D3 ROS loot/end game better then POE
" Considering your highest character is about 79, you probably don't realize that the endgame for PoE is exactly the same way. You farm the same few maps over and over, ad nauseum, for a few percentage points of your bar. And as you progress to higher and higher levels, the number of maps where you get appreciable xp becomes smaller and smaller until you're in the 90s where you can basically only run about 5 or 6 different maps and have your time be worthwhile. Oh, except you often have to spend all your money that you've accumulated throughout the game to roll these maps in the hope that RNG doesn't piss all over you and force you to not be able to actually play the game. Wow, that's clearly a better endgame! And lol at "wasting time" in walking and killing. Isn't that what an ARPG is? You walk. You kill. You loot. Repeat. If you don't like walking and killing, you're in the wrong genre. Last edited by UnderOmerta#1203 on Apr 1, 2014, 8:41:33 PM
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" I only react to your condescending tone bro. " Oh hey let's play the "you don't know what X means" game and not actually give a sound definition of what X in the end means to make it look like you made a point. " Wooooooooosh. I mean all your whining can be put together into "I hate RNG" Which means that you are some kind of masochist to play a game based on rng... " What now, do you like it do you hate it, are you indifferent. If you like it, then I see no problem with doing it and gaining stuff that way. If you are indifferent then basically the same applies. If you hate it on the other hand you actually have a point whining about buying stuff like maps and gear. " It actually didn't take long (master took super long though) " Hmm playing WD... I wonder how melee I can be as a WD... I mean my pets were melee, does that count? (psst they also never died) " Read last comment. " Pretty much. I love racing in PoE. I love new ladders, they are exciting. " What is so wrong about that? When I played D3 the most level 60 was the highest you could get. Then they lazily slapped 100 Paragon Levels on the back because they realized players all reached max level and beat inferno, all long before the first people ever reach level 100 in PoE. The difference is that you cannot farm in NORMAL in PoE to reach max level. So you are comparing apples and oranges. " Oh wait, everything you said is also just your personal opinion. So it is irrelevant. Then why are you posting at all if it is by default irrelevant, unless you have like... double standards? |
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" Yes, you can. Read https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApoQAq3DjDGGdFR3U2NUVkxhRmc2bUxzeWhkVThrdGc&usp=sharing#gid=2. The exp penalty is max 98%, so it will be slow but possible. This message was delivered by GGG defence force.
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" Because I have to provide another part of the story because you're 100% subjective and you like to post your subjective shit everywhere. But please, teach me more about PoE, give me more laughs. " So you don't. You're just trying to sound smart. " And again, a subjective mind like yours sees it as whining. I don't hate RNG either, I've already said that your detective mode sucks, please don't do it anymore. I wouldn't play this kind of games if I hate RNG overall, I just hate RNG when it screws my leveling process outside of gear drops, which I've only seen it possible in PoE, and that has a reason, because it's idiotic and only merits gambling addicts. And funny thing is, how you've completely ignored the fact that I've just told you that you can do the same thing in D3. So tell me, how can a system that provides both of our likings be worse than one which "forces" one side to do the others side? Where is the logic in that? " This topic is irrelevant to this, I have no idea how you've managed to pull out that I don't like trading because endgame is a gated content. " Laugh. Ask PoE summoners how they feel about difficulty and survivability. Jesus Christ... " So what the fuck is all that about the endgame? Why are you discussing the endgame? You should say this in the first place, we both shouldn't even go through all of this. The D3's lack of races and ladder is what's bothering you before everything, and therefore I now see why things cannot be objectively discussed with you. " What is so wrong with that? Just read your last sentence here, but I'll c/p it: "So you are comparing apples and oranges.". Funny. You can farm normal to reach 90+ levels in PoE, same as you can reach 100+ paragons by farming normal in D3. " I'm not really surprised at reading this, you're in your own world, a fanboy delusion world, dismissing the reality. Last edited by tinko92#6447 on Apr 2, 2014, 3:21:22 AM
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" Wow I actually didn't know that. But In D3 it is actually fast to level on normal. In PoE it probably takes 3 years. |
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Since you disagreed on my unique item design point I will clarify my points a bit more, but you also seemed to have ignored the bit where I said that: "Unique items defining or making a build are interesting, but not if they make or break the majority of builds."
