This end game grind is excruciating and I don't like it.

"

funplayer wrote:

I don't want to play 80 hours a week.
you don't have to. But don't tell me you start EVE Online or WoW not expecting having to put a lot of hours into - same goes for PoE :D
I don't want to pick one specific build from a small list of builds.
build diversity is still bigger than in any other arpg - ever
I don't want to plan everything specifically to not get one shot.
Why play chess and complain it needs planning? Play something else then.
I don't want to deal with people manipulating prices of literally every item all the time.
Welcome to the world. This is a fact for real life as well as any major game.

I don't like having to buy boss carries from people because I didn't pick something broken, or I didn't get 2 mirrors from a week of 6 player grinding.
Then don't

I don't want to risk high amounts (days of farming) currency just to gamble at certain items that are core to completing the game.
Then don't. Are your parents forcing you?

I don't like sending requests to 50 people just to buy one thing.
Then don't. After 10 years of playing this game I still haven't had that problem. Sometimes It can take a little bit longer but not too much.

I don't like how the specific builds based around specific hyper-rare items invalidate the entire system.
That's your problem.
I don't like how specific builds based around low-cost are the only way to farm certain high valued items.
I don't even get your problem in the first place...Specialization is an advantage in everything u do. welcome to the world.

I don't like getting randomly oneshot on maps, losing large amounts of time due to the piss-poor slow exp gain at end-game.
Currently there is no better solution. I don't want to explain again why a "punishment" is important. You also didn't bring an alternative to the table. (I mean, why not start with lvl 100 right away if anyone reaches it sooner or later.) About One-Shots: The better u get at understanding how to layer your defenses the less they will occur. But they can and should occur from time to time unless it's a bug. What would be good though is a damage-log, so we can read up on what actually killed us.
I don't like delving for 30 hours to get one level.
Then don't
I don't like farming the same map that doesn't drop items to get level.
Then don't
I don't like latching onto a 6 party breach or legion to get levels.
Then don't
I don't like dealing with specific specifics JUST TO GET EXP, when clearly level 85 is enough to oneshot the entire list of players NOT USING A BROKEN DEFENSIVE OR OVERPAID BUILD.
I get that you don't want to put much effort/time into anything, yes.

I am, at a loss for how excruciating this entire end-game experience has been. I quite frankly don't enjoy it anymore. It was fun at first, and now that I'm facing the more powerful bosses, I've found the entire experience tiresome and unrewarding just to get access to the final 2 voidstones. The first 2 were like 12 hours in, and I've spent weeks farming items to get the durability and damage to face the ubers, only to get softlocked by a DPS check once again because I don't run a meta low-cost or an overjuiced build.

I think there is room for improvement in terms of farming currency and gearing your char.

I'm sure every single person will have an opinion based on something I listed here. This is just a simple list of annoyances that will likely never be addressed. If anything they'll make some of these worse and completely ignore the rest.

There is plenty to improve in this game but I don't see much of what you mentioned as urgent or to be frank not even on the to-do-list at all. Melee needs an overhaul, that's correct, but YOUR major problem is certainly not melee.

I think many people just struggle understanding that PoE is a game where you can always push further but at a cost. You are allowed to choose where to stop, where your own "end-game" is. I didn't even reach any end-game in my first 4 years but I'm happy there is always a next challenge waiting at the horizon - at a cost, that I can choose to pay or not.

"

funplayer wrote:

I don't want to play 80 hours a week. I don't want to pick one specific build from a small list of builds. I don't want to plan everything specifically to not get one shot. I don't want to deal with people manipulating prices of literally every item all the time.

I don't like having to buy boss carries from people because I didn't pick something broken, or I didn't get 2 mirrors from a week of 6 player grinding. I don't want to risk high amounts (days of farming) currency just to gamble at certain items that are core to completing the game.

I don't like sending requests to 50 people just to buy one thing. I don't like how the specific builds based around specific hyper-rare items invalidate the entire system. I don't like how specific builds based around low-cost are the only way to farm certain high valued items.

I don't like getting randomly oneshot on maps, losing large amounts of time due to the piss-poor slow exp gain at end-game. I don't like delving for 30 hours to get one level. I don't like farming the same map that doesn't drop items to get level. I don't like latching onto a 6 party breach or legion to get levels. I don't like dealing with specific specifics JUST TO GET EXP, when clearly level 85 is enough to oneshot the entire list of players NOT USING A BROKEN DEFENSIVE OR OVERPAID BUILD.

