Path of Exile, Gameplay Criticism

I bet the guys that moderate chat and forums have a very active roll in game development.

EDIT: fck you Fruz I don't want to agree with you.

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Relationship wrote:

Why is there a reasoning behind removing posts but not an actual response to
Since people are directed here for questions regarding game, balance and feedback then you would think they would be able to comment in the area they directed you to. Correct?

What asinine world do you live in?...

I've complained about moderators for legitimate reasons but are you serious? No you can't be serious, but what was the position on the actual thread? Why don't you let me shit on you based on a feedback opinion, you know, in honor of the obnoxious shit you quoted and gave reasoning to.

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theD4nk0wl wrote:

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Relationship wrote:

Why is there a reasoning behind removing posts but not an actual response to
Since people are directed here for questions regarding game, balance and feedback then you would think they would be able to comment in the area they directed you to. Correct?

What asinine world do you live in?...

I've complained about moderators for legitimate reasons but are you serious? No you can't be serious, but what was the position on the actual thread? Why don't you let me shit on you based on a feedback opinion, you know, in honor of the obnoxious shit you quoted and gave reasoning to.

Complaining that although support directs you here to get certain types of questions answered by staff and then they don't proceed to answer anyone's questions/concerns isn't a legitimate reason to be irritated?

You've made it clear you have had what you believe to be "legitimate" complaints about moderators if the reason above doesn't qualify what reasons do you find that are legitimate?

@OP: Thanks for the best summary of poe's problems ever!

@OP

I think much of the 'issues' with PoE stem from how most players choose to play it. It IS a difficult game for the vast majority but most people just follow meta builds and effectively cheat that process. For all of the thousands of players who 'face-roll' content each league; how many of them got their on their own merit/capabilities?

GGG offers a lot of ways to make the game more challenging (I do agree that alt+f4 to 'win' is terrible game design and should not be supported but still up to the player to not abuse it). The challenge is there for those who want it:

-Make your own builds
-Play HC
-Play SSF
-Play in private leagues with additional stipulations or play in SC and self-impose them.


I feel that no matter what changes are implemented there will be a 'most efficient way to play' that will be figured out by the more knowledgeable players. That way of playing will be shared and become meta still. Granted, such a meta might look different than the one we know now, but relative to how the game will be played by the community; nothing will be different. You'll still have an issue of the meta dictating how the game is played. Slowing down clear speed and adjusting resource management doesn't change that.

It's the same for TCGs. Certain decks are more efficient and have higher win %. One could complain about poor balance design but whatever gets 'buffed' or 'nerfed' to address the issue is irrelevant. There will always be a 'top meta' way of playing because it's a relative measurement.

PoE's "problem" is that it isn't a shallow game (despite the end result giving that impression). Much of the difficulty is overcome by the learning process and that process is a very slow one - so slow in fact that the changes GGG DOES implement each league is often enough to impede the average player further. I don't think there's anything wrong with people who have invested 1000s of hours then being able to 'plow through content' - That's a natural result of anything in life that you've sunk so many hours into. The issue comes back to the average player; They have expectations set by previous games they've played before. They come to PoE and find that all of their knowledge/experience in other games does not help - it can often be a detriment (look at the new player's common misconception of what a "class" is in PoE). To get past this barrier, most new players simply follow guides (often at the suggestion of more experienced players). Is that GGG's fault? Is it their job to fix? How do you "fix" a game that offers depth? It has to be up to the player to stick with it; if they cheat the process to get a faster start, they should forfeit the right to complain about difficulty.

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muzein wrote:

I think much of the 'issues' with PoE stem from how most players choose to play it. It IS a difficult game for the vast majority but most people just follow meta builds and effectively cheat that process. For all of the thousands of players who 'face-roll' content each league; how many of them got their on their own merit/capabilities?

GGG offers a lot of ways to make the game more challenging (I do agree that alt+f4 to 'win' is terrible game design and should not be supported but still up to the player to not abuse it). The challenge is there for those who want it:

-Make your own builds
-Play HC
-Play SSF
-Play in private leagues with additional stipulations or play in SC and self-impose them.

