When are we getting better trading tools?

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Miská wrote:

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Destructodave wrote:

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Miská wrote:

What would it really matter if Poe.trade would be indoor or not. The only thing it would do is put the costs on them. Trade is not controlled by a third party at all, we have xyz providing a service to the community, he never actually interfered whatsoever. If something happened to poe.trade for whatever reason, a replacement would be on within the week.

Your emotions are severely clouding your judgement. And for the record, I actually enjoy the player interaction....most of the time.

Well, it would remove private indexers and live search whoops for starters. They could also find ways to combat the other issues like AFKs and fixers at some point after that once it is in-house. They can't do anything about any of it right now.

But lets be honest. This game has been out for a long time now. If they were ever going to do anything they would have done it a long time ago. So all we are really doing is just debating and arguing over hypotheticals at this point.

I would at least settle for things that allows me to trade in areas where I cannot leave, like Lab.

We both know people can do alot worse things to a game then that. Indoor or not they can. It's abit naive to believe that pulling poe.trade indoor would suddenly make it immune to any kind of tampering. People that want to cheat, will cheat. Not to mention that private indexers and live searches are not even a gray area yet.

They aren't doing anything because it's not as simple as you make it seem like. Chris, in multiple intervieuws reveals that making the choice about what to do is what's stopping them. Giving it time instead of potentially ruining the game. You can always pretend the current trade system sucks. But during month 1 of leagues it works pretty well. Barely anyone is AFK, is trying to price fix or is just generally douchy.

I agree with the allowing to trade cross instance. I think that would solve alot of annoyance already to begin with.

They can, but then that's actually cheating and punishable. Also, I dont consider people using live search on PoE.Trade as cheaters, or even think the majority of them would resort to cheating afterwards. All they are doing is using a tool on the actual trade site. I don't agree with tool, but I dont think people are somehow bad because they use it. Hell, I use it. I just dont like the overall implications of using it. Its pretty much a D3 AH bot. But if it was removed I wouldn't resort to actual botting, and I doubt most others would, too. That would be limited to the same types of gamers that cheated in say, D3. I dont think Private Indexer people are "cheating" either. I just dont like the fact that its possible. You can't hate on someone for doing something that GGG allows to happen.

I guess my main issue is that it takes some of the cost out of flipping. Generally flipping would have the cost of actually searching for the items to flip. But when you have these things automatically doing it for you, that cost is gone; I guess similar to people's arguments about Instant AH compared to P2P trading. Its hyper-efficient. It seems you get to a point where instead of going, "should I be flipping or farming", and you get to the point where you need to be flipping AND farming at the same time, which is what these tools allow.

Again, its not really that big of an issue. I'm not gonna quit the game or anything rediculous. I just like talking about it. Its an interesting subject. I'll still trade and use whatever system is available and not its not going to affect my enjoyment of the game. I'm a fairly binary player at this point. I pick a build pre-league and I play that build then quit. I farm/trade my ass off to get it as fast as I can so I can enjoy it long as I can before I inevitably burn out. So, PoE.Trade does work fine for me. I just like to talk about its problems and solutions.

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Chris wrote:

Easy trade means reducing drop rates
Compare two hypothetical games. In the first game, trade is very difficult. The majority of items that can't be used by your character are not traded to other people. In the second game, trade is very easy. Many of the items that you can't use are traded to other people for items that you can. In the second game, because of trade, you have a much higher acquisition rate of useful items. While that sounds great if you want instant gratification, in reality it means that the second game either receives reduced drop rates relative to the first, or ends up being a whole lot easier and less challenging to achieve goals in.

I rest my case.

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Phrazz wrote:

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Chris wrote:

Easy trade means reducing drop rates
Compare two hypothetical games. In the first game, trade is very difficult. The majority of items that can't be used by your character are not traded to other people. In the second game, trade is very easy. Many of the items that you can't use are traded to other people for items that you can. In the second game, because of trade, you have a much higher acquisition rate of useful items. While that sounds great if you want instant gratification, in reality it means that the second game either receives reduced drop rates relative to the first, or ends up being a whole lot easier and less challenging to achieve goals in.

I rest my case.

yes, that is his ignorant stance. he has sent me that exact copy of text in 3 seperate emails over the last 3+ years, LOL.

