Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.

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MrNecro wrote:

if nobodys reasons behind FFA loot including the actual devs are good enough for you maybe its 'you' thats the actual problem.. Not the game.

Pointing at the devs is not a reason for FFA loot. Its simply saying that the devs want it in the game. We all know that already. What we want to know is what reason is there to have it be the ONLY loot system in the game. So no its not good enough.

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MrNecro wrote:

You act as if this game was made by you for you. Like the devs and players who enjoy the way the game is owe you an explanation.

If enough players want a change and the devs don't want to make that change then ya I say that those players deserve some kind of explanation as to the logic behind it. The devs talk enough to the community already why ignore a popular issue? The players who enjoy the game as it is would still have that game so I think it makes sense to ask them why they would be against another option since it shouldn't effect them much at all and at the same time make a huge portion of fans happy.

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MrNecro wrote:

Most of the posts wanting changes to the loot system are based of greed, unless you haven't been paying attention.

I honestly think you have been ignoring the pro options people if you really think this. Its not about greed. If I was greedy I would play public games and loot steal all day. I find it a boring way to play the game. I'm not lieing here. I have no reason to do that. I get all of the loot I want in single player and private games. I certainly don't need looting options to get MORE loot. Thats silly.

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Sickness wrote:

"If you join a group that implicitly or explicitly states the rule that drops belong to the one who gets their name on it"

Again, speak english. What are you some sort of lawyer or something?


Implicitly or explicitly? You act like stupid people making stupid games with stupid rules have some sort of right. And yes, they are stupid if they think public players care about stupid rules they made up.

But, if you want to play Judge Judy even she would agree that since this game is proven to be FFA no ones has the right to complain about people stealing dropped items. Since its not theirs it can't be stole.

No matter what. Ninjas don't exists. Proven fact jack.

To all the "rebuttals" to the definitions.

I have killed Brutus and not gotten any items. A reward is something always given to you when you complete a certain task: xp, quest rewards those type of things. A bonus is something given on top of that: loot. Please remember, we are not going by what your opinion of the definition is, we are going solely by the definition. Loot is a bonus due solely for the fact it does not drop on every kill. If it did, it would be indeed a reward.

I've also killed countless rares on my rerolls, and had times I get no loot.

You can get through this game by only buying gear from the shop. Its really not a hard game. I play all of my rerolls "man mode" where I only use self found, or shop items. Have not had a problem yet.

It is entirely not my problem you can't seem to comprehend this. You guys act like getting a bonus is a bad thing.

There's a reason most rpgs use XP as a quest reward, and have the boss be able to drop good loot.

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iamstryker wrote:

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MrNecro wrote:

if nobodys reasons behind FFA loot including the actual devs are good enough for you maybe its 'you' thats the actual problem.. Not the game.

Pointing at the devs is not a reason for FFA loot. Its simply saying that the devs want it in the game. We all know that already. What we want to know is what reason is there to have it be the ONLY loot system in the game. So no its not good enough.

.

lol.. Case Closed.

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MrNecro wrote:

Most of the posts wanting changes to the loot system are based of greed, unless you haven't been paying attention.

Oh? 'Cause most people asking for a change in the loot system aren't being greedy at all.

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"Greed is the inordinate desire to possess wealth, goods, or objects of abstract value with the intention to keep it for one's self, far beyond the dictates of basic survival and comfort. It is applied to a markedly high desire for and pursuit of wealth, status, and power."

That sounds like... ninja. I'm a 'ninja' in every group and I know it's greedy. That's the point.

However asking for a change and providing logical reasoning of why it needs changing is what the debate has been about so far and the logic behind it is quite sound.

So far the 'con' side of the argument has been quite weak as of late. Any logic falling back on personal attack 'ad-hominem' fallacies, etc do not count at all.

If you wish to PROVE that everyone who wishes for a change should just "deal with it" , then you should start off by providing your supporting arguments for your claim.





Once again, here are the problems that are seen with the current loot system:

1. People think loot has their name on it. This is because the developers are not communicating how the loot system REALLY should work to the player. It is not the fault of the player; it is the fault of the developer.

2. When you approach to get your loot sometimes people stand over it and due to collision are unable to retrieve your loot in time. Thus making the loot timers a bit pointless and not even necessary.

3. Loot timers aren't cutthroat and are not true to the developer's vision, so either change it back to true FFA, or give the leader a choice to just flat out decide how the loot system should play out with a variety of options. This works well because 'soon enough' there should be a place where cutthroat players can join a cutthroat league for the real experience they have been looking for.

Choice is better for both sides to have the ability to get what loot system they appeal to. There will always be players that want FFA (no timers), or people who want fairly allocated loot, and you'll have the players that think the current timing loot system works well for them.


Now, let's hear your arguments gents. In a respectable manner of course.

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Note: There are probably many more problems with the loot system I haven't stated/even noticed, but I just went ahead and stated the 3 that were most clear to me.

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MrNecro wrote:

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iamstryker wrote:

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MrNecro wrote:

if nobodys reasons behind FFA loot including the actual devs are good enough for you maybe its 'you' thats the actual problem.. Not the game.

