Is there a way to report scammer?

"
Completed 24 ChallengesBone2flesh wrote:


Nobody agrees to anything upfront OR even if they do it is absolutely irrelevant (except from maybe a moral stand point) considering that the only agreement that matters is both parties pressing the accept button of the trade window AFTER and only AFTER both check each others items.

1. A real in game scam:

- Person A advertised Ulaman for 10 C and charges up front with the portal blocked off.

- Person B trust A and accepts goes to the hideout and payed the 10 C.

- Person A kicks person B.

- Person B was scammed by person A for 10 C.




In your words, Person B wasn't scammed, because he confirmed the trade. Either your both examples are scams, or neither.



In POE's trading, you are bartering before you get to the trading phase. Agreeing on the terms.

If I message to you that i buy your Bisco's with 20 Exalts, you'll expect to get those 20 exalts. I'll join your party, put 20 Exalts in the trade window and cancel the trade to change them to 2 Exalts. Would you congratulate me for my great bartering skills, or call me a scammer?

"
Completed 24 ChallengesBone2flesh wrote:
Verbal agreements between strangers (especially under the anonymity of the internet and when the medium has no rules against it - GGG TOS) without witnesses and in most countries with as well MEAN absolutely nothing.


Irrelevant. You can be a scammer without breaking the rules. Breaking the rules would be cheating and bannable. Scamming should not be bannable.

(Maybe we have different meaning for the word "scammer"?)

Reddit is the most god awful site on the internet but on the PoE sub you can name and shame scammers.
"
pannra wrote:
Reddit is the most god awful site on the internet but on the PoE sub you can name and shame scammers.


it's, as most other stuff on reddit, non sensical.

if i wanted to scam people i wouldn't do it on my main account but a sub which i level up to maps in 7 hours.

beside this, who reads those reddit threads and remembers names? some hundred people maybe.
RED FLAGS RED FLAGS

Someone hasn't played Diablo 2, huh? If the person you are trading with switches items around they are 100% trying to scam you. To this game's credit it is harder to do here than it was in the good old D2.
"
"
Completed 24 ChallengesBone2flesh wrote:


Nobody agrees to anything upfront OR even if they do it is absolutely irrelevant (except from maybe a moral stand point) considering that the only agreement that matters is both parties pressing the accept button of the trade window AFTER and only AFTER both check each others items.

1. A real in game scam:

- Person A advertised Ulaman for 10 C and charges up front with the portal blocked off.

- Person B trust A and accepts goes to the hideout and payed the 10 C.

- Person A kicks person B.

- Person B was scammed by person A for 10 C.




In your words, Person B wasn't scammed, because he confirmed the trade. Either your both examples are scams, or neither.



In POE's trading, you are bartering before you get to the trading phase. Agreeing on the terms.

If I message to you that i buy your Bisco's with 20 Exalts, you'll expect to get those 20 exalts. I'll join your party, put 20 Exalts in the trade window and cancel the trade to change them to 2 Exalts. Would you congratulate me for my great bartering skills, or call me a scammer?

"
Completed 24 ChallengesBone2flesh wrote:
Verbal agreements between strangers (especially under the anonymity of the internet and when the medium has no rules against it - GGG TOS) without witnesses and in most countries with as well MEAN absolutely nothing.


Irrelevant. You can be a scammer without breaking the rules. Breaking the rules would be cheating and bannable. Scamming should not be bannable.

(Maybe we have different meaning for the word "scammer"?)



Who said anything about trading in example one? Most people drop currency. And you are misinterpreting the example. The idea is t=in case one the expectation of getting something of value is created for B. And he is denied that without having any possibility to protect himself. he was scammed.

In the second example B has at his disposal everything he needs to avoid any kind of shenanigans. He has no promises of gain in the future no nothing. Both get what they hoover over at the same time. No possibility to scam.



"If I message to you that i buy your Bisco's with 20 Exalts, you'll expect to get those 20 exalts. I'll join your party, put 20 Exalts in the trade window and cancel the trade to change them to 2 Exalts. Would you congratulate me for my great bartering skills, or call me a scammer?"


I would say nothing and assume it's a mistake. I would not accept the trade and let you ponder on why not. I would potentially tell you to get with the program.

Also how stupid can you be to not notice that 1 stack of exalted is not 2 stacks of exalted?

Your personal definition of scamming is irrelevant. I am going by the generally accepted definition of scamming you can google anytime you want: you cannot call it a scam (not by the definition) is the person has to check the item and than accept it in return for his goods.
"Never argue with an idiot. They will take you down to their level and beat you trough experience."
"
Completed 24 ChallengesBone2flesh wrote:
If you look the definition of the term "scam" you will see that the meaning the OP and the people use it as always implies trust factor from the "scammed person". This means they would accept to give money or something of value in return for something else later that is not delivered.

For example in the game world we are all playing:

1. A real in game scam:

- Person A advertised Ulaman for 10 C and charges up front with the portal blocked off.

