Honestly fuck these loot boxes.

"

BossOfThisGym wrote:

There is nothing wrong with gambling, and about young kids using CC to buy things. That's just bad parenting. You want the government to step in every aspect of your life? Gambling is bad so I want the government to make it illegal. I don't want to take responsibility for my shitty parenting so I want the government to step in and mitigate possible consequences. If a kid is old enough to understand how to use a CC to pay for something but doesn't realize stealing from their parents is wrong you really fucked up as a parent I'm sorry. And even if your kid is that way why are you allowing them access to those things? It's like getting mad a dog for biting someone because the owner let them outside without supervision/leash.


It's fine to criticize and tell GGG that you hate the lootboxes, but it's not OK to say it should be illegal.

Wrong. It is illegal to gamble under age 21. These boxes are gambling. Also it is illegal for casinos to alter your chances of winning at certain games. The reason this is illegal is because it is unfair to the consumer. Right now there are no such regulations for gambling boxes so video games can do whatever they want for your odds of winning. This is crazy. This is why it needs to be regulated.

There is nothing wrong with gambling when it is regulated and you are not underage. Gambling boxes are not regulated and underage people buy them. I agree the parents hold some responsibility for their kids actions. That is for sure. But It doesn't change the fact that what GGG is doing is unethical and should be illegal. It will be illegal eventually. Just like gambling underage is illegal already.

"

Hard to say, from my perspective I would just sellout after I get bored in a league and never buy MTX again. I'm a bit tempted to actually buy some of the new mtx right now. But i play a lot so maybe more casual players who won't be able to acquire a huge currency base each league might use their credit card to get a leg up on currency in game.

Thinking about it more im probably wrong, and ya they would sell more MTX and there would be a hit even if only a small one to the current RMT.

But i wonder how it would effect the in game economy, in games like arche age with official RMT in game currency is worth substantially more when there is more demand for it a lot of supply via what would be MTX in this game. But it can also crash the currency and make it so you have to RMT to compete at all. As in it could drive up prices of items in games for regular players not taking part in this.

Heh. It is interesting to think about. I actually don't even know if GGG will let you buy microtransactions for a friend. I wonder if you can? I feel like they would let you do it but it could be a slippery slope. They probably don't let you do it for fear of RMT.

"

Orbitalx wrote:

"

BossOfThisGym wrote:

There is nothing wrong with gambling, and about young kids using CC to buy things. That's just bad parenting. You want the government to step in every aspect of your life? Gambling is bad so I want the government to make it illegal. I don't want to take responsibility for my shitty parenting so I want the government to step in and mitigate possible consequences. If a kid is old enough to understand how to use a CC to pay for something but doesn't realize stealing from their parents is wrong you really fucked up as a parent I'm sorry. And even if your kid is that way why are you allowing them access to those things? It's like getting mad a dog for biting someone because the owner let them outside without supervision/leash.


It's fine to criticize and tell GGG that you hate the lootboxes, but it's not OK to say it should be illegal.

Wrong. It is illegal to gamble under age 21. These boxes are gambling. Also it is illegal for casinos to alter your chances of winning at certain games. The reason this is illegal is because it is unfair to the consumer. Right now there are no such regulations for gambling boxes so video games can do whatever they want for your odds of winning. This is crazy. This is why it needs to be regulated.

There is nothing wrong with gambling when it is regulated and you are not underage. Gambling boxes are not regulated and underage people buy them. I agree the parents hold some responsibility for their kids actions. That is for sure. But It doesn't change the fact that what GGG is doing is unethical and should be illegal. It will be illegal eventually. Just like gambling underage is illegal already.

Im not even going to get into how dumb age threshold laws are, but how is gambling unfair to the consumer? When I buy an lootbox in this game, I know that it is up to chance as to what im going to get. In fact GGG even released the exact odds? It's a voluntary act, I agree to spend some of my money in order to gamble on a chance to get some items I would like and GGG is happy to take my money.

What is unfair, is the fact that other people can use the government to remove something I voluntarily enjoy that doesn't effect anyone but myself and my own money. Stealing is wrong, but you don't get mad at gambling because someone stole to gamble. Why should someone who can't control their gambling habits, or their children... have power over what I'm allowed to do?

"

Orbitalx wrote:

"

BossOfThisGym wrote:

There is nothing wrong with gambling, and about young kids using CC to buy things. That's just bad parenting. You want the government to step in every aspect of your life? Gambling is bad so I want the government to make it illegal. I don't want to take responsibility for my shitty parenting so I want the government to step in and mitigate possible consequences. If a kid is old enough to understand how to use a CC to pay for something but doesn't realize stealing from their parents is wrong you really fucked up as a parent I'm sorry. And even if your kid is that way why are you allowing them access to those things? It's like getting mad a dog for biting someone because the owner let them outside without supervision/leash.