Spoiler
I feel that with some heavy nerfs and perhaps too harsh content to certain playstyles (melee, stun, lighning, specific skills such as cleave, sweep, shock nova and so on...) The viable game variants through the skill tree and the skill gem system in path of exile is limited. This also is caused by path of the survival nodes (ES, life) which pretty much makes you move from cluster to cluster along the tree. Against that you got a lot of builds which come available or viable (empowered) through unique items. Not bad per se, but if it becomes the means towards buidl diversity or it trumps both in quality and quantity what is possible through the base system, you hide build diversity behind RNG item drops. You will hide build diveristy behind Trade, behind an Auction House. The latter is teh exact issue diablo 3 has. Due to the lack of an interetsing system such as the passive tree, the unique parts to your build mostly comes at the end from the unique items. In diablo 3 atm unqiue and sets can radically alter playstyles of classes, despite the 1 unique affix. If you can't see how to use those affixes, I can't help your lack of imagination ;) So now we actually get an unique item dropped, what happens? PoE: - It is useless vendor trash. - I can't use it, start Path of Trade - I can't use it, but I will make a new build - I can use it, but the downsides are rather big - Nice drop, now I only have to fuse it! - Awesome, my character got empowered! There are a lot of scenario's where unique items don't give a positive reaction when they drop. Most of the time you are not that excited. You actually want interesting items to drop for the character you play. Since that is what gives the better play experience, creates immersion. Diablo 3: - It does something interesting, unique let's play with it - This empowers my character or build - This is rather useless, vendor trash for materials that let me craft or alter other unique items. - I can't use it, need a different character In the state how they drop and are designed the drop experience in Diablo 3 is better. Above all else things do not need to be strong to be fun, they only need a measure of being useful. The Three Dragons is the highlight of unique item design in Path of Exile at the moment, at least for me. Due to its item level and stat requirement it can easily be used in different builds. It can empower, but using it will always do something fun and gimmicky for your build. The all resist gives it some extra value, but you will need to compensate for missing stats on other gear pieces. Kaom, shavs and other empowering items will force you to trade, be very lucky or swap builds. The trading bit is 100% the Diablo 3 auction house debacle. I quit Diablo 3 when I figured out that to create a build I needed to spend my time on the auction house. I take a PoE break when I come to the point I need to trade more than play to change or roll a new build. Vaal orbs are more fun than unique item drops in Path of Exile. Well they could be, but a big wall of RNG says: NO. I'm talking about the few items that come up with aura support or other usefull affixes. Here we got a normal item with a fun unique attribute that can be useful to a lot of builds. KISS, keep it simple, stupid. What is wrong with finding gloves that gives an attack or spell a chance to blind (balanced: 2% chance on hit that you will get 5% or 10% dodge)? Something you normally won't have does something fun, the gloves are generally useful (life resist rolls) and you're done. To make best use of them you do have to go very fast cast speed or attack speed and probably stack it with blind. Sounds simple to me, but we hardly have such unique items, instead we got overly complex designs (bringer of rain, shav etc.). Is it weird to have unique items drop and want to have fun using them, without the need to trade, without the need to re-roll or without the urge to send it to vendor heaven? The fun unique items are almost non existant, whereas you expect the majoirty of the pool to have these. GGG has great potential doing something inetersting with the Vaal Orb, the crafting system, because all the "fun" is within reach in a compeltely PoE fashion, untill that point is reached I think that Diablo 3 atm has a more balanced and generally more fun spread of unique items. Which does not mean there are no other flaws such as build diversity, character identity without these items or flaws in the crafting system, because there are. Last edited by Ozgwald#5068 on Apr 2, 2014, 3:42:10 AM
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" I feel the same about it, Vaal orb would be beyond awesome in any other game except PoE, even with the chance it has to get something really useful. It's the gem slots, they are way too important, locking them is a downside that overwhelms it all. Gem slots make PoE the most item-dependent game in the history of ARPGs, bar none. I was enchanted with the idea too at the beginning, then you start to grasp the ramifications. Wish the armchair developers would go back to developing armchairs. ◄[www.moddb.com/mods/balancedux]► ◄[www.moddb.com/mods/one-vision1]► Last edited by raics#7540 on Apr 2, 2014, 4:03:43 AM
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how to cater players who constantly want to play an rewarding endgame having a massive amount of time will be an unresolved issue in poe until act 4 or other expansions are coming.
