+1 Spectre Body Armour and the Midnight Bargain - My issues with the changes

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SilentSymphony wrote:

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robmafia wrote:

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SilentSymphony wrote:

Someone with a damned pledge of hands should not be able to have the same amount of spectres as someone using 2x Midnight bargain without a significant cost.

it's funny that the above is the basis of this entire bizarre rambling.

It's definitely part of why this thread exists but not the entirety of the reasoning behind it.

What's really funny is that despite having the largest anti power creep thread on this forum you seem to be totally fine with attacking a topic that is basically asking for power creep to be reversed.

pointing out blatant hypocrisy/your arguments' (many) flaws = "attacking a topic that is basically asking for power creep to be reversed" in your mind?

always bringing the facepalms...

like i said, you wanted power creep. you got it. i've been nothing but consistent.

and by the way, you seem to still be whooshing on this. hint: it IS that way.

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robmafia wrote:

pointing out blatant hypocrisy/your arguments' (many) flaws = "attacking a topic that is basically asking for power creep to be reversed" in your mind?

always bringing the facepalms...

like i said, you wanted power creep. you got it. i've been nothing but consistent.

and by the way, you seem to still be whooshing on this. hint: it IS that way.

You seem to like to claim i asked for this, Anyone can go to that thread you linked and clearly see that you are completely wrong and not only on that one thing but also that i was asking for power creep, Sorry to tell you that thread is not coming back and it is irrelevant in this discussion.

I'm here to discuss the imbalance created by leaving the +1 to maximum spectre Delve chest in the game versus the Midnight Bargains cost, That no matter how you look at it on most builds that are well designed the amount of power created for a build not using the midnight bargain with that extra spectre outweighs the power given by the great sacrifice of the 60% HP reserve that is not possible to mitigate in any way when using two of the wands.

Unless you have something to add formed out of actual logic and using some level of Math to prove that i am wrong then you are wasting your time.

Please feel free to continue to do as such though the Irony gives me great pleasure.

you wanted +1 spectre rare chests
you wanted +1 spectre chests to be more common

you wanted power creep. it's hilarious to watch this much backpedaling and attempts to claim otherwise.

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Unless you have something to add formed out of actual logic and using some level of Math to prove that i am wrong then you are wasting your time.

...wow. you claim pledge users have the same amount of spectres as those dual wielding midnight bargains.

hint:

x+0 = x
x+2 =x+2

less subtle hint: replace the pledge of hands with 2 midnight bargains. the amount of max specters will increase by 2. math is hard.

edit: btw, i already said all this on the bottom of page 3, but that post was conveniently evaded.

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robmafia wrote:

less subtle hint: replace the pledge of hands with 2 midnight bargains. the amount of max specters will increase by 2. math is hard.

Oh come one, you could at least try to show a tiny bit of good faith, don't you think ?

How do you dual wield midnight bargain reserving 60% of your life and use a +1 spectre chest while still having a correct charactter ?

Answer : you don't, you go for Shavronne's wrappings because 40% life left is too dangerous chaos wise for hybrid builds and with dual wielding + a spectre chest, your ES won't be super high to begin with, not even speaking of the hybrid life and ES investement to even try to make it work ( it won't ).


So yeah, the assumption is that dual wielding midnight bargain implies wearing Shavronne's wrapping, obviousy.

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Fruz wrote:

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robmafia wrote:

less subtle hint: replace the pledge of hands with 2 midnight bargains. the amount of max specters will increase by 2. math is hard.

Oh come one, you could at least try to show a tiny bit of good faith, don't you think ?

How do you dual wield midnight bargain reserving 60% of your life and use a +1 spectre chest while still having a correct charactter ?

Answer : you don't, you go for Shavronne's wrappings because 40% life left is too dangerous chaos wise for hybrid builds and with dual wielding + a spectre chest, your ES won't be super high to begin with, not even speaking of the hybrid life and ES investement to even try to make it work ( it won't ).


