On the naming of things... in PoE, or, The thesaurus can be dangerous

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caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaps wrote:

You're not being persecuted. Some people disagree with you. I personally find these little insinuations that you're the final judge of what a word can or can't mean a bit silly but uh ok gosh

I'm not? Oh, thank you! What a relief! I must really have misjudged all the folks who posted what a travesty this thread was, or how I assumed things about the swastika, or that I had a dirty mind... I thought they were just internet misanthropes, when all they were trying to do was to help me!

You've really opened my eyes, ca- well, you know who you are. May you continue to thrive in your world of enlightened thought. =*[.]*=

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DalaiLama wrote:

Carne = meat, AKA flesh. Carnal Knowledge is knowledge of the flesh - a euphemism, not a literalism. If you see Chile Con Carne on a menu, they aren't offering sexual activity with spicy beans, they are saying there is meat included. Likewise, if you see Carne Seca, it doesn't mean you need a personal lubricant, but that the meat has been dried before cooking. (El Charro cooks some awesome Carne Seca).

Indeed, and a very good point. Thank you for this post, man. :)

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CharanJaydemyr wrote:

As for thesaurus usage: naturally I discourage it with serious writers, who should learn how far they can push the words they already know (as Stephen King puts it, use what's in your toolbox first and foremost), but...again, this is a game which relies on random name generation and pretty outlandish combinations.

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DalaiLama wrote:

If you want a serious writer who knows how to use *every* tool* in the language tool box- give Jack Vance a whirl.

In addition to his amazing use of words, some of his characters are so developed they make Michelangelo's David look like a chainsaw carving.

For a sec there I thought you'd just copied me outright, and was like, wtf?! (It's happened before, sadly).

Noted on the recommendation. I've moved on from fantasy/sci-fi for the most part, but always receptive to diamonds in the rough, so to speak.

___

On-topic: I'm with Rhys. Default meaning trumps obscure dictionary meanings. The bibliophile in me hates it, because I love how flexible some words are. I first learned of 'carnal' when I was researching a certain four-lettered word and its erroneous origin as an acronym. I've not seen it used since for anything BUT that meaning prior to the apes of PoE.

As for Cannula, well, anyone who's been in hospital for something relatively serious should know what that means in everyday speech.

Kudos to Ray for being so 'anal' about this. I should have been but am a poor beta tester. I struggle to approach the game as a writer/critic. My bad.

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Raycheetah wrote:

I'm not? Oh, thank you! What a relief!

Glad to be of help. I hope it brings you succor through these difficult times of posts on the internet. =(&[M]&)=

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Rhys wrote:

Meanwhile, on-topic...

Cannula should probably be changed. I'm guessing most people haven't heard it before, which means either they look it up a dictionary and become confused,

:(

hey guys whats a torc anyone have to look that up? oh here it says torque huh whats cars doing on an amulet

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Sure, it can be used in other ways, but it takes some context to properly distinguish the other meanings. Context we do not have with the "carnal apes".

Unless that really was the intended meaning, I vote for changing it.

I think there's significant context: This is one of them videogames with the old-fashioned funny words. Thus, a discharging sword isn't suppurating; it's electrified.

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CharanJaydemyr wrote:

As for Cannula, well, anyone who's been in hospital for something relatively serious should know what that means in everyday speech.

It means nothing in everyday speech. Most people have never used the word nor heard it. ;|


I say keep all the unusual words, even if some people don't quite get them, lest we start seeing rares like "Physical Damage Quiver [base: +physical damage quiver] [mods: +Physical damage, + magic ammo, +...]" and "Magic Shield [base: cardboard spirit shield] [mods: +...]"

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Rhys wrote:

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Mark_GGG wrote:

I am familiar with the word carnal, and as I pointed out above, it's use here is correct use - the word is most commonly used in relation to sex, but it doesn't exclusively mean anything sexual

Yeah, but since it's most commonly used "that way", its default meaning is effectively in relation to sex, and since that's the context in which most people are used to hearing it, it has picked up a lot of sexual connotations.

Sure, it can be used in other ways, but it takes some context to properly distinguish the other meanings. Context we do not have with the "carnal apes".

Unless that really was the intended meaning, I vote for changing it.

My first thought was it pertained to the flesh/physical or "not spiritual".

The modern overly sexualized meaning of the word carnal never entered my mind. Unfortunately the meaning of words often get muddied and change over time and their original meanings get lost or obscured.We are poorer for it. :-(

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caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaps wrote:

I say keep all the unusual words, even if some people don't quite get them, lest we start seeing rares like "Physical Damage Quiver [base: +physical damage quiver] [mods: +Physical damage, + magic ammo, +...]" and "Magic Shield [base: cardboard spirit shield] [mods: +...]"

Why call it a spirit shield? It protects your physical life, not your soul....

Yeah, hehe, the "odd" words, if not WRONG, don't seem that big a deal to me, but eh, that's just me, and it's not like I think modifying them is a big deal either.

Maybe cannula is wrong though. I'm one of those who has never heard it. But carnal? I mean, really, even if it does seem to subtly imply some sort of rapeage in some people's minds, I actually kinda like that.


But yes, what *is* cars doing on an amulet? ;)

I am honestly shocked you've never heard of a cannula. Never had a drip feed in hospital or known anyone to have needed IV? Really? My idea of everyday speech must be a little more...experienced than others', then. My sister's had one, because she's had a baby. Strangely enough, so has my mother. It's not absolutely the same procedure for all hospitals but it's almost standard. Know anyone who's had a baby? Appendix removed? Anything at all where they needed fluid or hydration and couldn't for some reason take it orally? No?

OH well. No accounting for the things people on the internet (the world's largest database...ever) don't know.

Google: cannula. And then, for a laugh, google: cannula quiver. You will see THIS very thread is the only non-medical hit for several pages.

As for carnal...well...I am all for antiquated definitions, but when they create unintentional jokes, such as I feel 'carnal' did here, there is something that needs addressing.

Because it is in everyone's interests to be gay about this.

The worst thing carnal ape will do is get a smirk.

Nobody is actually offended by it. I vote keep it, it's flavourful.

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CharanJaydemyr wrote:

I am honestly shocked you've never heard of a cannula. Never had a drip feed in hospital or known anyone to have needed IV? Really? My idea of everyday speech must be a little more...experienced than others', then. My sister's had one, because she's had a baby. Strangely enough, so has my mother. It's not absolutely the same procedure for all hospitals but it's almost standard. Know anyone who's had a baby? Appendix removed? Anything at all where they needed fluid or hydration and couldn't for some reason take it orally? No?

OH well. No accounting for the things people on the internet (the world's largest database...ever) don't know.

Charan, It is understandable that few people have heard cannula before. I was in the hospital for a few days with an IV and not once did anyone ever say cannula. Not everyone uses the same words or experiences the same things as everyone else. Please try to consider this before possibly insulting others. :P