Make the endgame higher maps viable for "normal" solo characters

I just wish we had something else to do along side maps that's for exp and let maps be all about the items

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SL4Y3R wrote:

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Undon3 wrote:

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SL4Y3R wrote:

You are simply unwilling to do what everyone else is. Which is farm.

And how did I get to 83, hmm?

I am unwilling to farm to be able to farm. Yes, this layered farm is crap. I already farm high level maps, let currency that I need drop THERE, not somewhere else where it's inefficient to farm XP wise.

You play high lvl maps. You don't farm them.

Big difference.

Further, in the OP, IIRC, you were complaining about not finding upgrades. I bet you don't. Since you're not farming.

No. Upgrades and XP and currency should come from the maps that are reasonable to be run at my level, which are 70+ by now. You shouldn't need to go back to inefficient mapping, you shouldn't layer this activity.

And what you did there with "play" vs "farm" is an opinion of yours. My opinion is that I farm for XP and items in content that is reasonable and rewarding enough for me. Basically, all the "play" I do in PoE is farming for something.

0.5% XP/run with lower ilvl items, which can be as risky as a 70 map run, is NOT reasonable.

Except it can't be as risky. Since you should only be making those lvl 66-67 maps magic. While your 70+ should be high IIQ with nice item drop mods.

There isn't much difference in ilvl tiers between a lvl 72 and a 68. You would be FAR better off wearing MF gear and running low lvl maps, than wishing to get the .0000001% highest tier on highest weapon/armour uber GG item. Since you aren't really increasing your chances of rares dropping in the higher levels, because well, no MF.

It's not inefficient mapping. What you're doing is inefficient mapping. Anyways, like I said, EVERYONE else farms for currency, whether it be groups or solo.

This thread was about making higher lvl maps cheaper for solo players. Or more rewarding in that map, both lead to the same outcome. Both of these things can't/won't happen. People that pool together their resources, from farming when the group isn't running, will move faster in higher lvl mapping. As the old saying goes, "Two heads are better than one".

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return33 wrote:

Reduce (remove?) iiq party bonus - better: give +50% iiq to solo players and remove the party bonus, so no change for 2 man parties, buff for solo, nerf for faceroll 3+ parties

This makes total sense. Unfortunately, I doubt it will get implemented.

Why does grouping, which actually makes content EASIER and FASTER to clear--mob health increases to 250%, but group DPS increases AT MINIMUM to 600% (not taking into account scaling bonuses like auras, curses, buffs/debuffs, etc.)--give MORE REWARD than the RISKIER situation of a solo player at 100% effective health and 100% effective DPS facing mobs who are also at 100% effective health and 100% effective DPS?

In these scenarios:

- Group play provides MORE REWARD for LESS RISK.
- Solo play provides LESS REWARD for MORE RISK.

This is backwards.

"Everyone else" is from your limited knowledge. I have NOTHING against currency farming, but in maps that are reasonably XP rewarding. I couldn't care less for 0.5% XP/run maps.
"Everyone else" you mention are just submitting to the RNG waltz GGG imposes just to advance, suck it up style. I'd rather point out the deficiencies of the system instead of submission.

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This thread was about making higher lvl maps cheaper for solo players. Or more rewarding in that map, both lead to the same outcome. Both of these things can't/won't happen. People that pool together their resources, from farming when the group isn't running, will move faster in higher lvl mapping. As the old saying goes, "Two heads are better than one".

You can bet it is. I want same efficiency for solo, because for me (any many others), MP is BROKEN. i don't care of moving faster or competing with anybody. I want to do my solo runs, not bothered by anybody, on my own pace, and get the same rewards as I would get on groups.

BTW, is this an ARPG, or MMO? Because it works like an MMO in this aspect. I don't mind this, but then go further with the MMOisation and stop mixing stuff like people mix drinks at a party with the obvious after-effects.

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Why does grouping, which actually makes content EASIER and FASTER to clear--mob health increases to 250%, but group DPS increases AT MINIMUM to 600% (not taking into account scaling bonuses like auras, curses, buffs/debuffs, etc.)--give MORE REWARD than the RISKIER situation of a solo player at 100% effective health and 100% effective DPS facing mobs who are also at 100% effective health and 100% effective DPS?

Exactly this.

Why, GGG? Why less risk-->more reward? Why not big risks-->big rewards?

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Villainelle wrote:

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return33 wrote:

Reduce (remove?) iiq party bonus - better: give +50% iiq to solo players and remove the party bonus, so no change for 2 man parties, buff for solo, nerf for faceroll 3+ parties

This makes total sense. Unfortunately, I doubt it will get implemented.