It's fine to criticize and tell GGG that you hate the lootboxes, but it's not OK to say it should be illegal.

Wrong. It is illegal to gamble under age 21. These boxes are gambling. Also it is illegal for casinos to alter your chances of winning at certain games. The reason this is illegal is because it is unfair to the consumer. Right now there are no such regulations for gambling boxes so video games can do whatever they want for your odds of winning. This is crazy. This is why it needs to be regulated.

There is nothing wrong with gambling when it is regulated and you are not underage. Gambling boxes are not regulated and underage people buy them. I agree the parents hold some responsibility for their kids actions. That is for sure. But It doesn't change the fact that what GGG is doing is unethical and should be illegal. It will be illegal eventually. Just like gambling underage is illegal already.

As you put in your post already you are well aware that first of all, lootboxes have not been made 'gambling' yet. And second of all, because of that they aren't illegal. Comparing them to a casino kinda makes your point even weaker as it already is. And the fact that the lootboxes available in PoE are very very limited in contents makes them different, different enough to not put them on 1 pile with all the other lootboxes. I'm honestly getting abit tired of everyone having to be protected from everything attitude. What are we gonna end up on at the end?

"

BossOfThisGym wrote:

"

Orbitalx wrote:

"

BossOfThisGym wrote:

There is nothing wrong with gambling, and about young kids using CC to buy things. That's just bad parenting. You want the government to step in every aspect of your life? Gambling is bad so I want the government to make it illegal. I don't want to take responsibility for my shitty parenting so I want the government to step in and mitigate possible consequences. If a kid is old enough to understand how to use a CC to pay for something but doesn't realize stealing from their parents is wrong you really fucked up as a parent I'm sorry. And even if your kid is that way why are you allowing them access to those things? It's like getting mad a dog for biting someone because the owner let them outside without supervision/leash.


It's fine to criticize and tell GGG that you hate the lootboxes, but it's not OK to say it should be illegal.

Wrong. It is illegal to gamble under age 21. These boxes are gambling. Also it is illegal for casinos to alter your chances of winning at certain games. The reason this is illegal is because it is unfair to the consumer. Right now there are no such regulations for gambling boxes so video games can do whatever they want for your odds of winning. This is crazy. This is why it needs to be regulated.

There is nothing wrong with gambling when it is regulated and you are not underage. Gambling boxes are not regulated and underage people buy them. I agree the parents hold some responsibility for their kids actions. That is for sure. But It doesn't change the fact that what GGG is doing is unethical and should be illegal. It will be illegal eventually. Just like gambling underage is illegal already.

Im not even going to get into how dumb age threshold laws are, but how is gambling unfair to the consumer? When I buy an lootbox in this game, I know that it is up to chance as to what im going to get. In fact GGG even released the exact odds? It's a voluntary act, I agree to spend some of my money in order to gamble on a chance to get some items I would like and GGG is happy to take my money.

What is unfair, is the fact that other people can use the government to remove something I voluntarily enjoy that doesn't effect anyone but myself and my own money. Stealing is wrong, but you don't get mad at gambling because someone stole to gamble. Why should someone who can't control their gambling habits, or their children... have power over what I'm allowed to do?

Age threshold for gambling is one of the few that make sense actually. Kids have a lot less self control and it is much easier for them to spend thousands of dollars of their money or their parents because they don't understand what they are doing. Also I didn't say regulated gambling is unfair to the consumer. These unregulated gambling boxes are.

GGG is misleading you about your chances actually. See below

"
Completed 32 ChallengesOrbitalx wrote:
I truly hope they do ban in game gambling like these mystery boxes. There is too much potential for misleading people. GGG is flat out misleading people with their mystery boxes.

"The possible outcomes from your mystery box range in value from 30 points all the way up to 320 points! "

This is true but only for the first box. If you get a duplicate it is worth 0 points to you. You should change the wording. It should say, "The possible outcomes from your mystery box range in value from 30 points all the way up to 320 points on your first box. After that it ranges from 0 points all the way up to 320 points."

Also, each box does not average 110 points. The first box averages 110 points (if you say so). After the first box each additional box will average less and less points the more you buy.

"
Completed 40 ChallengesGravytrader wrote:
Rough math would have the average value of the first box you purchase at 110 points. As you buy more the average value decreases assuming you value duplicates as zero.

