Cast on Crit is degenerative.

Did anyone else see on Kripps stream yesterday it appeared that they are changing it from its current proc chance to 50% on crit?

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goetzjam wrote:

Did anyone else see on Kripps stream yesterday it appeared that they are changing it from its current proc chance to 50% on crit?

Mmmh naw didn't see it; All reddit says it hasn't been changed lol

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goetzjam wrote:

Did anyone else see on Kripps stream yesterday it appeared that they are changing it from its current proc chance to 50% on crit?

Mmmh naw didn't see it; All reddit says it hasn't been changed lol

Yeah it hasn't I haven't seen that gem being 1 in a long time so it looked "new" to me.

I also don't play that shit :D

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SuperMotte wrote:

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Fhark wrote:

^^ right and noone has yet given a proper example of a coc build that is op (eg coc spec throw seems worse then simply being a voltaxic ranger) aside from discharge, discharge coc and mjolner will already be nerfed harder by the 6% max res from flasks then many other builds (since they need to facetank a lot). Im not really sure of the need for a nerf but changing the crit chance of discharge to base 6% would be pretty substantial.

[Removed by Support]

It's not (only) about that CoC is currently overpowered but that it limits new (and old now nerfed versions of Flame Surge and Etheral Knives) spells to be fast casting with low damage (compared to old version Flame Surge and Etheral Knives).
As soon as you add a spell that's let's say deals 2000 damage per hit on level 20 without passives, gear and support but needs 2 seconds to cast it will be overpowered in a CoC build because they don't care about the cast time of 2 seconds because it's triggered.

GOT IT? Maybe? Probably getting ignored. Not like that it was already mentioned 50 times in this thread.

Spells could be introduced that cannot be supported by COC (similar to Ice Crash and Multistrike) If GGG wanted these high damage/low cast spells they would introduce them - it seems evident that they do not want these in the game at this point. Note: traps cannot be triggered by anything and they are also spells. Flame Surge and EK: these spells were nerf'd by the standard GGG knee-jerk nerf hammer and I agree it was not given sufficient thought.

Another path around it would be to add a lesser multiplier to COC so that high damage spells can be triggered quickly while not dealing too much damage.

GGG already lowered crti/crit multiplier several times and added a cool down to COC without fixing the issue so I think a new tactic is in order.

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GGG already lowered crti/crit multiplier several times and added a cool down to COC without fixing the issue so I think a new tactic is in order.

They literally are changing the scaling on crit multi, too early to tell but it should be a significant nerf.

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goetzjam wrote:

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GGG already lowered crti/crit multiplier several times and added a cool down to COC without fixing the issue so I think a new tactic is in order.

They literally are changing the scaling on crit multi, too early to tell but it should be a significant nerf.

what are they doing lol

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goetzjam wrote:

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GGG already lowered crti/crit multiplier several times and added a cool down to COC without fixing the issue so I think a new tactic is in order.

They literally are changing the scaling on crit multi, too early to tell but it should be a significant nerf.

what are they doing lol

I can't explain it, I just know some nodes on the tree are buffed in number wise, but something about makes it scale differently then it does now. Its likely also a pretty harsh nerf to legacy crit multi in the process as well.

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Dos_Fafner wrote:

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SuperMotte wrote:

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Fhark wrote:

^^ right and noone has yet given a proper example of a coc build that is op (eg coc spec throw seems worse then simply being a voltaxic ranger) aside from discharge, discharge coc and mjolner will already be nerfed harder by the 6% max res from flasks then many other builds (since they need to facetank a lot). Im not really sure of the need for a nerf but changing the crit chance of discharge to base 6% would be pretty substantial.

[Removed by Support]

It's not (only) about that CoC is currently overpowered but that it limits new (and old now nerfed versions of Flame Surge and Etheral Knives) spells to be fast casting with low damage (compared to old version Flame Surge and Etheral Knives).
As soon as you add a spell that's let's say deals 2000 damage per hit on level 20 without passives, gear and support but needs 2 seconds to cast it will be overpowered in a CoC build because they don't care about the cast time of 2 seconds because it's triggered.

GOT IT? Maybe? Probably getting ignored. Not like that it was already mentioned 50 times in this thread.

Spells could be introduced that cannot be supported by COC (similar to Ice Crash and Multistrike) If GGG wanted these high damage/low cast spells they would introduce them - it seems evident that they do not want these in the game at this point. Note: traps cannot be triggered by anything and they are also spells. Flame Surge and EK: these spells were nerf'd by the standard GGG knee-jerk nerf hammer and I agree it was not given sufficient thought.

Another path around it would be to add a lesser multiplier to COC so that high damage spells can be triggered quickly while not dealing too much damage.

GGG already lowered crti/crit multiplier several times and added a cool down to COC without fixing the issue so I think a new tactic is in order.

That would lessen other spells (fast and weak) ones equally => that doesn't really solve the problem.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

So overall, I agree game would be better without Cast on Crit around, at least the way it's designed currently. Perhaps some version which took cast speed (or perhaps mana cost) of spells into account, which would make CoC-supported attacks take longer for slow spells and faster for fast spells (or have prohibitively high mana costs for slow spells and more moderate mana costs for fast spells). But as it is now, it enables one very niche build type, while having a very negative influence on casters overall... and although it's nice to have cool builds in the game, creating stale play for a very common character archetype isn't the way to do it.

you make a good point here i personally lean towards that spells that are used through CoC should take your spell casting speed into consideration and most definitely not overlap with one another.

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agbudar wrote:

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

So overall, I agree game would be better without Cast on Crit around, at least the way it's designed currently. Perhaps some version which took cast speed (or perhaps mana cost) of spells into account, which would make CoC-supported attacks take longer for slow spells and faster for fast spells (or have prohibitively high mana costs for slow spells and more moderate mana costs for fast spells). But as it is now, it enables one very niche build type, while having a very negative influence on casters overall... and although it's nice to have cool builds in the game, creating stale play for a very common character archetype isn't the way to do it.

you make a good point here i personally lean towards that spells that are used through CoC should take your spell casting speed into consideration and most definitely not overlap with one another.

+1