I am, at a loss for how excruciating this entire end-game experience has been. I quite frankly don't enjoy it anymore. It was fun at first, and now that I'm facing the more powerful bosses, I've found the entire experience tiresome and unrewarding just to get access to the final 2 voidstones. The first 2 were like 12 hours in, and I've spent weeks farming items to get the durability and damage to face the ubers, only to get softlocked by a DPS check once again because I don't run a meta low-cost or an overjuiced build.

I'm sure every single person will have an opinion based on something I listed here. This is just a simple list of annoyances that will likely never be addressed. If anything they'll make some of these worse and completely ignore the rest.

Folks can pick apart details of what the OP says but, I think folks should instead try to just understand what is being said. There is truth in the general flow and major points made in the opening post.

Here's what I hope is a reasonable suggestion. I suggest perhaps just biting the bullet and play the strongest meta build that looks interesting to you. I have played plenty of my own invented builds. That is kind of fun but playing one of the strong meta builds is also fun and makes the grinds mentioned in your OP much more fun.

"

Antigegner wrote:

There is plenty to improve in this game but I don't see much of what you mentioned as urgent or to be frank not even on the to-do-list at all. Melee needs an overhaul, that's correct, but YOUR major problem is certainly not melee.

I think many people just struggle understanding that PoE is a game where you can always push further but at a cost. You are allowed to choose where to stop, where your own "end-game" is. I didn't even reach any end-game in my first 4 years but I'm happy there is always a next challenge waiting at the horizon - at a cost, that I can choose to pay or not.

Generalizing groups of opinions and responses is the ugly cousin of stereotyping.

Perhaps you don't or can't understand the problems. Perhaps you are trolling or just don't understand false dichotomy. I really don't care what you think, your negative belittling opinions about what I say, what you think I should be responsible for, nor do I care if you like what I say.

You have no idea what others are conceptualizing, abstracting, acting, or rationalizing. It's like you put on your patronization hat and responded to my gripes like a child with a magnifying glass over an ant-hill.

You likely will go through the entirety of your life like this. Belittling and berating instead of rationalizing and understanding. Deriving instead of directly conceptualizing. Patronizing instead of discussing.

"

funplayer wrote:

I don't want to play 80 hours a week. I don't want to pick one specific build from a small list of builds. I don't want to plan everything specifically to not get one shot. I don't want to deal with people manipulating prices of literally every item all the time.

The game has never been easier, people are able to complete substantially all content within 48 hours in SSFHC. Its not just 'meta' builds too, any half decent build can progress very easily since the rework to defences, mana reservation and introduction of eldritch currency (which, coupled with the essence nodes in the atlas is completely broken). Havoc has uploaded his runs where he is able to reach and defeat bosses in 13 hours playing a Lightning Arrow character.

"

funplayer wrote:

I don't like having to buy boss carries from people because I didn't pick something broken, or I didn't get 2 mirrors from a week of 6 player grinding. I don't want to risk high amounts (days of farming) currency just to gamble at certain items that are core to completing the game.

Then get good? What boss do you think requires 2 mirrors of farming? I mean sure, if you want to eat every boss slam and ignore boss mechanics, then maybe you need heavy investment. But the vast majority of players aren't doing that, they are able to beat bosses in poe because they engage with their mechanics.

"

funplayer wrote:

I don't like sending requests to 50 people just to buy one thing. I don't like how the specific builds based around specific hyper-rare items invalidate the entire system. I don't like how specific builds based around low-cost are the only way to farm certain high valued items.

You aren't entitled to anyone elses items. If you are expecting someone to respond to a 1c trade for an item they listed 2 months ago, then I'm not sure what to tell you. Here is a tip, when buying low value items you have 3 options. Sort by recently listed, set a live search or be willing to pay a bit extra.

"

funplayer wrote:

I don't like getting randomly oneshot on maps, losing large amounts of time due to the piss-poor slow exp gain at end-game. I don't like delving for 30 hours to get one level. I don't like farming the same map that doesn't drop items to get level.

