[3.0] Queen of the Storm - Charged Dash TheoryCrafting

yeah, haste is very bad. the ms actively hurts you. Kraitlyn as well. mistake.


Attack speed is great early. MORE attack speed is always good.
Faster attacks is good, and probably core. however, do keep an eye on it. its not "more".
I personally did just swap FA out. It was easily top dps/killing power early game. but as I stacked more ias on gear/passives, it feel behind.

My current for example, visualized using the tool which seems pretty correct. https://www.desmos.com/calculator/cmnwc3vaky

CD+Eatk+icebite+conceffect
with onslaught and frenzy charges
4.25 a/s. +32% move speed. -30%area of effect. 1173 ave hit.
5 attacks per dash. ave 5865 per dash
same with anc protector
4.96 a/s. +32% move speed. -30%area of effect. 1173 ave hit.
6 attacks per dash. ave 7038 per dash

Faster attacks.
CD+Eatk+FA+conceffect
5.11 a/s. +32% move speed. -30%area of effect. 829 ave hit.
6 attacks per dash. ave 4974 per dash

with anc protector
5.99 a/s. +32% move speed. -30%area of effect. 829 ave hit.
7 attacks per dash ave 5803 per dash.

So it was clear, that in my short burst scenarios, 1 more hit, was not as much damage as icebite's average 344 more per hit.
Also to be considered though, is the damage spread. in the short burst method, all 5-7 hits land. the longer you channel the more the damage is spread out. so, only 3 out of 7 may even hit, in a full channel.
look at the tool and compare the 4.96 and 5.99 attack speed models. a target at 45 is getting hit 3 times at 4.96, but 4 at 5.99. Attack speed means more coverage at longer duration channels.
3 at 1173 ave is 3519, 4 at 829 is 3316. much closer.


My current theorized end game will have about 9.49 a/s with FA. 8.04 without. (anc protector is included, as well as onslaught+frenzy). +60%ms and -12% aoe.
9 attacks per channel with, 8 without. So, then yes the question then is. If all 8 hits, 1 more hit would be a 12.5% dps increase. is there a gem that increases dps more then 12.5%? (almost certainly..) Spaced out. at 45m again. 5 hits at 8.04. also 5 at 9.49... increased aoe would also be 5. but in general the larger aoe, probably would be more dps, and def more coverage.
Other raw damage options would be added cold, added lit, damage at full life.

So, the deal is, you need a solid base of Faster attack speed. however, only a certain amount, before diminishing returns.
you can either get it on FA skill gem, and skip faster attack speed in Passive tree. or, get it in passive tree, and skip FA support.

all you guys playing with the fkin calculator really makes me think you haven't even tried the damn gem.

shorter casts results in less attacks. it isn't like every cast is going to have your maximum number of attacks but just all group them up closer together. this isn't how the gem works. it sounds like some of you think this is how it works.
so at max dash distance if you have 6 attacks, then if you short burst cast it you may only have 1 or 2.

also, all this overlapping dps thing. its easy to see on the calculator sure, and you can see the slightest sliver of overlap for when they're all overlapping, but you'll never be able to notice or aim the skill on moving targets and bosses to get that most amount of overlap in the actual game. try the skill out. you can't.

also ice bite sucks, people. added cold damage support is better. with ice bite, you don't need the frenzy charge generation aspect, and you don't need the freeze chance because of how freeze works. you'll freeze nothing but trash mobs and even then i doubt it will be very noticeable. and it gives less damage unless you have 8 frenzy charges, which if using darkrays you do and will drop your frenzy charges here and there - making for a significant drop in dmg.

added cold damage is better. and with the 10% inc cold dmg quality it might even be better than ice bite unless you have 9 frenzy charges.

double

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xMustard wrote:

shorter casts results in less attacks. it isn't like every cast is going to have your maximum number of attacks but just all group them up closer together. this isn't how the gem works. it sounds like some of you think this is how it works.
so at max dash distance if you have 6 attacks, then if you short burst cast it you may only have 1 or 2.

I have not found this to be the case at all. I would agree extremely short channels this does occur. .2-3s. Anything that is half distance seems to deal full # of attacks as far as I can tell.

