The Downfall of Zombies and Spectres in late game

Does an aura summoner not have incredibly tanky minions anymore? I imagine with generosity you could easily get capped resists and a crapload of bonus ES and evasion for them. I haven't played a summoner since 0.9 so I'm way out of date though.

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lukeiy wrote:

Does an aura summoner not have incredibly tanky minions anymore? I imagine with generosity you could easily get capped resists and a crapload of bonus ES and evasion for them. I haven't played a summoner since 0.9 so I'm way out of date though.

Yes, its very tanky for the minions. Yet, they still die pretty much even with Necromantic Aegis in ultra end game maps.
Either you or the minions die.
Auramancer is still the prime build for summoner, yet they are still costly since most of the time it is a low life build. Moreover, Auramancer is also the one that unable to keep Zombies and Spectres alive much.
They still die in few big Elemental AOE dmg and got to avoid certain maps, unless the ultra end game maps like lvl77 or 78 have easy mods.

I have been running 3 prime survival Auras for my minions; Vitality, Discipline, Purity of Elements and Necromantic Aegis of Saffel frame. At this scenario, I also have Haste, Hatred and Flesh Offering. On top of there is lvl21 Zombie gem with lvl3 Empower on a +2 Minion Rare Helm, they still die like no tomorrow in every Map with high elemental AOE dmg boss.
Besides, its already an 120 exalts build which still fail in most high end maps, only to hope easy mods roll on those Map.

There is no other way for Auramancer to prevail unless with of course again and again, a 200 exalts build. No diversity, same build, same gears.

Given up on the same no brainer build, I regrets my passive and gearings for my own survivability and play up to lvl77 easy mod Maps, with no problem at current 140 exalts investment.
I left lvl4 Empower Gem for the no brainer build for Atziri viable and lvl78 Palace etc.

It seems summoners main mechanical flaw is that half way through a map/boss fight, 20%-70% of your dps can just "die". As far as I know, no other build can permanently lose large sources of their damage in the middle of a zone. If summoners had a variety of ways to keep their specters alive this would be a non issue, but short of beefing them up with a low life max aura build, there will usually be a point where you know your specters are about to die from near full health and there isn't diddly you can do about it, even with convocation.

Take piety for example (i am in no way insinuating that minions die allot on specifically piety it is just a fight i know everyone is familiar with) piety sends constant lighting balls and lightning storms at your minions, even those aimed at you or your zombies can still hit your specters half of the time, especially right after convocation. One stray lightning ball and badly placed lightning storm and your specters are dead. All a summoners can really do is keep them within aura range, maintain bone offering (if you run it) and prey.

This is the main reason people use Evangelists exclusively, as long as that shield is up they are far less likely to get bursted down by mass aoe, though the shields down time can be long enough for them to die regardless.

It has been suggested hundreds of times, but if specters were renewable mid map so many problems would be solved, it would fix the prep time summoners suffer from every time they log in (or DC), it would make long map runs and boss fights less reliant on simply your specters not dying, and would encourage a larger specter variety, instead of the near 100% Evangelist specters we see in any summoner that maps simply because they have the lowest chance of getting killed. ( the mana cost of raise specter would have to be raised to compensate and proximity shield would have to already be on cooldown when evangelists are summoned to prevent abuse, though i doubt this will ever be implemented anyway.)

^ And another issue being with necro aegis, generosity, and even basic stacking of auras themselves is that in trying to bulk up your minions not only will your own personal damage be reduced in most cases but your chances of surviving that massive damage screen wide AoE attack as well. Spend enough points in minions without taking care of yourself first and you may very well find yourself alone in facetanking a boss without damage or the ability to survive their attacks for long when you get unlucky and a screen wide AoE wipes all your minions off the field at once.

I ran 5 spectre build in ambush and it took long to raise em.
Desecrate helps alot but i dont give a sht about the plumed chimeral, stinking spiders, archivist and the other junk.

Just want evangelists


If they die on maps its basically end of story. Going to clear 70 maps with skellies? Not going to happen.
Raise some random local junk? Sure, bet you never played summon urself if you say so.


There sould be some inprint in desecrate pethaps.

Like you would press D to blow mines.
Press something to lock desecrate with evagelists

Or make em overlevel.
What use on lvl 67 spectre on 78 map.
Good luck

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Spectres and Zombies indeed are absolete now seeing how SRS have been conquering the witch build.

And thats exactly what im pointing out to you.
Stop comparing spectres and zombies to SRS because compared to SRS, every build looks obsolete.
SRS deals millions of dps while having high survivability. Every build is obsolete compared to SRS.
Which other build deals millions of dps while having such high survivability? There is just none.

Just stop comparing zombies and spectres to SRS. SRS will be nerfed. Basing an argument on the fact that SRS makes builds obsolete is nonsense.

There are plenty arguments to be made about why zombies and spectres might need a buff (to survivability especially), but basing that argument on the fact that SRS is way superior is not a good way to go about it. SRS is broken and will be nerfed. Stop comparing your build to it, regardless of what your build is.

As for srs.

The guy is not comparing srs with zombie.

He is pointing out:
Primary zombie summoner?
Primary skeleton summoner?
Primary spectre summoner?
Primary srs summoner?



3 of em fail in 73plus maps imo so why bother?
Yes the 4th will end up in the nerfyard. Still doesnt help the current spectre issue

I keep playing my zombies, with dying evangelists as support artillery.

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gh0un wrote:

Stop comparing your build to it, regardless of what your build is.

This is a feedback.
Let us all of here express what we want and get read.

Wish I had seen this post before respeccing my summoner.

I used to enjoy doing maps with my Summoner "NO SRS" with ease, but now I run screaming all the time, that is if I don't die in the process. "DIESYNC"

I hadn't tried Atziri and was hoping to do so, but obviously not anymore with the feedback in this post.

I for one don't even use a shield, but use The Queen's Decree so I don't take Necromantic Aegis, which in hindsight is a bad choice I made it seems.

Yes summoners suck in end game content more than ever now. I also wish they would give those stupid Zombies some better AI, why do the Skeletons attack and behave as they should, yet the Spectres and Zombies still stand around looking pretty unless you use convocation and direct them at a target somehow. They should at least have the AI to attack and target properly.

meanwhile people that take their time to think instead of whine seem to be doing quite fine:

http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1033467

without 200ex gear ofc