- Person B trust A and accepts goes to the hideout and payed the 10 C.

- Person A kicks person B.

-Person B was scammed by person A for 10 C.

2. OP's example:

- Person A advertised item 6L in trade for 6 EX.

- Person B wants item 6L and requests a trade for 6 EX.

- Person A invites person B to the party and they initiate trade.

The following steps are very important and key differences from Example 1. Pay attention.

- Person A puts item 6L in the trade window.

- Person B checks item 6L and puts 6ex and accepts.

- Person A changes his mind and removes 6L and replaces it with 5L.

The trade is reset and all checks re-enabled. - this is the moment that A has the opportunity to change his mind, remove 6 ex or cancel the trade.

- Person A accepts the trade.

- Person B checks item 5L and accepts to give 6 ex for it.

By the definition, the steps involved, no matter how you want to put this situation and regardless of any intent of either person this is not a scam.

There is a lot of gray areas in real life about this but this is a game and the rules and mechanics are quite simple and straightforward. I feel sorry some of you can't accept the lesson you could learn and continue living in denial.

Anyway I could not even put it better than I did this time for you. if you can't see the subtle but clear difference you are simply incapable of understanding it.



Had the first part of this happen in reverse to me last night.

I offered an Ulaman kill last night, Guy accepts agreed upon price and joins party, lightning warps over to my map device, and instantly portals in, then leaves party without paying. Goes and kills Ulaman, when trying to message him about it, I am already on ignore from said player.

So tell me how in that situation this is not a scam?

When messaging support about this I am told they do not get involved in player interactions, yet you cannot warn people in chat about this so others don't get scammed. I got muted from chat for doing exactly this.

So OP, yes you can report a scammer, long story short you won't get anything out of it.
"
"
Completed 39 Challengesdachoppa wrote:
how is that a scam if you are required to put your mouse cursor over the item to verify what it is before you can accept the trade?





Typical PoE community response to scamming. SO vile.


nothing vile about it

the guy put up a trade and the other party agreed
5/21/2018. The day the indie company owned and operated in New Zealand known as GGG died. Whether you want to admit it or not.
"
Completed 15 ChallengesPez27 wrote:

When messaging support about this I am told they do not get involved in player interactions, yet you cannot warn people in chat about this so others don't get scammed. I got muted from chat for doing exactly this.


there is no ingame support (yet) for "services". you simply can't reliably charge people for something ingame. you can try but there is no guarantee both sides fulfill their side of the contract.

i think when initially designing challenges, ggg had in mind that groups of players freely share their findings with others, not making a business out of it.

to avoid people not paying for your service you can revert the risk, block your hideout's waypoint with 4 elreon bookshelves, let players pay (half the amount) upfront and open the shelves after payment.

or you do it the altruistic way and share your findings and enjoy if someone gives you something in return. works guaranteed, i ever do it to avoid disappointments.
"
cronus wrote:
"
Completed 15 ChallengesPez27 wrote:

When messaging support about this I am told they do not get involved in player interactions, yet you cannot warn people in chat about this so others don't get scammed. I got muted from chat for doing exactly this.


there is no ingame support (yet) for "services". you simply can't reliably charge people for something ingame. you can try but there is no guarantee both sides fulfill their side of the contract.

i think when initially designing challenges, ggg had in mind that groups of players freely share their findings with others, not making a business out of it.

to avoid people not paying for your service you can revert the risk, block your hideout's waypoint with 4 elreon bookshelves, let players pay (half the amount) upfront and open the shelves after payment.

or you do it the altruistic way and share your findings and enjoy if someone gives you something in return. works guaranteed, i ever do it to avoid disappointments.


While there is nothing in place for services, when you accept a party invite agreeing to pay for someone's services, then if you do not meet the agreements, you have scammed the other player out of what you agreed to pay them for their time and effort.

I had my map device blocked, but they warped over the block and entered while I was inviting another person to the party, I couldn't kick them in time to see what they were doing before it had happened.
"
Completed 15 ChallengesPez27 wrote:

While there is nothing in place for services, when you accept a party invite agreeing to pay for someone's services, then if you do not meet the agreements, you have scammed the other player out of what you agreed to pay them for their time and effort.

I had my map device blocked, but they warped over the block and entered while I was inviting another person to the party, I couldn't kick them in time to see what they were doing before it had happened.


I think the only way to avoid this is to use a 2nd account to collect the funds (separate hideout) and then send invite from primary account once transaction is complete. Problem is that looks extremely sketchy from a buyers perspective.

No matter what approach, someone is taking risk if buying/selling these kind of services. There is no easy answer to this even though some believe the answer is simple -- don't make things like this challenges (which I have mixed feelings about).
Last edited by Nubatron on Jan 12, 2018, 5:48:51 PM

Report Forum Post

Report Account:

Report Type

Additional Info