Too hard even for veterans (or why I quit after making Black Cane build)

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Prizy wrote:

Semi-Casual Veterans are probably not meant to be farming awakerner level 8 and really high-tier maps. It seems as if GGG is preparing us for a major rebalance in POE 2 where only the most optimized characters can do end game. (This is how POE was when it was originally released btw). NOTE: This is just the feeling i'm getting. This was not stated anywhere, but this is what I feel they are trying to do to slow the game down gradually and make it so that only the "extremely dedicated" playerbase gets to the ultimate end game.

Ok... Whats the point of introducing a build/character/mechanic that doesnt work in the end game?

So basically it is a trap... I see audience segmentation based on what? Based on nothing... Those who will get the knowledge somewhere will be happy to play and those who will do what they want, will leave pretty early... Pretty much what we have at the moment...


if the game lets you do what you please, it should make all of those builds equally good for any content... Otherwise it is just a very bad balance...

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430714 wrote:

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Prizy wrote:

Semi-Casual Veterans are probably not meant to be farming awakerner level 8 and really high-tier maps. It seems as if GGG is preparing us for a major rebalance in POE 2 where only the most optimized characters can do end game. (This is how POE was when it was originally released btw). NOTE: This is just the feeling i'm getting. This was not stated anywhere, but this is what I feel they are trying to do to slow the game down gradually and make it so that only the "extremely dedicated" playerbase gets to the ultimate end game.

Ok... Whats the point of introducing a build/character/mechanic that doesnt work in the end game?

So basically it is a trap... I see audience segmentation based on what? Based on nothing... Those who will get the knowledge somewhere will be happy to play and those who will do what they want, will leave pretty early... Pretty much what we have at the moment...


if the game lets you do what you please, it should make all of those builds equally good for any content... Otherwise it is just a very bad balance...

Well currently it feels like a trap. I'm assuming that as they keep tuning the end game to where they want it, they will start balancing weak skills again to be at the power level they want it to be at.

I don't disagree that balance isn't great right now, but I also won't say that this is the final version GGG envisioned.

Clearly there is work being done for 3.9x all the way up to POE 2. I'm sure as part of that they will revisit skills so they feel better. Melee needs an ENTIRE patch dedicated it, etc.

The game is still in transition imo so certain builds are traps... but I don't think that GGG intended them to be that way.

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Prizy wrote:

So a couple of things.

Based on the black cane, I do think you have to decide whether you are dealing the damage or the minions. I think going hybrid will just hurt you.


Just some thoughts.

I am dealing the damage. Black Cane gives flat pysical damage to spells for each active phantasm. The minions are there to provide said buff, and onlaught with % damage buff by guardian passive. And their own damage is just a little bunus on top. Why I chose bladefall - pys spell with 100% added effectiveness, hits multiple times in waves so more hits = more phantasms uptime, ability to offscreen is also a layer of defence, aoe I thought to be enough but it turned out to be kinda meh.

Blade vortex vould be too close range so it puts even more stress on survivability which I have none of in todays terms (7,8k es, 47%physred, fortify, some block and I've been trying arctic armor recently)

Pride is literally for melee, it works when enemies stay in the aura range. I'd rather offscreen then cast up close.

I had a diamond flask on my 1, but swapped it for quicksilver for speedrunning white master missions I had a bunch of.

Low life choice is primarily to gain armor reserving life and further benefiting from Crown of the Inward Eye. Where would I get points for aura nodes? I have to take away some from damage wich again, is low. A few points in crit gives more crit then zealotry effectivenes.

So going crit you're literally obligated to be crit capped nowadays? I dont remember the numbers but i'm way over 50%.

You see, I dont understand why is it SO bad? I wasn't planning it to be OP shapers per second dps facetank shit but atleast you know, able to do league mechanics and red maps.

No ofence but yet again I see someone with literal meta builds (chaos dot, necro and CoC assasin) so I dont think you realise how much everything else falls behind in this league.

