So PoE Zombies are Feral Ghouls?

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Avio Cast wrote:

That'd be straight comedy if it was MarkGGG.

I was about to ask for a reference but google results were pretty clear =p

I was leaning towards Charan but purely because we'd actually have discussions on the forum. But in taking a serious guess, I'd go with a staffer so who knows.

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SeCKSEgai wrote:

If no wrong had been done, the proof would have simply been the artwork not changing.

Well no, that would not have been proof of that. It's a long way from unheard of for people caught out doing the wrong thing to double down, pretending it didn't happen or just straight-up refusing to act until forced to.

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GusTheCrocodile wrote:

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SeCKSEgai wrote:

If no wrong had been done, the proof would have simply been the artwork not changing.

Well no, that would not have been proof of that. It's a long way from unheard of for people caught out doing the wrong thing to double down, pretending it didn't happen or just straight-up refusing to act until forced to.

I get what you're saying, but wouldn't the reddit thread and this forum thread act as the very same catalyst to "force" such an outcome? I mean they did change the artwork after attention was brought to it.

As for people doing the wrong thing, the first thing that comes to mind is no longer allowed to be discussed in these forums anymore.

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SeCKSEgai wrote:

I get what you're saying, but wouldn't the reddit thread and this forum thread act as the very same catalyst to "force" such an outcome? I mean they did change the artwork after attention was brought to it.

It certainly seems to have been the catalyst for change, but your use of quote marks there suggests you know that "forced" isn't the same as forced. Third parties noticing and talking about it doesn't actually do anything, it's just talk. I mean ultimately not even a cease and desist notice from a copyright holder whose work has been infringed forces change; a bad actor could hold out until actual legal action had succeeded against them. And neither a C&D nor legal action may ever happen; there's no shortage of unnoticed and/or unprosecuted copyright infringement in the world.

Anyway, regardless of what the details of the situation were behind the scenes, apparently GGG have changed it? Good on them for that at least.

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SeCKSEgai wrote:

Such a verbose response arguing morality and still missing the point - once it was brought up that a potential copyright infringement had occurred, if one had taken place I figured the company would resolve it after being made aware given the legal ramifications -- The problem I had was with the reactionary response and lack of critical thinking and analysis.

You keep saying things, but they're wrong... There's plenty of "critical thinking and analysis" in this thread. And, someone pointing out that something "wrong" was done is not being unnecessarily "reactionary."

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The artwork has been changed, so it's clear that there was truth to the controversy.

[Removed by Support]

It's proof the artwork was changed. That's it.

It is "likely" it was changed because there was a negative reaction to it from the community. This likely brought on a small bit of concern regarding copyright violation, but more for the "appearance" of such than any true concern regarding civil action.

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This perception that GGG/Tencent is a massive corp and did it intentionally is still silly.

Who said they did it intentionally? I certainly did not. I pointed out numerous examples of how it could have slipped by management. And, that's what matters when one is talking about "they."

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A much more believable explanation was offered on the reddit with the artist setting up a template and forgetting to draw up new artwork later - or someone may have even using the wrong file name.

An plausible situation and one that I suggested a few posts back, myself. Doing a "mock up" is common practice to get approval for what will be more in-depth work.

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Clearly wrong was done, but very unlikely to not be in the evil corp maliciously stealing work of others yada yada.

Who are you arguing with? I never once said this was done maliciously and, further, never accepted anyone's excuse that it was done as an Easter Egg or paying homage to anything, which would again require purposeful behavior.

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And to be more specific, the line about no one caring still stands - no one held any stock in the actual result, people were either ambivalent or used it as a platform to emphasize their disgust for ggg/tencent.

Wrong is wrong. "Caring" doesn't enter into it unless one is willing to accept that as a demonstration of one's "character." Good people care about bad and "wrong" things being done. It's a pretty darn simple notion.

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Being disgusted/fed up with a company is nothing new - it's just ironic when those people continue to use the product and its forums when they harbor such negative feelings. Other people say their spiel and leave.

That's a wonderful observation... somewhere. But, it doesn't apply to me. I am neither disgusted nor "fed up" with GGG. I've never posted anything like that. I have maintained my admiration for them as a successful business.

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EDIT - speaking of having any stock in the result, why is an account that has never actually played the game even caring in the first place? A streamer needing anonymity? A Charan alt to outlet further frustrations? Maybe a staffer playing whistleblower perhaps?