On average, box value would be (using more rough math):
1st box: 110 points
5th box: 101 points
10th box: 91 points
15th box: 81 points
20th box: 73 points
30th box: 59 points
40th box: 47 points
50th box: 38 points
60th box: 31 points
61st box: 29.92 points



The government should not remove gambling for you unless you are under 21 years old. Once you are 21 you should be able to gamble but you should have a fair chance at winning and these odds need to be regulated. They are not right now. As you can see above, even GGG's odds are not really right.

"

Orbitalx wrote:

The government should not remove gambling for you unless you are under 21 years old. Once you are 21 you should be able to gamble but you should have a fair chance at winning and these odds need to be regulated. They are not right now. As you can see above, even GGG's odds are not really right.

Please stop saying 21y old aswell. I assume these are American laws, they don't apply to most countries.

The MTX for RMT is a sticky wicket, but a really viable argument against being able to trade MTX items and GGG is well within their right to make that decision.

How about alternatives?

How about, when you open a box it presents you with 4 random items and you can only pick 1. That would at least lower your chances of duplicates until you have purchased quite a few. People would be much more likely to buy them, I would think.

Honestly, trying to balance legal gambling age for every county in the world that has PoE players, trying to argue if it is in fact considered legal or illegal gambling (it is gambling by definition, but possibly not so in a legal sense that GGG could argue, I'm no law talking guy) and the array of other issues, it might simply be easier for GGG to get rid of them altogether. Or they could just ignore all this and keep on keeping on.

"

Miská wrote:

"

Orbitalx wrote:

The government should not remove gambling for you unless you are under 21 years old. Once you are 21 you should be able to gamble but you should have a fair chance at winning and these odds need to be regulated. They are not right now. As you can see above, even GGG's odds are not really right.

Please stop saying 21y old aswell. I assume these are American laws, they don't apply to most countries.

What is the age in your country? Also, there is a reason casinos check ID. If they didn't, people under legal gambling age would still gamble. They check id so they are not breaking any laws. GGG and video game companies do not check ID before you purchase gambling boxes. So even if the age was 18, they still do not verify your age before you purchase gambling boxes.

"

Orbitalx wrote:

"

Miská wrote:

"

Orbitalx wrote:

The government should not remove gambling for you unless you are under 21 years old. Once you are 21 you should be able to gamble but you should have a fair chance at winning and these odds need to be regulated. They are not right now. As you can see above, even GGG's odds are not really right.

Please stop saying 21y old aswell. I assume these are American laws, they don't apply to most countries.

What is the age in your country? Also, there is a reason casinos check ID. If they didn't, people under legal gambling age would still gamble. They check id so they are not breaking any laws. GGG and video game companies do not check ID before you purchase gambling boxes. So even if the age was 18, they still do not verify your age before you purchase gambling boxes.

Depends on what you asking for. 16 for some form of gambling, 18 for casinos. But this is real life. There is plenty of gambling online that only require small forms of ID if any at all. I know that America has taken down alot of gambling and made it impossible to reach those sites, but again that's just a tiny part of the world. The rest of the world (thank god) doesn't believe the goverment should be deciding what you do and don't.

I mean if countries make distinguishment between types of gambling I think something like GGG is offering would be counted as something very minor. That is IF they will even call this gambling.

"

What is the age in your country? Also, there is a reason casinos check ID. If they didn't, people under legal gambling age would still gamble. They check id so they are not breaking any laws. GGG and video game companies do not check ID before you purchase gambling boxes. So even if the age was 18, they still do not verify your age before you purchase gambling boxes.

"

Depends on what you asking for. 16 for some form of gambling, 18 for casinos. But this is real life. There is plenty of gambling online that only require small forms of ID if any at all. I know that America has taken down alot of gambling and made it impossible to reach those sites, but again that's just a tiny part of the world. The rest of the world (thank god) doesn't believe the goverment should be deciding what you do and don't.

I mean if countries make distinguishment between types of gambling I think something like GGG is offering would be counted as something very minor. That is IF they will even call this gambling.

Do you think gambling should at least be regulated though so people don't get screwed over?

Gambling boxes are for sure gambling. You are risking money to win something and you can actually get duplicates which imo (and most people's opinion) are worth zero. You are paying for a chance at something and you can get nothing so you are gambling. This is of course after the first box you buy. The first box is the only legit fair box. After that you are gambling. The more boxes you buy, you have a worse chance of getting something that isn't a duplicate.

The fact that you said "If they would call this gambling" is why these boxes are so shady and unethical. Do you honestly think when you buy these you are not gambling with real money?