Not offering a full respec is a bad design choice.

Having a reset button is a terrible idea. I don't play D3 very much because of the way they designed the skill system. The biggest reason i play PoE is the way they designed Skills/passives. I'm sure that's the same for many other people.

Just because you say it's a terrible design choice doesn't make it so. Without proof/examples you sound like your complaining simply because you don't like it.

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Joyrock101 wrote:

limited(read: once or twice per character) full respecs don't ruin anything, and are NOT terrible design, they're actually amazing design, borderline fundamental. You STILL have to think, you STILL have to plan your build out. The only difference here is WHEN you do it; yes, you can use it to make your build more optimal. You can also make an optimal build from the start, this is no different.

Anyone that suggests forcing someone to spend another 20+ hours getting there character to a high level, just because they didn't plan enough beforehand, is good design, does not deserve any sort of an opinion.

If you are at a high level, I would assume (or hope) you put enough thought into your build. If you are level 70 and want a complete respec because ALL your skill points were placed wrong, you should probably build the character again, because it's obvious you didn't understand how the character works. Building it again will help you gain that understanding.

I can understand wanting to respec one or two poorly placed skills, but asking to wipe the entire tree is definitely bad.

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Just because you say it's a terrible design choice doesn't make it so. Without proof/examples you sound like your complaining simply because you don't like it.

I've already given proof, I'm sorry you aren't able to accept it.

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Joyrock101 wrote:

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Just because you say it's a terrible design choice doesn't make it so. Without proof/examples you sound like your complaining simply because you don't like it.

I've already given proof, I'm sorry you aren't able to accept it.

If you like stuff from D3 so much, then why don't you play D3 instead? Not to be rude here, just asking a legitimate question. From what I've read this game doesn't really suit your needs as a gamer.

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Ashwin wrote:

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Joyrock101 wrote:

limited(read: once or twice per character) full respecs don't ruin anything, and are NOT terrible design, they're actually amazing design, borderline fundamental. You STILL have to think, you STILL have to plan your build out. The only difference here is WHEN you do it; yes, you can use it to make your build more optimal. You can also make an optimal build from the start, this is no different.

Anyone that suggests forcing someone to spend another 20+ hours getting there character to a high level, just because they didn't plan enough beforehand, is good design, does not deserve any sort of an opinion.

If you are at a high level, I would assume (or hope) you put enough thought into your build. If you are level 70 and want a complete respec because ALL your skill points were placed wrong, you should probably build the character again, because it's obvious you didn't understand how the character works. Building it again will help you gain that understanding.

I can understand wanting to respec one or two poorly placed skills, but asking to wipe the entire tree is definitely bad.

Lets look at it like this.

Early on, you take a quick look, and you decide you want to make your Witch into a summoner, so start speccing into that. You dedicate a good number of points into it, but late into the game, you start to be bored with it. You don't want to be so dedicated to that, and you'd rather be, say, a frost witch.

There is ZERO reason you should have to completely reroll here; it's punishing for something that isn't your fault at all, and is unreasonable, especially when you're someone that doesn't have a huge amount of time to dedicate to games.

I'm not saying you should be able to respec at will; but at a certain point, you should have the option for a single full respec. This keeps the need for strategy and planning, and keeps a sense of permanancy, but adds some leniency that some people can take advantage of - nothing saying you have to, and it doesn't hurt you if you don't.

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HAJIMEdj wrote:

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Joyrock101 wrote:

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Just because you say it's a terrible design choice doesn't make it so. Without proof/examples you sound like your complaining simply because you don't like it.

I've already given proof, I'm sorry you aren't able to accept it.

If you like stuff from D3 so much, then why don't you play D3 instead? Not to be rude here, just asking a legitimate question. From what I've read this game doesn't really suit your needs as a gamer.

Because I like this game and it's ideas, and I want to see it at its full potential. I'm actually attempting to support the game and get it improved, not stagnate it with the same outdated ideas; it has done a lot to improve things, just needs a little more.

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Joyrock101 wrote:

Lets look at it like this.

Early on, you take a quick look, and you decide you want to make your Witch into a summoner, so start speccing into that. You dedicate a good number of points into it, but late into the game, you start to be bored with it. You don't want to be so dedicated to that, and you'd rather be, say, a frost witch.

There is ZERO reason you should have to completely reroll here.

decide to be a summoner
reach level 70
decide to be a frost witch instead
cant do it with 1 button
complain on forum


flawless

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Joyrock101 wrote:

Lets look at it like this.

Early on, you take a quick look, and you decide you want to make your Witch into a summoner, so start speccing into that. You dedicate a good number of points into it, but late into the game, you start to be bored with it. You don't want to be so dedicated to that, and you'd rather be, say, a frost witch.

There is ZERO reason you should have to completely reroll here; it's punishing for something that isn't your fault at all, and is unreasonable, especially when you're someone that doesn't have a huge amount of time to dedicate to games.

I'm not saying you should be able to respec at will; but at a certain point, you should have the option for a single full respec. This keeps the need for strategy and planning, and keeps a sense of permanancy, but adds some leniency that some people can take advantage of - nothing saying you have to, and it doesn't hurt you if you don't.

Read what you wrote again. That is the exact reason there should NOT be full respecs.

You made a summoner witch first. Now, you are level 70. You want a frost witch now. See how they are two completely different characters, except for being the same class? The skills they would use are different, the passives they would need are different, the gear they would use are different, and the gameplay style would be different. It is no different than making a new character of a different class.

The idea of creating a new build is to experience the build, as it grows. You'll start as a frost witch with a level 1 ice spear, which will gradually grow to level 14 by the time you finish act 1 merciless. That is all, part of the progression of your character. What you are saying essentially is, screw the progression, once I have a level 70 character, I should be able to use it as anything I want. The problem here is that, you have no idea about the new character build that you are making, because you aren't progressing with it.

The difference between playing a level 1 frost witch to level 70, and respecing a level 70 witch to a frost witch is that, the former will give you a great understanding of the character, what its benefits and weaknesses are, which bosses it shines against, which bosses are tough, and a general how-to-play-this-character idea. The latter ignores all this. You end up with a level 70 witch with a passive tree that you copied from some website. You have no idea how to actually play the character. You soon lose interest in the game.

Not letting players have access to a full respec if part of the reasons this game has longevity.

There are many powerful builds that at the start seemed quite under powered. Part of the reward is after you trailed through the hard part of your build you are rewarded with a powerful character.

If you add in respecs people will hope on the forums select the most popular one and just respec into that. This will hurt pvp and build diversity. Instead the game is making you delve into the skill tree and think about what you want to do with your character before you place your points.

As for your example with the summoner to cold witch I can see what your saying, but at the same time it's not like your efforts have been in vain. You have access to a wealth of currency items, skills gems, and equipment. This expedites the leveling process not to mention you are more skilled at the game as well. With all the factors it will cut your leveling time in half. So your first couple characters are not indicative of how long it will take to level a normal character.

Also at the end this is the developers decision and one that they have specifically stated will not be changed in the future. So regardless this is not going to change I just want you to realize why they have this policy.

Hope that helps.

See, your reasoning comes down to "if you respec you're playing wrong", and THAT is why it is bad design. If you don't want to respec, if you want that experience, you don't have to respec - it doesn't hurt you AT ALL.

Adding it ONLY has upsides, because it allows players that DO want to respec to have the option.