and even then there is this unfortunate promise by ggg for not to destroying your efforts like other games do it by raising the level cap when releasing expansions or other new content. as a result ggg will always have to deal with bored players spamming the forum like this. players complaining are partially right from a selfish perspective but if you run a game your view is different: the reason why access to endgame is restricted is, it would make reaching endgame with one uber char the only desirable goal but it's not and it should not. poe's advantages lie in replayability, customization, races and temporary leagues. giving all nolifers unlimited access to endgame items would allow them to flood the market with endgame items for low costs, a process called deflation in real life. items get cheaper and cheaper. this would make them rich as hell but also make it even easier for other players to buy their way into endgame instead of playing the game. there sure will be other quests to make the way to level 100 more interesting in the future. poe is a development in progress. until then, if you're bored with your endgame char, reroll and try something different. age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill!
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" I just love how you try to imply that being subjective is something wrong when talking about a game. guess what, 99% of things are subjective, there are very little things to talk about which are objective. Hey lets point out some objective things about D3 and POE. D3 was made by blizzard. PoE was made by Grinding Gear Games. D3 has 6 character classes to choose from. PoE has 7 character classes to choose from. Max level in D3 is 70 (+paragon). Max levelin PoE is 100. And so fucking on. I hope you get the point I am making. When discussion TASTE which is ultimately what we are talking about when we share our expecience with computer games and what we like or dislike about them, we are not talking about objective facts, but subjective experiences which are valued based on our preferences. I also love this one here: " Minds are by default subjective, learn your fucking definitions. " My my, aren‘t we being a little... subjective here? Hilarious hypocricy. " So wait I can use my currency orbs on my rift keys to roll mods on them? And when I sell three to the vendor I get the next higher tier? Wow I didn‘t know that! /sarcasm " Let me try again. So this is your main gripe then? Well seems like you have some subjective issue with how the game is designed. " Hmm leveling a summoner in PoE is actually not that easy in the beginning. My minions constantly die and I have to resummon, debuff and smoke mine away to keep them alive. While in D3 I was eating pizza and looking at the screen until everything was dead, then clicked a bit to collect the loot and moved on. " I‘ve already said that your detective mode sucks right back at you. Okay here are my thoughts so you can‘t missunderstand me: 1) I like the way gear works better in PoE. When I wear a dagger I use a dagger to attack. I like implicit mods and specializing different weapons and defensive types. I love playing with evasion/dodge, I love building with the passive tree and aquiring gear that I need for the build I thought of before. In D3 I constantly wear different weapon types and they don‘t seem to matter. Armor is just Armor and nothing else, it looks different but that‘s it, there is no specialization. 2) I love orbs, they are interesting. Yes RNG based but still they make white items useful and are something that reminds me of runes in D2 which were used for trading instead of gold (dislike gold since runes). 3) I love racings and ladders, D3 doesn‘t have that (yet?). But even if I don‘t think it would be the same as in PoE if they don‘t make it right (global announcement X is the first to kill Y, X has reached level Y, X has died on position Y). 4) I like maps and tiered systems, it‘s also the climbing feeling, which in rifts does not exist. I find rift keys and then I use them. There is no further use for them. When rolling maps it is like a ritual which I enjoy. Finding higher maps makes me feel excited, while in D3 I can just do bounties on Normal to get what I need which I find too easy and boring after a while. Also I like mods on maps, even if simple they still make every map slightly different and increase the value of them if rolled nice. 5) I like the style more of PoE. D3 is too much WoW imo, I also like D2 style even to this day. Be it sprites for gear, atmosphere, voice acting (yes I dislike D3 voiceacting it is corny), or even the story (which in D3 is shoved in your face but thank god there is adventure mode now). There might be more but this is it so far. What I like better in D3 is monster AI/Abilities, Skills and of course polish (though I dislike how floaty the combat feels, I like the impacts of PoE more). |
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