Why does grouping, which actually makes content EASIER and FASTER to clear--mob health increases to 250%, but group DPS increases AT MINIMUM to 600% (not taking into account scaling bonuses like auras, curses, buffs/debuffs, etc.)--give MORE REWARD than the RISKIER situation of a solo player at 100% effective health and 100% effective DPS facing mobs who are also at 100% effective health and 100% effective DPS?

In these scenarios:

- Group play provides MORE REWARD for LESS RISK.
- Solo play provides LESS REWARD for MORE RISK.

This is backwards.

While I am not saying group play couldn't use any tweaking. The bolded part is flat out incorrect. I opened up several pub games last night in maps. Found out, that with a full group, it was taking me MORE time to complete maps. This is even with everyone sticking together.

I was actually able to clear content faster solo (in these several cases). So no, it is not a minimum of 600% increase in DPS. Sometimes, apparently, it can be a lot less.

Undon, you can actually get MORE rewards solo than in groups. There is a reason why people when doing MF runs do them solo. You can kill everything with a ton of IIQ and IIR. This is not the case in parties. It becomes a pain in the ass to make sure a dedicated MF'er gets the final hit, and slows down gameplay.

This is the last time I'm saying it:

Do not push us back in low-level content to farm some stuff to be able to farm the XP-viable content. Let currency/gear drop from sufficient enough, reasonably XP-viable content (whose availability should not be completely RING-dependant). I don't want rewards from lower level 0.5% XP maps, I want them for the reasonably viable maps. I don't want godly gear either, I want incremental rewards. All reasonable. I don't want ladder status either. Just want to do my solo stuff, while advancing reasonably. 0.5%/run is not reasonable.

Smooth progression.

BTW, key word is reasonable. Layered farming is NOT reasonable. I believe an average 4% XP/run is what I would call reasonable. Not good, still annoyingly low, would still take 4 entire map runs to put you out of a death XP hole. It still takes days of 6-7 hours/day for one sole level - if you manage to stay alive.

And for divinity's sake, do not treat rehashed content like it is some awesome gear, rarity wise.

You do know that at lvl 93+, even running solely lvl77 maps will not get you 4% per run. What you are asking for is actually entirely unreasonable. At lvl99, it would take something like 500 lvl77 maps to reach 100

You're gonna hit a wall no matter what. Let's say you have an unlimited supply of 77s, when you reach the next wall, would you start complaining again?

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SL4Y3R wrote:

You do know that at lvl 93+, even running solely lvl77 maps will not get you 4% per run. What you are asking for is actually entirely unreasonable. At lvl99, it would take something like 500 lvl77 maps to reach 100

You're gonna hit a wall no matter what. Let's say you have an unlimited supply of 77s, when you reach the next wall, would you start complaining again?

It is a perpetual issue. GGG needs to keep the higher levels occupied with incremental content as they overlevel it, hence they already released new higher level maps if I remember correctly. I assume level 100 max is just temporary.

Or, as suggested before by other people than me, needs to provide alternative endgame challenges.

I also suggested before that the overall levelling should be smoother and with no apparent walls.

And also, even the max level is not a wall if it is pushed further, or if new endgame content is added that requires max level and so on.

The conclusion is, the endgame needs to be streamlined and there should not be any ridiculous obstacles - just to "OMG, let's keep them away from lvl. 100". Progression should be constant and interesting, with better challenges.

Farming layers are not challenges, are CHORES.

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Undon3 wrote:

The conclusion is, the endgame needs to be streamlined and there should not be any ridiculous obstacles - just to "OMG, let's keep them away from lvl. 100". Progression should be constant and interesting, with better challenges.

Farming layers are not challenges, are CHORES.

I told you once i'll say it again. If you feel the need to reach 100 in a short amount of time and in a "streamlined way" - get over it. It is a soft cap. Do you know what that means?

Would you be bloody happier if you reached the cap at the end of merciless?
If yes, PRETEND YOU DID.
Games are finite. The content has to end at some point.
Whining because the also offered us a sandbox-y end game (which you should consider as an extra) at the end of the campaign is simply retarded.

Take D3 for example. It caps you at the end of the content and after that farming items is the only bloody thing you do. Would you be happier if that exp bar went away here as well? Would you be happier if there was no map system and you had to make piety runs like in D2?


PS: Every time you say the word "streamlining" a poor kitten dies, so please don't mention it again.

EditPS: Repeat - get over this crappy new age MMO mentality OR GO PLAY ONE.