Then build defense? It has never been easier to get insane defense in poe. If you are on the right side of the tree, run grace + spell suppression. If you are on the left, you can look at block, recovery, endurance charges, +max res and armor.

Very few builds benefit from additional levels beyond the low 90s..and nobody is forcing you to push to higher levels. If that kind of playstyle doesn't interest you, then stop? Find what you enjoy, and do that instead. If you think you should be able to go from level 65 to 100 in 3 maps, then go find another game that caters to you, because that isn't POE.

At the moment, every single map is juiced like crazy, even with no investment. I don't understand how anyone could suggest otherwise. Eldritch influenced maps drop scarabs nearly every single map, and if you get a minion/scarab mod early, you walk out with a full inventory of scarabs to juice your maps further. Then you have like 10 essences every map. Multiple corrupted strongboxes. Harbies..and whatever else you want.

"

funplayer wrote:

I don't like latching onto a 6 party breach or legion to get levels. I don't like dealing with specific specifics JUST TO GET EXP, when clearly level 85 is enough to oneshot the entire list of players NOT USING A BROKEN DEFENSIVE OR OVERPAID BUILD.

Then don't join them? Just make a build that isn't garbage and be mindful of things that are dangerous for your build. I've pushed to level 100 solo with multiple characters. Things I avoid are maps with multiple dangerous mods, beyond if my character doesn't have corpse explosion or high mobility, bloodline if my build is very squishy. Knowing your characters limits are important. People push to level 100 in SSF all the time with a wide variety of builds, stop looking for excuses and start working on fixing your builds.

"

funplayer wrote:

I am, at a loss for how excruciating this entire end-game experience has been. I quite frankly don't enjoy it anymore. It was fun at first, and now that I'm facing the more powerful bosses, I've found the entire experience tiresome and unrewarding just to get access to the final 2 voidstones. The first 2 were like 12 hours in, and I've spent weeks farming items to get the durability and damage to face the ubers, only to get softlocked by a DPS check once again because I don't run a meta low-cost or an overjuiced build.

I'm sure every single person will have an opinion based on something I listed here. This is just a simple list of annoyances that will likely never be addressed. If anything they'll make some of these worse and completely ignore the rest.

The problem is you, and only you. A lot of the issues you have are down to you having no interest in learning anything about the game. As it stands, defenses and crafting are the most accessible and broken they have ever been for casual players (pre-nerf harvest was stronger only for no-lifers).

What I like about this feedback is that all these things are about how player choices about builds and gear, and the gears availability affect how a player can approach the endgame. Maybe GGG should do something that can widen the amount of players that have access to endgame content, not a nerf per se, but more options that don't require ungodly amounts of grinding or luck to get the right items to simply hit a dps/health wall. Just making a number bigger isn't really a meaningful challenge.

And honestly if they want to make carry services harder, just make it so the person being carried has to do something during the boss, or make it like an mmo where you get locked into how many instances a week you can run something.

Really anything would be welcome at this point.

"

roundishcap wrote:

What I like about this feedback is that all these things are about how player choices about builds and gear, and the gears availability affect how a player can approach the endgame. Maybe GGG should do something that can widen the amount of players that have access to endgame content, not a nerf per se, but more options that don't require ungodly amounts of grinding or luck to get the right items to simply hit a dps/health wall. Just making a number bigger isn't really a meaningful change.

And honestly if they want to make carry services harder, just make it so the person being carried has to do something during the boss, or make it like an mmo where you get locked into how many instances a week you can run something.

Really anything would be welcome at this point.

Posts like these are complete rubbish.

They removed watchstones, reduced map count from 150ish to 117. They also introduced Kirac missions and scouting reports which makes it extremely easy to fill out your atlas. The end game has been completely streamlined. There are plenty of videos of players reaching 100+ atlas completion within 15 hours in an SSF/league start environment.

They introduced eldritch modifiers and powerful essence nodes that allows players to easily craft what would be considered high-end gear with ease.

You need to give actual specific examples of what issues you see in the game and what requires change.

"

BrettLee wrote:

The problem is you, and only you. A lot of the issues you have are down to you having no interest in learning anything about the game. As it stands, defenses and crafting are the most accessible and broken they have ever been for casual players (pre-nerf harvest was stronger only for no-lifers).