Pointing at the devs is not a reason for FFA loot. Its simply saying that the devs want it in the game. We all know that already. What we want to know is what reason is there to have it be the ONLY loot system in the game. So no its not good enough.

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lol.. Case Closed.

He forgot one thing.

"In my opinion".

Bolded the only part that actually matters here.

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MrNecro wrote:

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Sickness wrote:

"If you join a group that implicitly or explicitly states the rule that drops belong to the one who gets their name on it"

Again, speak english. What are you some sort of lawyer or something?


Implicitly or explicitly? You act like stupid people making stupid games with stupid rules have some sort of right. And yes, they are stupid if they think public players care about stupid rules they made up.

But, if you want to play Judge Judy even she would agree that since this game is proven to be FFA no ones has the right to complain about people stealing dropped items. Since its not theirs it can't be stole.

No matter what. Ninjas don't exists. Proven fact jack.

speaking about writing proper english ? xD trolling ?
just trolling.

well here is my 2cts on this topic :
FFA looting is the current system which make it "not a bad one" just because ... its working...

well there are other system that are actualy working too, why not use them as either an exemple to improve this one or to implement them as alternativ in this game ?

pros = more programing and support from devs (basicaly work)
cons = well ... everybody wins, pro-FFA play FFA the others play the other

(or is it the other way around ? :D )

"]

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Sickness wrote:

"If you join a group that implicitly or explicitly states the rule that drops belong to the one who gets their name on it"

Ho and ... well i kinda agree here. If there is "tagging" on items even for a few secs/milisecs there is just no meanning to take it off at anytime.

why ?
well basicaly tagged means beeing meant to be in his pocket or beeing left on the floor.
so 2 cases :
- going in his pocket ! ... no need to explain, there is only 1 scenario. the only thing would be the lag/bad PC/etc which is not intended for GGG to influence the looting gameplay.
- staying on the floor. if the dude is not stupid enough he will ask his fellas if they want this ubba wand of the death with massiv evasion on it. because he's been playing with them and know that there is a shadow wand/ev.
AND if i does it on purpose, that his choice to be a jerk or not to care about it.



honestly i dont care about the outcome of this topic, i'm fine as it is since i play alone all the time, and unless my irl friends care to come and play with me here instead of SWTOR or WOW or LoL or whatever they are playing, i wont be playing multiplayer games, its just not worth the stress and agruments it create.
So now the community and the Devs have my pov on this, i must go :)

C ya round :P

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MrNecro wrote:

First off speak english. Second, if nobodys reasons behind FFA loot including the actual devs are good enough for you maybe its 'you' thats the actual problem.. Not the game.


You act as if this game was made by you for you. Like the devs and players who enjoy the way the game is owe you an explanation.

Most of the posts wanting changes to the loot system are based of greed, unless you haven't been paying attention.

None of this is even close to an argument to support your viewpoint. Please do try to stay focused and provide topical arguments. (As for the bit in bold, this is how people debate a topic. If you don't understand what is being presented here, you might want to exclude yourself from the conversation.)

Non-FFA loot should be an option.

Disagree? Explain why it should not be allowed.

(Pro-tip: if your explanation can be tracked back to personal greed, you will be eaten alive.)

edit: formatting

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MrNecro wrote:

Again, speak english. What are you some sort of lawyer or something?

Implicitly or explicitly? You act like stupid people making stupid games with stupid rules have some sort of right. And yes, they are stupid if they think public players care about stupid rules they made up.

The players and their rules are not stupid just because you disagree with them. Grow up.

Only a kid, a retard, or someone with lots of personal issues would join a game with a stated rule only to break it.

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MrNecro wrote:

But, if you want to play Judge Judy even she would agree that since this game is proven to be FFA no ones has the right to complain about people stealing dropped items. Since its not theirs it can't be stole.

No matter what. Ninjas don't exists. Proven fact jack.

Maybe you don't really understand what loot ninja really means?
It doesn't mean someone who litteraly steal items (to do that they would need to hack your account!)
It just means someone who is taking loot that they are not entitled to under the looting rules that they are playing by at that moment.
If I make a group and state that we will follow rule X and someone takes loot in a way not according to rule X, then that person is a ninja to me.

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Jackel6672 wrote:

To all the "rebuttals" to the definitions.

I have killed Brutus and not gotten any items. A reward is something always given to you when you complete a certain task: xp, quest rewards those type of things. A bonus is something given on top of that: loot. Please remember, we are not going by what your opinion of the definition is, we are going solely by the definition. Loot is a bonus due solely for the fact it does not drop on every kill. If it did, it would be indeed a reward.

I've also killed countless rares on my rerolls, and had times I get no loot.

You can get through this game by only buying gear from the shop. Its really not a hard game. I play all of my rerolls "man mode" where I only use self found, or shop items. Have not had a problem yet.

It is entirely not my problem you can't seem to comprehend this. You guys act like getting a bonus is a bad thing.

There's a reason most rpgs use XP as a quest reward, and have the boss be able to drop good loot.

lol, how does loot not fall under "A thing given in recognition of service, effort, or achievement."?
Why can something not be a reward and a bonus at the same time?
Where in the definition of 'reward' does it say that you must get it every time?

You are really trying too hard, you are only digging yourself a deeper hole.