Another reason why the "D2 did it this way" argument completely fails when it comes to looting is because items were NOT important for progression in D2. Half the classes were capable of killing Hell Baal naked, the other half could do so just by picking up gold and whites along the way and buying blues from vendors. Your gear didn't even have to be that good to do Ubers if you were playing a Smiteadin.
In Path of Exile, on the other hand, if your gear sucks, then there comes a point in the game where you just can't progress any further. All your passive skills rely on your item stats, all your skills rely on you having the right combination of sockets, and ultimately there is no one build that can completely ignore gear progression and still be playable at a minimum up to maps, and yet this looting system means that people who want to play multiplayer when they're already forced to be online (go figure, some people want to do that!), they are going to be in a situation where they can, potentially, be unable to continue through the game for reasons beyond their control. That is why D2-style looting is a terrible idea in PoE, because it substantially punishes players for trying to have fun.
Another reason why the "D2 did it this way" argument completely fails when it comes to looting is because items were NOT important for progression in D2. Half the classes were capable of killing Hell Baal naked, the other half could do so just by picking up gold and whites along the way and buying blues from vendors. Your gear didn't even have to be that good to do Ubers if you were playing a Smiteadin.
In Path of Exile, on the other hand, if your gear sucks, then there comes a point in the game where you just can't progress any further. All your passive skills rely on your item stats, all your skills rely on you having the right combination of sockets, and ultimately there is no one build that can completely ignore gear progression and still be playable at a minimum up to maps, and yet this looting system means that people who want to play multiplayer when they're already forced to be online (go figure, some people want to do that!), they are going to be in a situation where they can, potentially, be unable to continue through the game for reasons beyond their control. That is why D2-style looting is a terrible idea in PoE, because it substantially punishes players for trying to have fun.
Another reason why the "D2 did it this way" argument completely fails when it comes to looting is because items were NOT important for progression in D2. Half the classes were capable of killing Hell Baal naked, the other half could do so just by picking up gold and whites along the way and buying blues from vendors. Your gear didn't even have to be that good to do Ubers if you were playing a Smiteadin.
In Path of Exile, on the other hand, if your gear sucks, then there comes a point in the game where you just can't progress any further. All your passive skills rely on your item stats, all your skills rely on you having the right combination of sockets, and ultimately there is no one build that can completely ignore gear progression and still be playable at a minimum up to maps, and yet this looting system means that people who want to play multiplayer when they're already forced to be online (go figure, some people want to do that!), they are going to be in a situation where they can, potentially, be unable to continue through the game for reasons beyond their control. That is why D2-style looting is a terrible idea in PoE, because it substantially punishes players for trying to have fun.
Summoners
*checkmate*
So you concede the fact that all builds other than summoners are absolute shit without gear and cannot progress through the game if denied that vital means of progression?
Let's also remember that Summoners themselves are complete shit WITH gear before level 40 or so. Sure, they're playable, but it's so miserably painful to do that you're better off being something else until you can get your minion life, minion damage, zombies, and skeleton gems leveled up.
Oh, and you can't do something else, because everything else is absolute shit and won't get you anywhere as per your post...
Because games that want to please everyone are usually bad.
This is nothing else but a bauble.
To please everyone you have to actually implement a ton of options: from respec to death penalties, to color coding, to absolutely everything.
But just offering loot-options its not everything. It/s just loot-options and that's that, nothing else.
And there is not a universaly recipe that says "please everyone = bad"
If any, ggg have a real oportunity to actually succede with loot-options=good.
Its just their stubborness so far that prevents them to do that.
Also, their brainwashed fanboys acting like a fanatic cult doesnt help too.
I like how Path of Exile encourages playing in Public Parties. However, the looting system seems broken. It’s fairly easy to pick up items intended for other players who are not in the vicinity or are currently fighting mobs elsewhere. Does GGG plan to introduce options for a Master Looter or at least a voting feature to kick ninjas?
"
Brian Weissman: This has been a subject of a great deal of controversy since the move to Open Beta, I’ll try my best to explain our line of thinking. Exiles in Wraeclast have a shady, uncertain past. Some of them were professional assassins in their past lives. Some were the murderers of children. On the whole, they’re not a particularly endearing bunch.
So while people are encouraged to play in groups, and the content is generally easier that way, it’s also designed to feel a bit like “every man for himself”. To this end, we have made looting free-for-all, in an effort to enforce that cutthroat, selfish feeling. There are item allocation timers to compensate for latency and distance.
A lot of people complain about the duration of the loot timers, but for a long portion of Closed Beta, these timers didn’t exist at all. Loot was distributed the same way it was in Diablo 2: fair game the moment it hit the ground, the property of anyone quick enough to grab it.
Ironically, putting people’s names on loot that drops created an unfortunate feeling of entitlement. When a Chaos Orb drops with your character’s name on it, you feel like that item is genuinely yours, and that anyone who picks it up is a ninja. If we didn’t have timers at all, then people wouldn’t feel this way. You never heard complaints from people boss farming in D2 about someone else stealing “their loot”.
We adjusted the rules of the loot timer in the recent 0.10.3c patch and will continue to modify it in the future based on feedback.
Brian Weissman: A lot of people complain about the duration of the loot timers, but for a long portion of Closed Beta, these timers didn’t exist at all. Loot was distributed the same way it was in Diablo 2: fair game the moment it hit the ground, the property of anyone quick enough to grab it.
And for a long portion of the Closed Beta players avoided public groups like the plague.
"
Brian Weissman: Ironically, putting people’s names on loot that drops created an unfortunate feeling of entitlement. When a Chaos Orb drops with your character’s name on it, you feel like that item is genuinely yours, and that anyone who picks it up is a ninja. If we didn’t have timers at all, then people wouldn’t feel this way. You never heard complaints from people boss farming in D2 about someone else stealing “their loot”.
Again they should stop using the ‘D2 did it that way argument’. D2 was released in a different era and GGG constant attempt to replicate D2 is going to limit this game.
The recent improvements to the loot allocation system have been positive. From a pure game play stand point I’m happy. I still feel that the system limits the social potential of PUGs….
Brian Weissman: Exiles in Wraeclast have a shady, uncertain past. Some of them were professional assassins in their past lives. Some were the murderers of children. On the whole, they’re not a particularly endearing bunch.
Thanks for posting this, Ginfress.
I particularly like the fragment above. If I understand correctly, then, the templar should have absolutely no cutthroat options whatsoever, since the grounds for his exile were in fact political, not criminal.
Last edited by Singingdog1110#2407 on Mar 22, 2013, 8:28:26 AM