Oh look, another pretentious blowhard who thinks they understand how to judge people.

"

funplayer wrote:

"

Antigegner wrote:

There is plenty to improve in this game but I don't see much of what you mentioned as urgent or to be frank not even on the to-do-list at all. Melee needs an overhaul, that's correct, but YOUR major problem is certainly not melee.

I think many people just struggle understanding that PoE is a game where you can always push further but at a cost. You are allowed to choose where to stop, where your own "end-game" is. I didn't even reach any end-game in my first 4 years but I'm happy there is always a next challenge waiting at the horizon - at a cost, that I can choose to pay or not.

Generalizing groups of opinions and responses is the ugly cousin of stereotyping.

Perhaps you don't or can't understand the problems. Perhaps you are trolling or just don't understand false dichotomy. I really don't care what you think, your negative belittling opinions about what I say, what you think I should be responsible for, nor do I care if you like what I say.

You have no idea what others are conceptualizing, abstracting, acting, or rationalizing. It's like you put on your patronization hat and responded to my gripes like a child with a magnifying glass over an ant-hill.

You likely will go through the entirety of your life like this. Belittling and berating instead of rationalizing and understanding. Deriving instead of directly conceptualizing. Patronizing instead of discussing.

Well, at least I know now that "you don't want" and "you don't care". That's a good attitude for sure.

Initialy i thought that 3.17 was better, until i hit the T14+ wall again. Grinding red maps for red maps and getting yellow or white maps is bad.

After grinding (in standard) every day in february since the start of 3.17, it bored me to the point that i find more enjoyable playing Elden Ring and Lost Ark.

Why is that ? Becaus in those two games, power increments are guaranted.

If i find Smithing stones in Elden Ring, i can upgrade. Some of that is gated behind bosses yes, but you don't have to grind for 20h to get a new try on a boss...

In Lost Ark, the upgrade chance is about 3% in Tier 3, but i can grind the materails needed to get a chance, or multiple chances to get that upgrade.

In PoE, you gind, you're not always rewarded for that grind and when you have the currency to attempt an upgrade after sometime weeks of farming, that upgrade is NOT GUARANTED.

Even if i love Path of Exile, i will evntually fade out of that game entirely becaus RNG layers in this game are killing me very time i want an upgrade...

"

funplayer wrote:

I don't want to play 80 hours a week. I don't want to pick one specific build from a small list of builds. I don't want to plan everything specifically to not get one shot. I don't want to deal with people manipulating prices of literally every item all the time.

I don't like having to buy boss carries from people because I didn't pick something broken, or I didn't get 2 mirrors from a week of 6 player grinding. I don't want to risk high amounts (days of farming) currency just to gamble at certain items that are core to completing the game.

I don't like sending requests to 50 people just to buy one thing. I don't like how the specific builds based around specific hyper-rare items invalidate the entire system. I don't like how specific builds based around low-cost are the only way to farm certain high valued items.

I don't like getting randomly oneshot on maps, losing large amounts of time due to the piss-poor slow exp gain at end-game. I don't like delving for 30 hours to get one level. I don't like farming the same map that doesn't drop items to get level. I don't like latching onto a 6 party breach or legion to get levels. I don't like dealing with specific specifics JUST TO GET EXP, when clearly level 85 is enough to oneshot the entire list of players NOT USING A BROKEN DEFENSIVE OR OVERPAID BUILD.

I am, at a loss for how excruciating this entire end-game experience has been. I quite frankly don't enjoy it anymore. It was fun at first, and now that I'm facing the more powerful bosses, I've found the entire experience tiresome and unrewarding just to get access to the final 2 voidstones. The first 2 were like 12 hours in, and I've spent weeks farming items to get the durability and damage to face the ubers, only to get softlocked by a DPS check once again because I don't run a meta low-cost or an overjuiced build.

I'm sure every single person will have an opinion based on something I listed here. This is just a simple list of annoyances that will likely never be addressed. If anything they'll make some of these worse and completely ignore the rest.

if you don't plan on grinding games made by grinding gear games, such that playing less than 80 hours a week would yield you a build capable of everything and not getting 1-shot, then why would there be a need at all for getting big fancy gear when mediocre gear can do everything.

plus, if you don't plan on getting one-shot, just play low tier white maps, then its easy to not get one shot, no?