking fantastic game, and one of the most memorable experiences in a video game I've ever had.

POE may be a very cheap experience, but I truly wonder if (outside of racing) it's a worthwhile videogame experience, and not just something we all do to kill time. I feel the same about MMORPGs... just timesucks that really give you very little satisfaction in return.

Anyway, carry on

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Antnee wrote:

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This is the only F2P game where I have felt good about my purchases. I'm still a pretty *fresh* player with only 200 hours, and spent the $110 on the Challenger pack. Less than $1/playtime hour is generally my standard, and this game meets that. Whereas something like Doom, which is $60 (not hatin'), I got 10 hours out of (for now) which works out to $6/hr.

Not to derail this too hard, but I think you should also take into consideration the quality of those playtime hours. There are some games out there that I consider to be absolute masterpieces which yield a pretty high dollar/playtime ratio. SMW2: Yoshi's Island is widely considered to be one of the best platforming games of all time. Yet, even doing a 100% completion will barely get you into the ten hour mark. If I'm just to consider how long I played vs the money I spent on it (which at the time was a brand new game...) you'd come out of that equation thinking it was a terrible purchase.

But nothing could be further from the truth; it's a fucking fantastic game, and one of the most memorable experiences in a video game I've ever had.

POE may be a very cheap experience, but I truly wonder if (outside of racing) it's a worthwhile videogame experience, and not just something we all do to kill time. I feel the same about MMORPGs... just timesucks that really give you very little satisfaction in return.

Anyway, carry on

No, you're absolutely right and it's always a conversation worth having (and one that happens on plenty of the gaming podcasts I frequent). For me, subjectively, it typically ends up being 50/50 quality vs. quantity in terms of importance. I feel like POE hits the 50/50 mark pretty well which is why I, and I think many others, are drawn to this game. Both the quality of the game and the playtime you can get out of it is "good", not great/fantastic, but good. It strikes a nice balance, perhaps with the scale leaning more towards quantity.

Doom, on the other hand, was extremely high quality but low quantity. The high quality doesn't make me regret my purchase, however, the low quantity of content/potential play-hours has had a slight detriment on my view of the game because I value playtime/hr, perhaps more than some. Ideally we'd live in a world where a game has infinite playtime with high-quality gameplay, but that doesn't really happen too often.

A game that has come close to that, for me, is FFX. In the context of the time it was released, that game offered 100+ hours of content, fantastic story/visuals, etc. It still holds up today with the remaster as well. You can make the same case for Morrowind, Super Mario Maker or World, Half-Life 1/2(incl. engines), GTA, etc.

there's no power up your DPS its just costume

Wining in this game is defeating the economy and clearing all the content with your build that you've gotten every possible BIS for. Having more than 4 stash tabs is not a requirement for this.

When i start gaining real currency, there is no need for 1c tabs, they aren't worth the time it takes to sell them.

My definition of POE P2W:

I can't pay GGG for BIS gear
I can't pay GGG for my Ataziri run keys
I can't pay GGG for extra skill points/experience pots
I can't pay GGG for currency

Therefore, P2W is false, for me.

When players have access to programs like procurement and acquisition the premium tabs aren't nearly as pay to win as you're painting them. I used acquisition for like 1.5 years and never had an issue with logging in using sessionID. I have over 80 premium tabs and only a few of them are set public.

Why would I buy premium tabs if I am not going to sell from them? I bought them before that was even a feature of premium tabs so I could label them. It is convenient and easy to organize my shit when I can name/colour the tabs.

When I used acquisition before the premium tabs gained their functionality I still only had a few tabs that I used to trade from. I keep buying more tabs but my win amount has remained near constant. Why am I not winning more when I buy more tabs?

If you're not a hoarder, don't buy tabs. If you think the game isn't worth donating $20 to the devs, don't buy tabs. If you have to choose whether to feed your family or buying tabs, don't buy tabs!

If you like the game, play it all the time, run out of space to hold stuff, have $20 then go ahead and buy some points and pick up a premium tab bundle on sale and support the game and it's continued development.

I have question to people, who says that in POE we have no pay to win elements.

Do you think, that statement: "In POE we have no pay to get advantage elements" is true?

In other words: do you think, that you can't buy any real in game advantage over freeloaders by paying real money to ggg?

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Xalthotun wrote:

I have question to people, who says that in POE we have no pay to win elements.

Do you think, that statement: "In POE we have no pay to get advantage elements" is true?

In other words: do you think, that you can't buy any real in game advantage over freeloaders by paying real money to ggg?

Again... you're asking for an opinion on what "advantage" means. You can store more stuff if you buy tabs. But you can also have as many accounts as you wish, so there's more than enough storage on free accounts.

Define "advantage" and we might have a discussion.

The whole idea of P2W is subjective here... what's important is that they're "ethical". I think they are more than ethical. GGG has erred on the side of caution.

Imagine two players. Both equally good. One is freeloader, another pays for various game elements. If paying player progress faster, because he bought some game elements for real money, that's in my opinion means, that he bought advantage.

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SMW2: Yoshi's Island is widely considered to be one of the best platforming games of all time. Yet, even doing a 100% completion will barely get you into the ten hour mark. If I'm just to consider how long I played vs the money I spent on it (which at the time was a brand new game...) you'd come out of that equation thinking it was a terrible purchase.

But nothing could be further from the truth; it's a fucking fantastic game, and one of the most memorable experiences in a video game I've ever had.

Perandus ends today and Prophecy doesn't hit for half a week. That's plenty of time for everyone who reads this to play through Yoshi's Island, which I'd say is one of the best games ever made. It still holds up incredibly well.