Currently, I think the game doesn't provide enough "involuntary" challenge; the kind that forms the common experience of the game. (I'll explain more later)

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muzein wrote:

I feel that no matter what changes are implemented there will be a 'most efficient way to play' that will be figured out by the more knowledgeable players. That way of playing will be shared and become meta still. Granted, such a meta might look different than the one we know now, but relative to how the game will be played by the community; nothing will be different. You'll still have an issue of the meta dictating how the game is played. Slowing down clear speed and adjusting resource management doesn't change that.

It's the same for TCGs. Certain decks are more efficient and have higher win %. One could complain about poor balance design but whatever gets 'buffed' or 'nerfed' to address the issue is irrelevant. There will always be a 'top meta' way of playing because it's a relative measurement.

I'm inclined to agree regarding PvE metas. However, it's possible to have a slower progressing meta that goes through phases, such as with a lot of MMOs. In POE, metas are established almost immediately even though leagues last for a few months. I think it's very within our grasp to "soften the meta", and make the differences between meta and non-meta much less extreme.

Imagine we saw different kinds of builds at the top of each endgame activity, rather than nuke-the-screen being good at everything.

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muzein wrote:

PoE's "problem" is that it isn't a shallow game (despite the end result giving that impression). Much of the difficulty is overcome by the learning process and that process is a very slow one - so slow in fact that the changes GGG DOES implement each league is often enough to impede the average player further. I don't think there's anything wrong with people who have invested 1000s of hours then being able to 'plow through content' - That's a natural result of anything in life that you've sunk so many hours into. The issue comes back to the average player; They have expectations set by previous games they've played before. They come to PoE and find that all of their knowledge/experience in other games does not help - it can often be a detriment (look at the new player's common misconception of what a "class" is in PoE). To get past this barrier, most new players simply follow guides (often at the suggestion of more experienced players). Is that GGG's fault? Is it their job to fix? How do you "fix" a game that offers depth? It has to be up to the player to stick with it; if they cheat the process to get a faster start, they should forfeit the right to complain about difficulty.

You're talking about the trial-and-error difficulty of figuring out a build that works. I was talking more about the real time game-play sort of difficulty.

The problem isn't that metas exist, or that players can follow guides to get into them. It's more like, the qualities that define the meta are too simple to make use of all that depth.

The full patch notes may reveal more, but based on the revelations so far I don't see a desire to tackle the underlying issues talked about in this very thread. Re-balance some spell skills against each other, but don't balance the game itself, the core mechanics.

As long as that isn't done the central gameplay will probably remain "kill the screen or get one-shot", generally speaking.

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Pangaearocks wrote:

The full patch notes may reveal more, but based on the revelations so far I don't see a desire to tackle the underlying issues talked about in this very thread. Re-balance some spell skills against each other, but don't balance the game itself, the core mechanics.

As long as that isn't done the central gameplay will probably remain "kill the screen or get one-shot", generally speaking.

If i was a dev. and someone showed me a video where person says '' support is not a role in rpg games'' i wouldnt take that video seriously either.

edited:I know OP was joking. I am just messing around dont mind me.

So the patch notes are out and there are more nerfs than I first thought, but for the most part it looks fairly marginal. Doesn't look like they're doing anything to the underlying mechanics, it's just about tweaking some numbers here and there, which will be tweaked more during future patches. Unless they look at the bigger picture, however, all the problems heavily covered in this thread will still remain.

I will skip this league.

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Pangaearocks wrote:

So the patch notes are out and there are more nerfs than I first thought, but for the most part it looks fairly marginal. Doesn't look like they're doing anything to the underlying mechanics, it's just about tweaking some numbers here and there, which will be tweaked more during future patches. Unless they look at the bigger picture, however, all the problems heavily covered in this thread will still remain.

I will skip this league.

why would u expect an instant change in this game according to 1 thread that suggested mid league?