Slam skills dps, where is it?

"

zzang wrote:

Actually im using Earthshatter now it turned out to be the best slam skill. You might check one of my later videos for a performance benchmark.

Nevertheless in endgame survivability is still not enough. And by endgame i mean 100% delirious t16-19. I could link you a plethora of builds where the whole build costs half of my 2hand weapon while cruising through the content making melee builds look like a piece of shit. But this extended topic of balance would probably fit better in another thread.

^quote on this

I avidly play melee but also had casters a ranged chars and summoners to keep in touch with the game meta, my contribution on the topic:

- Slams & Warcries.
On paper a decent idea but does not fit what the devs pushed for entire consecutive leagues (zoom zoom timers). Also the practical damage doesn't justify going slams compared to a caster or an offscreen range char.

When next league will be on a timer slams will suck a lot.

- 2H rework.
Big fail here, that smells of metashift and powercreep from miles.
2handers are forcefully pushed to buy 15ex weapons that ultimately don't give any real high potential for that cost.

Low animation speeds of about 0.5 tops and additional after effects like aftershocks (EQ), warcry explosion (earthshatter) or slow creeping aoe (sloow sunder & slow-ish tecslam), the sum of it will always make these weak on mapping <- needs a big buff on windup animation

Nothing added to defense <- will always make 2h (with exception of staff) the weakest tank in the game

- I really can't comprehend the thought process when GGG lets herald stacking slip through and leaves it unnerfed for an entire league, or VD that is 100% supported and buffed, but anything tagged melee is a big NO and comes prenerfed and you need to stack 5ex upgrades upon upgrades to reach any potential

100% delirious is a pretty bad benchmark realistically though as its far beyond the scope of the rest of the games content, like if 100% delirium is max difficult, a 10, the next contents gonna be like a 4.

2h is feeling in a pretty good spot right now, it can't content with the busted builds but warcries carry the dps well enough that you can round the defences out nicely.

Tbh if anything I think 2h is about where balance should be, it feels good without being too easy or hard in most circumstances.

So it is slower in the part of the game that neglegible percentage of players even tries? Sounds not bad for me.

They made slams and melee in general competiteve for the first time since vaal pact change. Thats on its own is major success. Doesnt matter how hard you try you cant deny that they are finally good. Is it the best? Ofcourse no and never will. Thats just the nature of the game, range will always be better.

I wont even comment Zaen rant there. It is simply and utterly wrong. We have timers even now and people dont have problems with them so next league changes nothing.

"

kuciol wrote:

So it is slower in the part of the game that neglegible percentage of players even tries? Sounds not bad for me.

They made slams and melee in general competiteve for the first time since vaal pact change. Thats on its own is major success. Doesnt matter how hard you try you cant deny that they are finally good. Is it the best? Ofcourse no and never will. Thats just the nature of the game, range will always be better.

I wont even comment Zaen rant there. It is simply and utterly wrong. We have timers even now and people dont have problems with them so next league changes nothing.

He's not that far off tbh.

This is hardly what I'd consider competitive:

There's a couple reasons why this is disappointing:
- 2H/slam archetype was newly revamped, you'd expect more people to play these builds out of curiosity
- poe ninja increased their character archive capacity to include more players
- the harvest mechanic heavily favors weapon based builds, the average joe can see what it's like wearing that 800+ dps 2H because they can actually craft one

At the end of the day when 9/10 players think low attack speed and defenses cripple 2H builds, the last thing ggg should of done was to double down by dropping the base attack speed on many bases even more by trading it with raw base damage, but they did just that. At the current state of poe, damage is not a concern for almost every build archetype, so this tradeoff for raw damage vs attack speed was really just a gut in attack speed. If you find 2H slams playable right now, you probably would of found it playable before this league too, but that doesn't mean it's competitive or even fixed in any way.

"

kuciol wrote:

So it is slower in the part of the game that neglegible percentage of players even tries? Sounds not bad for me.

They made slams and melee in general competiteve for the first time since vaal pact change. Thats on its own is major success. Doesnt matter how hard you try you cant deny that they are finally good. Is it the best? Ofcourse no and never will. Thats just the nature of the game, range will always be better.

I wont even comment Zaen rant there. It is simply and utterly wrong. We have timers even now and people dont have problems with them so next league changes nothing.