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xMustard wrote:

also, all this overlapping dps thing. its easy to see on the calculator sure, and you can see the slightest sliver of overlap for when they're all overlapping, but you'll never be able to notice or aim the skill on moving targets and bosses to get that most amount of overlap in the actual game. try the skill out. you can't.

no one is entirely suggesting attempting to pinpoint max aoe coverage. granted, its automatically exactly at 30m, halfway point. and you COULD use bear trap, and/or tempchains/maim/chill to reduce enemy movement to attempt just that.. Alternatively, the point is, shorter duration channels tighten the spread of your aoe, allowing more/all aoe hits to land on a single target.

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xMustard wrote:

also ice bite sucks, people. added cold damage support is better. with ice bite, you don't need the frenzy charge generation aspect, and you don't need the freeze chance because of how freeze works. you'll freeze nothing but trash mobs and even then i doubt it will be very noticeable. and it gives less damage unless you have 8 frenzy charges, which if using darkrays you do and will drop your frenzy charges here and there - making for a significant drop in dmg.

added cold damage is better. and with the 10% inc cold dmg quality it might even be better than ice bite unless you have 9 frenzy charges.

Icebite is awesome. but this is a fair point, added cold is probably still better in most cases.
Also, ice bites quality is :

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Supported Skills deal 1% increased Damage with Hits against Frozen Enemies

which is pretty great. however, very much less useful vs bosses, since its frozen, not chill.

If I was being honest, I don't think the gem will work in T10+ maps. Even with the pen, youll have an incredible time on single target but that's not even the worst part of it. Its going to be AoE.. If it had say the same AoE as sunder. It could really have tons of potential. But it doesn't. Even with inc aoe. I just ripped mine in 85 in HC. If GGG added better AoE to the ability. It would certainly be T1. Until then, i'll prolly reroll the new GMP ED to see how that goes.

Hi, I am going the raider way too.

I switched haste for wrath : much better results.

Have you tried ?

I know this the a Ranger thread and I'm playing a trickster I thought I'd share some thoughts on Charged Dash.
I'm going full elemental conversion with PTL and using Wrath. I tend to agree that faster attack speed is the way to go but movement speed is important. The longer you charge the more vulnerable you are. I'm trying to get a good balance between the two; enough MS to fire off strong charges but more AS for the damage. Anyway I really like this skill and it's great against bosses, even better against slow moving ones. The AoE isn't great but the AoE nodes are a little out of the way and using an Increased Area of Effect Support gem seems a wasted socket so it feels like you sometimes have to do an extra dash to clear a pack fully.

Anyway this a fun and interesting skill that can be built around in different ways. This won't be my last Charged Dash character.

anyone try crit charge dash setup with cospri's malice?

Just in case it hasn't already been mentioned, is really fun for this skill. Put COH conductivity in and u curse everything before you hit it!

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Nubman wrote:

Just in case it hasn't already been mentioned,

is really fun for this skill. Put COH conductivity in and u curse everything before you hit it!

I actually got this sword last night, decided to put controlled destruction+conc+ele focus on it, rocking blas+cond anyway. It does REALLY nice damage and complements the lacking AoE of CD. I think I had around 9k damage on storm cascade which seemed like really crap, but whole packs were melting in t5-7 maps. I was confused until I realized that the cascade hit multiple times during the animation (like glacial cascade). Running Hyano's + this as DW. There seems to be a 1second internal cooldown for the Storm cascade skill and unlike I assumed it triggers when you start to channel and not when you actually attack.

I have around 11,5k tooltip dps on CD when I have my frenzy charges and onslaught up. That paired with 61% lightning penetration and -42% to enemy lightning resistances that tooltip doesn't know how to take into account. Damage FINALLY FEELS GOOD and even bosses die with few zip zaps when I pop my Wise oak flask and go to town.

I think having good balance with MS and AS is essential, while 1% ms and shitloads of AS will get you sick damage and lots of attacks I just don't see how you can clear maps with it properly, even I use whirling blades to move around if there aren't mobs around. IDK

Mainly I need some more HP, my rings/belt/ammy all have shit HP rolls( ammy doesn't even have hp) and I'm using thunderfist gloves that have also 0 hp. If I had unlimited funds and with time I'd switch thunderfist to a nice rare glove pair and have a 6link chest. I have a 5link QoTF that I don't even know what to use it form, it has only vaal haste+ind dur in it atm :p

character link:
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/ciryous/characters?characterName=ZippyZappyZoomy

PoB pastebin:
https://pastebin.com/0zc7HnRx