[Removed by Support] I play on XBox. I have not linked my XBox account. I joined the forums when I first played PoE early last year. It had been ported in November, I think, of 2017.

There's no need to go into any conspiracy-mongering. I'm nobody. Judge me based upon what I write, Forum Medals not included.

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EDIT 2 - Despite the misgivings, at least you're putting in effort to think about what I've written. If no wrong had been done, the proof would have simply been the artwork not changing.

I always do my best to read and comprehend whatever anyone posts that is directed to me. It's the proper thing to do. And, though I do "react" abrasively when insulted or, as here, when someone is attempting to make it seem I've written something or taken a stand regarding something that I have not... Well, that's understandable I'd take exception to that.

But, it's not personal. I read each such post with a measure of respect for the poster.

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It's still unsettling to see how quickly people form their opinions based on their bias without even giving consideration to other possibilities or opposing views.

Wherever I presented an "opinion" it was stated as such. When I remarked on "fact" it was also stated as such. All my opinions on this matter are derived solely from the facts that have been presented. If I make an assumption, it's also described as such. Opinions, facts, evidence, assumptions... each should always be clearly stated for what they are.

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GusTheCrocodile wrote:

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SeCKSEgai wrote:

If no wrong had been done, the proof would have simply been the artwork not changing.

Well no, that would not have been proof of that. It's a long way from unheard of for people caught out doing the wrong thing to double down, pretending it didn't happen or just straight-up refusing to act until forced to.

Just a note on this - One way to escape an opinion of being guilty of some wrong is to avoid noticing it...

There's all sorts of different laws and the like, but it's basically a universal practice for a business to make no official action and take no official stance on something that could be a violation of some law, rule, regulation, etc. In "public."

Privately, they act to examine the issue and formulate a plan of action that formulates the risk of acting, thus admitting the "discovery" of the problem, versus the cost of fixing whatever is broke... versus the possible repercussions of further "bad things" arising from it.

There shouldn't be any direct "Official" response on the matter at all unless they deem not making such could cause troubling damage. I don't think it would be a big deal at all if they just said nothing and changed the artwork. That would be standard damage-control practice.

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Morkonan wrote:

You keep saying things, but they're wrong... There's plenty of "critical thinking and analysis" in this thread. And, someone pointing out that something "wrong" was done is not being unnecessarily "reactionary."

Yeah, not everyone automatically assumed guilt. Innocent until proven guilty is a nice concept but bias and perception tend to eliminate the justice is blind ideal.

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Morkonan wrote:

Who said they did it intentionally? I certainly did not. I pointed out numerous examples of how it could have slipped by management. And, that's what matters when one is talking about "they."

Part of critical thinking is realizing when something being said doesn't apply to you specifically.

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Morkonan wrote:

Who are you arguing with? I never once said this was done maliciously and, further, never accepted anyone's excuse that it was done as an Easter Egg or paying homage to anything, which would again require purposeful behavior.

I wasn't arguing at all until two people in particular failed to realize what I was insinuating when I said zombies aren't specifically a unique concept - It was inferring that while there could be a completely reasonable explanation to why the images were so similar, personal bias is so dominant for some people that the only perception of the truth is their own. It's one thing to make an accusation, it's another to claim it's truth without proof.

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Morkonan wrote:

Wrong is wrong. "Caring" doesn't enter into it unless one is willing to accept that as a demonstration of one's "character." Good people care about bad and "wrong" things being done. It's a pretty darn simple notion.

Simple definitely comes to mind. The inability to read between the lines is becoming frighteningly more common.

Porting to xbox and not linking, that's a completely believable explanation.

So, to put it in perspective:

If I were to react in the same behavior as I was commenting on...

[HYPOTHETICALLY]

I would look at your profile, see no characters or achievements and BELIEVE that based on that PARTIAL but FACTUAL information that you're intentionally using a secondary account to hide your real information.

Based on your own admission that's not truth - but just because it's not true it doesn't mean that I haven't already formed a thought process in my hypothetical head that I believe is fact because of my preconceived notions.

Hopefully that better explains it - note that the above is a hypothetical situation being used as an example. I have no reason to question your very reasonable explanation of why your account is essentially empty.

Lastly, on a truly unrelated note, I must be missing Charan and the other regulars. The forums are like mental games to exercise the brain after mindless repetition.

Maligaro


William Birkin

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Lazarus507 wrote:

Maligaro


William Birkin

There's no way this is real. Dear God GGG. Please tell me you didn't rip this.

Kitava looks alot like the villian from resident evil 4.