Scam

What is the scam policy of the GGG? Is there any at all? What about personal experiences?

Just been scammed and looking what I can do about it.
Last edited by panmisiek123 on Jul 8, 2018, 4:59:51 AM
Last bumped on Jul 10, 2018, 1:09:53 PM
You can add that person in question to your black list and never see him again.
Else social platforms dont care for name of the game. Here tho we all have right and obligation to not be named for.

For RMT and such tho you can do things, as for chaos/exalt lets just say that virtual currency really should not bleed out influence on RL of real persons, guilty or not.
Last edited by nEVER_BoRN on Jul 8, 2018, 5:57:50 AM
There is absolutely no mention of scamming in any public official GGG materials. The Terms of Use and the forum Code of Conduct do not contain the word "scam" or anything else alluding to the commonly understood meaning of the word.

Trading between a Softcore and a Hardcore league is explicitly at your own risk. Although from 2013, the thread is still stickied in that forum section. Chris himself explains:

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Chris wrote:
Cross-league trades are performed at your own risk. There is nothing we can do if someone scams you. Do not trade items between leagues that you are not fully prepared to lose.


Chris also mentions in a Q&A thread from 2016 (emphasis mine):

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Chris wrote:
Is there a legal reason for the strict no name & shame policy?

No, but it's the only way that we can practically operate. The trade screen is designed to protect people against most scam attempts - it forces you to check items before you can accept them. In terms of bad behaviour, accusing someone of being a scammer is even easier than actually pulling off a scam. We cannot investigate each reported case in detail to see if accusations are accurate. Initially, this wasn't our policy. We allowed naming and shaming, but the overwhelming feedback was that the false defamation was far worse.


Aside from these vague quotes, GGG has never explicitly defined what constitutes a "scam" in Path of Exile, or what, if any, punishment is appropriate for people scamming others. And trust me, this is something I would know about, if it existed.




However, in 2016, Samantha recommends reporting scammers to support (again, without even a vague explanation of what is considered scamming):

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Samantha wrote:
I recommend reporting scammers to us directly at support@grindinggear.com. These reports are extremely helpful to us in that it helps us to build a profile around players, and helps us towards making decisions about how to deal with these people in future. I understand why it might appear futile to report scammers to us, but it is in fact quite important and the more reports we get on a player means that we will have a more detailed case when investigating players, the more flexibility we would have when choosing to remove offending accounts.


And Gary_GGG explicitly states that:

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Gary_GGG wrote:
Players can be and have been permanently banned from the game in the past for scamming.

and further down the thread:
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Gary_GGG wrote:
We can't comment on specific players or instances that have happened previously. The accounts team does however look into accusations of scamming. My post was made in regards to people wanting to know if they or other people can get banned if they engage in scamming.


Specific rules or specific actions people have been punished for have not been mentioned, and requests for explanation of the policy in the same thread have been either ignored or avoided.




To the best of my understanding of the Terms of Use, which I have read through numerous times, both regarding this question and otherwise, the only clauses applicable to scamming are sections 6 and 17 (emphasis mine):

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6. Licence: Grinding Gear Games grants you a limited licence (“Licence”) for the purpose of accessing, as applicable downloading, and making use of the Website, Materials and Services (or any parts of such as Grinding Gear Games may make available to you from time to time) and the related Rights for your own personal and non-commercial use in accordance with these Terms of Use. For the further avoidance of doubt, pursuant to clause 4, any rights you may have in respect of any elements or aspects of PoE (including without limitation in respect of the in-game characters and Virtual Items) are strictly limited to a personal ‘licence to use’ such as part of the Licence and at no time do you acquire any ownership rights in respect of such. Any contravention by you of these Terms of Use or any other terms or conditions notified to you by Grinding Gear Games or any behaviour which Grinding Gear Games deems in its sole discretion is not in keeping with the intended spirit of participation in PoE, immediately terminates the Licence, or such aspect of the Licence as Grinding Gear Games may otherwise provide you notice of. Termination of the Licence, or any aspect of the Licence, by Grinding Gear Games may without limitation also result in the taking of any of the further actions described in clause 17.


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17. Cancellation of Membership: Grinding Gear Games reserves the right, acting at its sole discretion, to refuse to accept your registration request for a Member Account. To the greatest extent permitted by law, Grinding Gear Games also reserves the right, acting at its sole discretion, at any time to cancel your registration and access to your Member Account or to restrict, limit or otherwise change your existing rights of access to your Member Account, or any specific feature or benefit afforded to you in relation to your Member Account, including without limitation in respect of any Virtual Items, if it believes you have breached these Terms of Use or any other agreements you may have with Grinding Gear Games or for any other reason whatsoever. In such event you agree that Grinding Gear Games will not be required to provide you with prior notice or explanation in respect of such action. Notwithstanding the cancellation of access to your Member Account in any case, you agree you will remain fully liable for any outstanding liability owed to Grinding Gear Games.


This is the only part of the agreement between a player and GGG that lets them close your account for scamming, and it gives them the same right to close your account because of your terrible spelling or because you beat Chris in Fortnite.

Just to be clear: I am not disputing this particular rule. If you read the ToS of basically any subscription service in the world, they will contain something to this effect. Companies put this there so that they have the final word if you try to get around your contract through various loopholes or unclear interpretations of the rules. Having a rule like this is completely normal. It is not my place to judge whether applying it to something as broad and as widespread as scamming is appropriate.




And finally, to make this very explicit: I am not a GGG employee, and I am not affiliated with GGG in any way. Treat this post as nothing more than "some kid on the internet said". I can not guarantee any action that will or will not be taken against anybody's account as a consequence of any of their activities. If you want an official answer to your questions about GGG rules and policies, you need to contact GGG directly at support@grindinggear.com.
Last edited by Abdiel_Kavash on Jul 8, 2018, 9:39:42 PM
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Abdiel_Kavash wrote:
<snip>
Specific rules or specific actions people have been punished for have not been mentioned, and requests for explanation of the policy in the same thread have been either ignored or avoided.
<snip>


Thanks for the comprehensive post... I'm mentally bookmarking it.

You may want to add this little gem from after you posted, which kind of explains their logic for the report system:

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I'm very sorry but it's our policy not to get involved in player item/service disputes, as we don't have the resources to fully investigate each one and police them.

A player is unlikely to get a ban for scamming, but I've taken a note of the account in question, and will be flagging it to keep an eye on. When players report others for any kind of behaviour, from scamming, to real world trading, to abusing a bug, this goes on their record. If they accumulate an extremely bad reputation then we will look at taking things further or finding other ways to resolve these issues. It frequently occurs that players who have bad reputations are often committing more serious and ban-able offenses.

These reports are extremely helpful to us in that it helps us to build a profile around players, and helps us towards making decisions about how to deal with these people in future. I understand why it might appear futile to report scammers to us, but it is in fact quite important and the more reports we get on a player means that we will have a more detailed case when investigating players, the more flexibility we would have when choosing to remove offending accounts.

I hope this helps. I would like to encourage you to send reports to us. These do not go ignored or wasted.
Need game info? Check out the Wiki at: https://www.poewiki.net/

Contact support@grindinggear.com for account issues. Check out How to Report Bugs + Post Images at: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/18347
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adghar wrote:
You may want to add this little gem from after you posted, which kind of explains their logic for the report system


Thanks!

Posts that are not written directly by GGG staff are always painful to look up and reference...

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