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Phrazz wrote:

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Chris wrote:

Easy trade means reducing drop rates
Compare two hypothetical games. In the first game, trade is very difficult. The majority of items that can't be used by your character are not traded to other people. In the second game, trade is very easy. Many of the items that you can't use are traded to other people for items that you can. In the second game, because of trade, you have a much higher acquisition rate of useful items. While that sounds great if you want instant gratification, in reality it means that the second game either receives reduced drop rates relative to the first, or ends up being a whole lot easier and less challenging to achieve goals in.

I rest my case.

So...which hypothetical game is POE? I don't remember drop rates being super generous, and trade is annoying as fuck.

This thread's name stays on point

"better"

so far the new site isnt better, its just a copy pasta of Poe.trade

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Sexcalibure wrote:

This thread's name stays on point

"better"

so far the new site isnt better, its just a copy pasta of Poe.trade

AFK/DND filter is already a huge step forward. Besides, since those features were incorporated in the trade API, there's a good chance that poe.trade will adopt them, too. And competition between service providers is alwasy a good thing for the consumer. Even if the new trading site fails to replace poe.trade, it'll serve as a nice friendly kick in the butt to the folks running poe.trade, to keep them awake :)

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DGTLDaemon wrote:

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Sexcalibure wrote:

This thread's name stays on point

"better"

so far the new site isnt better, its just a copy pasta of Poe.trade

AFK/DND filter is already a huge step forward. Besides, since those features were incorporated in the trade API, there's a good chance that poe.trade will adopt them, too. And competition between service providers is alwasy a good thing for the consumer. Even if the new trading site fails to replace poe.trade, it'll serve as a good kick in the butt to the folks running poe.trade, to keep them awake :)

You are telling me that somebody that sleeps from 8pm to 8am is gonna make sure that the dude sleeping from 11 to 6 stays awake ?

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Sexcalibure wrote:

You are telling me that somebody that sleeps from 8pm to 8am is gonna make sure that the dude sleeping from 11 to 6 stays awake ?

Wat? Of course not. AFK/DND filter is there to eliminate the frustration of messaging a bunch of potential sellers and getting nothing but "This player is AFK/This player has DND mode enabled" in response. It doesn't address the issue of price fixers and players who simply choose to ignore trade whispers for various reasons, but it's a start. It means GGG are listening to the concerns raised by the community. And the blacklist function will at least allow ignoring well-known price fixers, so it's also a step in the right direction.

Also, if GGGs in-house search engine turns out to be fast enough, it has the potential to finally kill private indexers. I hope I don't have to explain what kind of positive impact it will have on the game's economy.

I don't understand how it took a year to make this site when it does nothing poe.trade doesn't already do with the exception of the afk/dnd filter which poe.trade couldn't do because that data wasn't in the API. Pretty sure they will be able to incorporate that in a day or two now that the data is available to everyone.

The ignore function is already there as well albiet you need to install an extra script to do it but again, it's nothing revolutionary.

Given that took a year how long will it take to do something above & beyond what we have already? Maybe there is no intention to do anything more in which case why bother at all?

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DGTLDaemon wrote:

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Sexcalibure wrote:

This thread's name stays on point

"better"

so far the new site isnt better, its just a copy pasta of Poe.trade

AFK/DND filter is already a huge step forward. Besides, since those features were incorporated in the trade API, there's a good chance that poe.trade will adopt them, too. And competition between service providers is alwasy a good thing for the consumer. Even if the new trading site fails to replace poe.trade, it'll serve as a nice friendly kick in the butt to the folks running poe.trade, to keep them awake :)

Except that this is useless competition. The only reason poe.trade didn't have that feature was because ggg didn't provide the data. They could simply change that and poe.trade would include it almost immediately, creating a whole new site (and delaying the change in the data to coincide with the release of the tool) was a complete waste of time and resources.
Also, poe.trade didn't need a "kick in the butt to stay awake", they do quite a decent job and it's the only thing making trade in poe barely bearable.

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RandallPOE wrote:

I don't understand how it took a year to make this site when it does nothing poe.trade doesn't already do with the exception of the afk/dnd filter which poe.trade couldn't do because that data wasn't in the API. Pretty sure they will be able to incorporate that in a day or two now that the data is available to everyone.

The ignore function is already there as well albiet you need to install an extra script to do it but again, it's nothing revolutionary.

Given that took a year how long will it take to do something above & beyond what we have already? Maybe there is no intention to do anything more in which case why bother at all?

QFT.