GGG please end speculation by denying streamers better loot

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Judaspriester wrote:

Just take Q'Anon as example: every try to proof that this is nonsense gets used as proof that they are right and the enemies spreads lies to shut them down.

Exactly. It has come to the point where some people getting their videos deleted is deemed proof that they are right because someone is too afraid of them.

But on topic: it is impossible to confirm or refute this. Even if you somehow come up with a footage it can be dismissed as good/bad luck.

I mean...why wouldn't they be increasing drop rates for streamers? Ethical questions aside, from a purely business/financial standpoint they either are increasing drop rates, or they should be.

-Will increasing drop rates for streamers without their knowledge make streamers happy and continue playing? "Yes"
-Does GGG market their game through streamers? "Yes"
-Is it illegal to vary drop rates of electronic goods for players without causing financial harm? "No"

So if it's good for their business, and not illegal, we should assume they are doing it.

For those saying we would see a huge disparity in streamer RNG vs themselves they don't understand that anecdotal experiences is not the same as data from the whole player base. Even if they increase drop rates of exalts by x2 or x3 or cause some rolls to be 'Lucky' it still won't happen very often, but it's enough of an increase to generate more clippable Twitch streams that viewers will watch and get excited about.

And for the record on my position, I'm not saying I want this. I would probably leave PoE if I *knew* they were doing it. However since we can't know without literally looking at the source code (which we'll never see) I have to suspect it's occurring, but never know for sure.

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Desrers wrote:

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Judaspriester wrote:

Honest question: How should they do this?

Well if they post formulas for droping loot/HH/mirror everyone can take any streamer that get that drop and any other and do the math. If for such things for example can happen in 1:100000 ratio it is in realm of possibilites but if said ratio will be 1:10^10 that will raise question for that streamer, but if all streamers (which hooked up to GGG and was getting queue priority because not all people who was streaming get that only those who big/famous/paid) get the same rate but small people have different ratio then matter would be settled for majority of people

That would still leave doubts, especially since we lack numbers.
let's say the chance for a dropped currency item is a mirror on a t16 map is 1:1.000.000. Without the number of currency items dropped (or at least a good estimate) this given chance is worth nothing, since the effective chance they would have get dropped one over time could be 1:100.000 or 1:3, depending on the sample size.

And even if you have the necessary numbers, you would have to get hands on a sample size fitting to the chance, in order to eliminate the rng within your calculation.

So it would most likely end up with everyone making their own calculations based on there assumptions in order to strenghten their position (besides the fraction that doubts the accuracy of the given formula in general).

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Desrers wrote:

Well if they post formulas for droping loot/HH/mirror everyone can take any streamer that get that drop and any other and do the math. If for such things for example can happen in 1:100000 ratio it is in realm of possibilites but if said ratio will be 1:10^10 that will raise question for that streamer, but if all streamers (which hooked up to GGG and was getting queue priority because not all people who was streaming get that only those who big/famous/paid) get the same rate but small people have different ratio then matter would be settled for majority of people

why are you ignoring me when i say that you can already do this with things that are known with certainty, such as crafting probabilities? nobody is ever gonna look at anything regardless of what stats ggg shares.

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Mastus wrote:

I mean...why wouldn't they be increasing drop rates for streamers? Ethical questions aside, from a purely business/financial standpoint they either are increasing drop rates, or they should be.

-Will increasing drop rates for streamers without their knowledge make streamers happy and continue playing? "Yes"
-Does GGG market their game through streamers? "Yes"
-Is it illegal to vary drop rates of electronic goods for players without causing financial harm? "No"

there is only one flaw with this argument. if this is the case and if ggg believes this is the case, wouldnt it be beneficial to just increase everyones drop rates so that they can be happy and continue playing?
it just doesnt add up...

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jewdas12 wrote:

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Desrers wrote:

Well if they post formulas for droping loot/HH/mirror everyone can take any streamer that get that drop and any other and do the math. If for such things for example can happen in 1:100000 ratio it is in realm of possibilites but if said ratio will be 1:10^10 that will raise question for that streamer, but if all streamers (which hooked up to GGG and was getting queue priority because not all people who was streaming get that only those who big/famous/paid) get the same rate but small people have different ratio then matter would be settled for majority of people

why are you ignoring me when i say that you can already do this with things that are known with certainty, such as crafting probabilities? nobody is ever gonna look at anything regardless of what stats ggg shares.

Because if you can see topic was about streamers loot drop and not about stremers better crafts. And since weight of mods on items are publicly known it will be really stupid for GGG to get streamer better chances, at least by noticeable margin. That being sad i would have to repeat that i do not share same believes or care enough to proof/disprood them. I'm just presenting that just saying that GGG wouldn't do that because they can get caught is not a valid argument, and that code info to increase streamer's drop chances not so big (just flaging those acounts and if true then applying slightly different formula for some big drops)

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jewdas12 wrote:

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Mastus wrote:

I mean...why wouldn't they be increasing drop rates for streamers? Ethical questions aside, from a purely business/financial standpoint they either are increasing drop rates, or they should be.

-Will increasing drop rates for streamers without their knowledge make streamers happy and continue playing? "Yes"
-Does GGG market their game through streamers? "Yes"
-Is it illegal to vary drop rates of electronic goods for players without causing financial harm? "No"

there is only one flaw with this argument. if this is the case and if ggg believes this is the case, wouldnt it be beneficial to just increase everyones drop rates so that they can be happy and continue playing?
it just doesnt add up...

There difference between promise to give to all people 1 million $ for sake of equlity and actually doing that. Because that wouldn't solve the issue just move the base line. Same goes to marketing give mirror to more people and the value of mirror goes down and it's the same game only mirrors price equals to alt. But if people se streamer getting mirror that might give them some nudge to play the game more to get that mirror and by playing chances that they also want to but MTX also inreasing, so...

Some serious flat-earther type shit going on in here.
Let's band together, spend WAY too much time compiling a bunch of streamer footage, find NO conclusive results, and still not question if we were wrong in the first place. LOL.

Oh yea, and to the OP, If GGG came out and said "We don't give special drop rates to streamers"....
would people like you even believe them?

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Noble_Seiken wrote:

Some serious flat-earther type shit going on in here.
Let's band together, compile a bunch of streamer footage, find NO conclusive results, and still not question if we were wrong in the first place. LOL.

The real joke is burying your head in the sand and somehow believing that GGG is beyond reproach, so much so, that even asking questions is out of line.

Why do these questions even come up in the first place? Well because, not shockingly, this type of advertising manipulation, has happened in the gaming industry, with developers admitting to it, and why.

From increased chances for cards drops in sports games, to manipulation of matchmaking in shooters, to increased drops rates in looters, stuff like this does happen.

Why? Because it shows the game in a more exciting light. Nobody wants to watch a streamer in POE get shit drops for 8 hours, with horrible crafting and linking luck. Nobody wants to play that. But damn if the loot is dropping, GG items are getting made, and 6L's are happening its great advertising.

That being said you can't do that for everyone or else it fucks with your loot progession and retention numbers. Again this isn't new thinking in the online game industry. You need that carrot, especially in a f2p.

I'm not for sure saying that's what going on with GGG, but I can tell all the benefit of the doubt and trust I have given GGG has evaporated. Nothing would surprise me at this point with them.

Edit: added clarifying bits