[Suggestion] 'Automatically' use next available potion of same type

I don't like the idea for the same reason others have brought up: even having such a 'feature' built into the game will encourage new players that this is a valid or correct way to use potions. It isn't. Potion management is a core skill in this game and you need to understand and master the flask system to get very far. I know, it's purely optional and is sub-optimal so it's not a balance concern for high end play (in other words: good players would just ignore this feature if implemented, so why should we care right?), but adding an optional new feature like this still has two design trade-offs:

1. It costs developer time that could be spent on refining important gameplay mechanics or creating/polishing more content.

2. If it doesn't mesh well with the intended design of existing game mechanics, it can confuse and distract new players by offering them a new, incorrect way to play the game from the very start.

I disagree strongly with the premise that this is just a 'quality of life' issue. It's only a menial task to keep track of your different flasks if you're not using them well.

Also, you've never played an ARPG with multiple potion slots? So you've never played D1 or D2, the games that created and defined the modern ARPG genre?

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solistus wrote:

I don't like the idea for the same reason others have brought up: even having such a 'feature' built into the game will encourage new players that this is a valid or correct way to use potions. It isn't. Potion management is a core skill in this game and you need to understand and master the flask system to get very far. I know, it's purely optional and is sub-optimal so it's not a balance concern for high end play (in other words: good players would just ignore this feature if implemented, so why should we care right?)

I'd like to answer this bit with a short tale :p
In the past I have played several games that had an auto-pot feature. You could set a custom threshold, beyond which the game would automatically use a potion for you. People didn't mind it, because it was not the best way to play but instead functioned as a safety-net and, if used at a fairly high threshold, completely took the hassle out of HP management for easy content. That is precisely what this would be (albeit less 'dumbed down' and horrible). It would be far from ideal (and as such, should not be actively encouraged, I never said 'put it on a loading screen tip, too!'), but it would function as a safety-net for new players and a boost in quality of life for players who don't rely on potions too much (yet).

In this game, sure, you do need to use flasks wisely depending on the situation, but that doesn't even come into play for the first 30 or so levels. As such, claiming that using flasks is a "core skill", seems like overstating the point. They are important and you will rely on them, but why make people who do not -for a somewhat substantial part of the game- jump through hoops?

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solistus wrote:

1. It costs developer time that could be spent on refining important gameplay mechanics or creating/polishing more content.

This should be a matter of minutes- that aside, I trust the development team to allocate their time as they see fit. These sort of concerns don't belong on a "Beta Feedback" board imo.

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solistus wrote:

2. If it doesn't mesh well with the intended design of existing game mechanics, it can confuse and distract new players by offering them a new, incorrect way to play the game from the very start.

Have you seen the skill-tree? If someone gets confused or distracted by this, then they are playing the wrong game. That said, I agree that this should not be 'advertised' as a feature, but rather just be how it works in the background. I'm guessing that most players wouldn't even notice if this were how it worked.

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solistus wrote:

I disagree strongly with the premise that this is just a 'quality of life' issue. It's only a menial task to keep track of your different flasks if you're not using them well.

It's a menial task until you get to the higher difficulties, because until that point you don't need to use them properly to succeed. Since the common consensus on these boards seems to be that at that point, if you don't use your potions well, you will fail (a premise I don't disagree with), surely players would adapt.
It's in so far a quality of life issue, in that it removes an unnecessary and artificial 'difficulty' that will resolve itself sooner or later out of pure necessity. Players will at some point have to start 'playing properly' to succeed, so all this does is save a few lives for new players and remove unnecessary UI interaction for veteran players.

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solistus wrote:

Also, you've never played an ARPG with multiple potion slots? So you've never played D1 or D2, the games that created and defined the modern ARPG genre?

I have not. Only TQ, TL, etc.


Sorry if I seem to be quite adamant about this, it just seems like a no-brainer to me. I don't actually feel too strongly about it, but a good discussion doesn't hurt, right? :p

Yes well the issue is that I'm right and you're wrong. See?

:P
...seriously though, you understood my post correctly, when F2P comes, the majority will be the ones who are out for short-lived "fun" rather than self-improvement.

The Word of the Day here is: Accustomed.
When you get accustomed to something, it's tough to let go of for many people.

When people refuse to enter a 5-button system later on the game gets too hard. What comes next is the outcry that mobs deal too much damage to handle, when in truth a hit-and-run tactic with armor flasks would make it passable.
^ This will be the majority come F2P.

BUT, as with everything else, if the game were to introduce you to "new stuff", i.e. Nessa giving you a Sapphire Flask when entering the first chamber after the graveyard (you get a quest completion there), with a small note saying 'this might help you in your future endeavors' or whatever, that also works.
So long as it doesn't become like the WoW Raid Finder where bosses are detailed so exactly you could run around blind and still beat it.

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Thing is, the very fact that potions have different boosts (and negatives) makes the potions a part of the gameplay itself.

I agree with this comment and would not want any "auto" anything... depending on the flasks sometimes my dispell frozen is #5, other times it's #1...

I'm sorry, but I couldn't disagree more with the OP. Managing your flasks is an integral part of the game. What do you propose next: I can't be bothered to look after my character when he gets attacked so can the game just automatically move my character out of harms way?

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solistus wrote:

(in other words: good players would just ignore this feature if implemented, so why should we care right?)

I disagree with this. You could play optimally while still making use of this feature. In fact, I think it'd make it easier to play optimally. Of course, it sort of depends on your flask setup, but in a lot of cases I think it'd help.

Example:
say I have 4 health flasks and one mana flask. The mana flask and one of the health flasks has "dispels frozen/chilled", I'll place those on 4 and 5, so to get that effect I can fat-finger towards 4 or 5, not caring which one I hit. I want to save those though, being able to dispel freeze when needed is important. So for just heals, I'll just never hit 4, I'll just go in the 1-2-3 direction. This will work even if all those 3 flasks are empty, since then it will start using flask 4.

We could then extend this system to having insta-life recovery potions on 1-2. That way for just heal we could aim at 3 always, while going to the left if we need instant and going to the right if we need to be thawed.

Voila, as much control as I need.

I agree that it would be nice to just be able to press the button for the first potion and have it use the next available potion when the first one is gone.

You still have to manage your flasks with this option; you want to use your most effective potion only when you really need it..

@Geldric and Velrac:
I fully appreciate when someone disagrees with me, but it doesn't sound like you actually read the thread. If you did and those are your informed decisions, then fair enough.

I am against this. Managing potions and using them well is a skill to hone. People with better potion skills will die less often and be better at both PvE and PvP.
Since PoE plans to have PvP and has ladder races for PvE this needs to stay as it is.

Also as an example, I am playing a Blood Magic character currently.
My set up is: max Healing+anti burning, max Healing, armor flask, healing + anti cold, healing + bonus resistances

I don't want to press 1 and get to my anti cold flask every. I only use that one when I get frozen. I have it at 4 because it is closer to my fingers and don't plan to move it to avoid these kind of stupid changes.

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Torin wrote:

I don't want to press 1 and get to my anti cold flask every. I only use that one when I get frozen. I have it at 4 because it is closer to my fingers and don't plan to move it to avoid these kind of stupid changes.

You wouldn't have to move it, provided you could avoid hitting an empty flask.