Well this league you need to be really carefull with the map mods, its easy to rip these days.

In example, the last time I played in legion I could pop my Vaal Molten Shell and it barely budged from 30k to 20k HP for its whole duration of around 15seconds inside worst case scenarios on tier 14-16 maps.

Now I am doing the same content with less ripy mods than before, I have 25k HP Vaal Molten Shell and some metamorphs can delete the shield in matter of 1-2 seconds.

I am at a point where metamorphs are the least of my worries. I choose where to fight them, there is a lengthy animation before they show up and they die in a matter of 2-3 seconds, sometimes 5. What kills me are things like porcupines or bosses with stupid mechanics (think the underground river one with the big slam).

https://pastebin.com/6GjBtJzv

Everything in this PoB could be completely off from original build. Tree is modified. ES is 6.8k since I went for another path to see the potential for the damage and regen from zealot oath with consecrated ground. Additional Physical damage from Phantazmal Might is on the sceptre (counting as 10 phantasms from lv.20 summon phantasm support.)
The tree doesn't have increased skill effect duration to make BV work properly.

I haven't got enough experiences to abuse elemental conversion but since the build must have the Black Cane, BiS crafted weapon to gain additional elemental/chaos damage cannot be used in the build. Also I found pure physical version is more flexible (doesn't tax much for gem settings and items.)

@OP
I share your concerns with BV but it does have its advantage.

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juyevon wrote:

I think, this is a result of all the "Oh no, so much powercreep"-post from people, who aren"t even capable of killing shaper (or ever reach him). They saw all the awesome mirror tier items that were posted on reddit, knowing, that they will never ever make or afford something like that. They were angry and jealous, they cannot archive a few seconds shaper kill by themselves. To make this feeling go away, they start complaining. Writing a angry reddit post doesn't take the time and effort to dive really deep into the mechanics of the game and lern and study it for hundreds of hours. It is the fastest and easiest way to clear their anger.
But in their lack of foresight, they didn't calculate that - when GGG really deside to do something against it, - they wouldn't get any better or stronger themselves. Nerfing the top 10% of the players would make the game for the rest much more harder and perhaps even demotivating.

There is much in what you have said. I'd like to highlight one thing you said though.

GGG do make this game for the top 10% of players and streamers. Look at the XP nerf from level 80 upwards. It was to make getting to level 100 harder. I feel that very few outside of these few elites get to 100.

The OP said

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Leninisalive wrote:

It discourages any creativity even tho "make your own build, so much to choose from" is the game's PR point.

If that was really what GGG wanted, then we wouldn't have limited access to skill gems based on character class.


Thanks
X

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Leninisalive wrote:

No ofence but yet again I see someone with literal meta builds (chaos dot, necro and CoC assasin) so I dont think you realise how much everything else falls behind in this league.

To be fair, I did all of those in SSF so it's not like those builds"Woke up amazing" through trade.

I realize plenty, but also see that your tree is all so focused on defense that you won't get much damage out of you or the phantasms. Even if you have 20 phantasms at once, how much is that getting you?

Pride is not only for melee. It allows the enemies to take increased physical damage. If the phantasms are physical, and your spells are physical it is a win win.

He will be doing plenty with Vulnerability at least once he made some trade off among build progressions. I'm sure he understood what Prizy mentioned (LL costs alot.)

He got some misunderstandings based on his commitments with those who playing meta builds. It gives a lot of space to play around with game features while the build itself playing the game against the contents at some degree.

He just haven't realized how much space he made through his build crafting. I really appreciate that he shared his build.

Thank you guys for constructive criticism, I really appreciate that. May be I'll try to come back to the game after the patch if they fix some overtuned metamorph attacks and W7 memory leak (which was also one of the reasons I quit it). But still I doubt that I will make something endgame viable out of it. I guess there's a reason I see no builds based on black cane on poe.ninja, it's just not an end-game viable item. It was super fun to lvl up with it and do whites and early yellows with tho.