My recap of PoE vs D4 and why even still PoE is unmatched

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AdRonZh3Ro wrote:

That's exactly what PoE is, mindless, you pick one skill you spam it solely in your maps and combat is dumbed down into "can you kill it or not", strategy is

Wrong. You can literally play Path of Exile using multiple skills on one character which results in a very enriching experience as the devs intended. It is not because the majority of players reduced Path of Exile to one skill, that it means POE is a mindless game.

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Reinhart wrote:

Wrong. You can literally play Path of Exile using multiple skills on one character which results in a very enriching experience as the devs intended. It is not because the majority of players reduced Path of Exile to one skill, that it means POE is a mindless game.

Oh, sure. Devs can intend whatever they want for their game, but when their intention is to also heavily control what builds can be played, how trade must be unbearably painful, how everything must be heavily rng based and how they absolutely rely on player 3rd party software, their "intentions" can go up their ass for all i care.

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Reinhart wrote:

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AdRonZh3Ro wrote:

That's exactly what PoE is, mindless, you pick one skill you spam it solely in your maps and combat is dumbed down into "can you kill it or not", strategy is

Wrong. You can literally play Path of Exile using multiple skills on one character which results in a very enriching experience as the devs intended. It is not because the majority of players reduced Path of Exile to one skill, that it means POE is a mindless game.

Hard to believe that people actually think that PoE is just all about one button.
Ofc a handful of builds can afford it but the majority of builds still has to press other abilities to apply exposure,curses or self buffs. So it's pretty much not any different to the spender/gainer system of diablo where you also just rotate between two abilities to maintain dmg and resource with a few button clicks for buffs or debuffs.

Yoo what?! Tree of whispers in d4 is bounties from d3, copy paste!

Nightmare dungeons are THE SAME as campaign dungeons but with 2 affixes, just as boring as rifts!

Hellrifts are terrorized zones from D2R!

Lilith altars lmao what a chore, 150 hidden through all map what is this hogwarts legacy?

Where are uber bosses and aspirational content??

Can't wait for the first diablo season which will have some mondo generic +25% xp +20% damage and item sets, then it will be replaced by an equally mid season 3 months later.

D4 have fun for a week or so then gaem ded.

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pr13st wrote:

Lilith altars lmao what a chore, 150 hidden through all map what is this hogwarts legacy?

Lost ark mokoko seeds. This is also where open world and not diablo like quest system "inspiration" comes from.

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AdRonZh3Ro wrote:

To which i'll say it again, D4 isn't trying to be PoE, but it's own thing beyond ARPG and factoring other flavors of genre. If you think that's bad, sure, but trying to tell people that having cooldowns is "factually" game breaking... It just makes me not take you seriously at all.

Cooldown as mechanic is not bad per se. The way it's implemented into D4 is bad.

I've played Rogue. My char had:

-Shadow Imbuement (medium cooldown)
-Dark Shroud (medium cooldown)
-Dash (long cooldown)
-Puncture (no cooldown)
-Twisting Blades with Daze specialty (Energy consumption aka cooldown)

- Ultimate (very long cooldown) + Dodge (medium cooldown)

Now, your core way of playing revolves around spamming Puncture and Twisting Blades.
-Puncture on it's own as any other basic skill is very underpowered so it's not damage dealer but it has 2 other main functions 1) to proc Vulnerable 2) Improve Energy recovery.
-Twisting Blades, solid damage, interesting mechanic BUT to fully utilize it 1) you have to be very mobile so the blades can sweep across as many monsters
2) don't have problems with Energy (just another way of making skill on cooldown)

Well you don't have either of those two things always available. Your mobility is dogshit because Dash has very long cooldown also Dodge has 7-8s cooldown
Also to be able to effectively clear packs you need Shadow Imbuement which also has cooldown.

This is core gameplay of my Rogue. Just by seeing how many white marked words there are in the post, someone can catch my drift what a mess that gameplay is. Juggling 6 mandatory different skills while being unable to use them when you want and on top of it controls that are made for console and controller (constantly getting stuck with attacking instead of moving the fuck away), is absolutely game breaking experience for me.
It is so bad that main goal with your char is to get enough cooldown reduction everywhere so you can play without cooldowns and prevent possible mental breakdown.

Now if that is my bias towards PoE and not objective analysis of D4 combat then so be it.

ps
I got pissed right now just from explaining what a dumb shit of a combat mechanic they made that if I could i'd refund the game now just because of it.

The only thing that's actually bad is heavy cooldown on dash. It should be 2 seconds as so you need to be smart with it, but not low enough so it's spamable. Everything else just feels like you don't like that style of play, which is understandable, but don't state it as "facts" when you clearly perceive it as your opinion.

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AdRonZh3Ro wrote:

Cooldowns are good for combat...

I like how you go all out with "bias" and criticize "factual", and then turn around and do the exact same thing. No, cooldowns aren't good for the game. You THINK it's good for the game, which you are perfectly entitled to think. I don't, and I've seen several Diablo veterans uttering the same concerns. Does that make my opinion more valid than yours? Of course not, but it just goes to show that opinions are split on the matter.

I think it's freakin' awful, especially when it forces you to use certain VERY underwhelming basic attacks. It limits player choice, and forces you into a carefully planned cyclus of repetition. Is it more repetetive than using one skill in PoE? No. Is it less repetetive? Not really. Hell, on my ranged Rougue, I ended up running around waiting for cooldowns instead of using the basic attacks because they all sucked and did no impact. Fantastic gameplay.

There are plenty of builds in PoE using several skills. Even amongst the more popular, like RF, you use several. Hell, when they reworked curses there's even several builds that started self-cursing in addition.

And on that node; people are so freakin' hellbent on downplaying PoE's build freedom/customization/options because some roads are shorter/better/more efficient than others. But I digress...

I just think it's hilarious that adding cooldowns is quote:"boring and annoying", "game breaking" and "crippling", when PoE is widely known for being a snooze fest in which several players recommend doing something else entirely in the background in conjunction with playing PoE.

Cooldowns were horrendously implemented and are completely unbalanced. This type of gameplay needs the basics attacks to be meaningful, while cooldowns are selective bursts of damage or controlling effects, and in that aspect D4 did fail absolutely. Furthermore, it's a completely different style in which, natively, Diablo veterans would innately be displeased with.

People are indeed hellbent on downplaying PoE's customization because it's dependent on crafting, and as we well know, crafting is just garbage as is.

More hilariously so, this thread should be in D4, not here.

And i am open to your questions as to where my bias is, because i fully believe i've tried to be as impartial as i can. That's actually a thing that i hate of forums style of posting, it's impossible to fully convey the intent without leaving room for interpretation.

You might be better of by playing a mmorpg (wow,ffxiv or even GW2) if you want cooldowns to be meaningful and impactful. Hell even a moba would do the job as the game punishes you wasting your cd's.