Yep very typical behaviour you won't listen to my feedback when I have a collection of 2handers with like 70% of my chars



and non 2handers to tell what is the difference



and did 3 chars this league, and also happen to have made a 2H EQ slayer in delirium (so i can really tell what's changed over one league)

Or won't listen to other ppl who invested even more into it,
But I should listen to one that has barely made a lv85 slammer char this league

::sound of tape measure unwinding::

"

ZaeN wrote:

Yep very typical behaviour you won't listen to my feedback when I have a collection of 2handers with like 70% of my chars

Its simple realy. I refuse to listen to someone who does nothing else but complain for 6th league in a row and its clear he is just bored of the game and is looking for a reason to be upset and leave.

"

yamface wrote:

He's not that far off tbh.

This is hardly what I'd consider competitive:

You are looking to much into that. The reason why thats a thing is becasue players are lazy. They will always play the most automatic build there is. Even in this topic you have poeple complaining that they have to press buttons while things like spellslinger and summoners dont have to do that. Look at mines as perfect example. Always first to kill bosses, top tier damage, safe and easy to play, hardly anybody plays them. Thats just how it is and melee will always be behind because of players laziness.

"

kuciol wrote:

"

ZaeN wrote:

Yep very typical behaviour you won't listen to my feedback when I have a collection of 2handers with like 70% of my chars

Its simple realy. I refuse to listen to someone who does nothing else but complain for 6th league in a row and its clear he is just bored of the game and is looking for a reason to be upset and leave.

"

yamface wrote:

He's not that far off tbh.

This is hardly what I'd consider competitive:

You are looking to much into that. The reason why thats a thing is becasue players are lazy. They will always play the most automatic build there is. Even in this topic you have poeple complaining that they have to press buttons while things like spellslinger and summoners dont have to do that. Look at mines as perfect example. Always first to kill bosses, top tier damage, safe and easy to play, hardly anybody plays them. Thats just how it is and melee will always be behind because of players laziness.

This plus the fact that POE Ninja focusses on the top .3 amount of players that reach 97 and higher. Even considering only level 90+ builds there are significantly more players than POE Ninja ever shows.

That's quite important here because anyone attempting to grind to 100 will be all the more tempted to use a brain dead build. I love playing my slam builds but if I ever wanted to aim for 100, I most likely won't do it with one of them. If you commit yourself to this much repetition and grinding going with a braindead build is just a logical choice to ease the pain.

"

Baharoth15 wrote:

This plus the fact that POE Ninja focusses on the top .3 amount of players that reach 97 and higher. Even considering only level 90+ builds there are significantly more players than POE Ninja ever shows.

That's quite important here because anyone attempting to grind to 100 will be all the more tempted to use a brain dead build. I love playing my slam builds but if I ever wanted to aim for 100, I most likely won't do it with one of them. If you commit yourself to this much repetition and grinding going with a braindead build is just a logical choice to ease the pain.

This argument doesn't work anymore after poe ninja increased the player tracking, as I said in my first post. Steam has a lv70 achievement that only 13% of players obtained. Half of the players don't even get the brutus achievement. That 19k players that poe ninja is showing is an actual representation of what the endgame playerbase is doing

"

yamface wrote:

"

Baharoth15 wrote:

This plus the fact that POE Ninja focusses on the top .3 amount of players that reach 97 and higher. Even considering only level 90+ builds there are significantly more players than POE Ninja ever shows.

That's quite important here because anyone attempting to grind to 100 will be all the more tempted to use a brain dead build. I love playing my slam builds but if I ever wanted to aim for 100, I most likely won't do it with one of them. If you commit yourself to this much repetition and grinding going with a braindead build is just a logical choice to ease the pain.

This argument doesn't work anymore after poe ninja increased the player tracking, as I said in my first post. Steam has a lv70 achievement that only 13% of players obtained. Half of the players don't even get the brutus achievement. That 19k players that poe ninja is showing is an actual representation of what the endgame playerbase is doing

No, it's not. If I look at harvest the lowest level you can find is 96. How many players who play endgame actually go that high? And how many have done so 3 weeks into the league? I've been playing for 1,5 years now and don't have a single build that high. High level also has very little to do with whether or not those people play endgame. And limiting the screenshot to the top percentage in terms of level significantly skews the picture. If you want to know what the hardcore players go for who value ease and efficiency over everything else, then POE Ninja is the site to go. If you want to have an actual representation of the entire (high level) playerbase then it's not.