So yeah, the assumption is that dual wielding midnight bargain implies wearing Shavronne's wrapping, obviousy.

yeahhhhhh, i made a lot of hybrid characters. including a summoner using midnight bargains during garbinger league (also, midnight + prism guardian).

guess who had no problem with chaos damage?

fun fact: i never used a shav's. i also never wanted to. 75% chaos res makes it generally a moot point. especially for a summoner.

the only caveat would be for the chaos degens in delve that are hard to see, but that's just because the entire game's visuals are a garbage clusterfuck of crap all over the screen.

also, you're only cutting the problem by 1 (leaving 1). OP is claiming 0.

bonus fun fact: OP's theoretical pledge build could be a 2x midnight build by literally switching weapons. ie: pushing one button.

additionally, 'but less life!' is no freakin' argument when one chooses to sacrifice life for more offense... twice.


edit 2: actually, the garbinger summoner i played used skin of the loyal, for added insult to this.

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robmafia wrote:

you wanted +1 spectre rare chests
you wanted +1 spectre chests to be more common

you wanted power creep. it's hilarious to watch this much backpedaling and attempts to claim otherwise.

Time and time again you try to drag this back into that thread which is fairly pointless, The entire purpose of that thread was to make the armour more obtainable in the span of a league, nothing more or less.

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robmafia wrote:

...wow. you claim pledge users have the same amount of spectres as those dual wielding midnight bargains.

hint:

x+0 = x
x+2 =x+2

less subtle hint: replace the pledge of hands with 2 midnight bargains. the amount of max specters will increase by 2. math is hard.

They can have 5 with the gem socketed in the pledge, and anyone can have 6 by socketing into a hard to craft helmet.

The point which i will keep repeating is that the delve armours benefit is not fair to those using the midnight bargain which reserves 30-60%of your life where as you can have 5 socketed into a pledge or other OP 2hander depending on your spectre type which will offer more dps if you are smart about what you are using and socket into it.

The delve armour should be removed or changed to +level of minion in the next patch or the midnight bargain should be altered at the very least to allow reservation nodes to affect its life reservation.

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robmafia wrote:

also, you're only cutting the problem by 1 (leaving 1). OP is claiming 0.

I thought he did too, at first.
But then he specified in another post in this thread that it was only +1.




How much buffer had your 75% chaos res double midnight bargain summoner ?

There has been quite a bit of powercreep since Harbinger, I'm pretty sure that the average 'life' buffer is significantly higher than before overall.
Chaos resist is easier to access too thanks to betrayal though, and some monsters definitely hit harder ( especially league content )

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SilentSymphony wrote:

The point which i will keep repeating is that the delve armours benefit is not fair to those using the midnight bargain which reserves 30-60%of your life

yeah, this STILL makes no sense.

+1 is +1. the benefit is the same. your issue seems to be with midnight/your insistence upon using midnight, and not whatever point you seem to think you have.

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Fruz wrote:

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robmafia wrote:

also, you're only cutting the problem by 1 (leaving 1). OP is claiming 0.

I thought he did too, at first.
But then he specified in another post in this thread that it was only +1.

Spoiler

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SilentSymphony wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

So ... in short, a pledge of hands user has one less spectre than a double midnight bargain user.

correct it drives me absolutely mad

...except it's not.

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Fruz wrote:

How much buffer had your 75% chaos res double midnight bargain summoner ?

iirc, i had ~3.5-4k max life and ~7-8k es, if that's what you're asking.

i mostly switched to prism guardian later in that char's life. but i had more life reserved with that, anyway.

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Fruz wrote:

There has been quite a bit of powercreep since Harbinger, I'm pretty sure that the average 'life' buffer is significantly higher than before overall.
Chaos resist is easier to access too thanks to betrayal though, and some monsters definitely hit harder ( or league content hits harder )

it's WAY easier now to stack life/es/chaos res, that's for sure.

i played a hybrid scion in betrayal... and yes, had no problems with chaos. (we talked about that before, though). ~4-5k life/4k es, armor and crabs...

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robmafia wrote:

Except its not what?