Buff More Than Nerf

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Fruz wrote:

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Zrevnur wrote:

Some of those changes were probably made for SSF league addition.

Absolutely nothing indicates that.

Its the impression I got when following PoE news before the SSF league announcement. I have no proof that it is so. I am only aware of some comments on reddit (dont remember details) and some "circumstantial indication": Many of the recent buffs are more beneficial for SSF than for non-SSF.

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Fruz wrote:

GGG had always been against SSF so that the community would not get split an penalize players that want to trade and play the economy -> the most important of the game to GGG, nothing indicates otherwise until recently afaik.

The (also circumstantial) evidence suggests otherwise: SSF is (in comparison with trading player) a lot easier now than it used to be. I am not talking about the PR (what they say) but the hard facts (what they do == how they change the game) here. Its possible that this is 100% coincidental but I dont expect that.

The drops and ease to access anything has been getting increased since ... the start basically, the game has become more casual, it attracts more player => more money => the company is growing.
That makes much more sense imho, as GGG said in the past that they didn't want to split the community and that they consider the economy as the most important part of the game => we only got actual evidence that the SSF community was already there with the recent SSF ladder leaded by ProjectPT.

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Fruz wrote:

The drops and ease to access anything has been getting increased since ... the start basically, the game has become more casual, it attracts more player => more money => the company is growing.

Look at many/most of the Divination cards: The influence on SSF player is huge. The influence on trading player is small.

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Fruz wrote:

That makes much more sense imho, as GGG said in the past that they didn't want to split the community and that they consider the economy as the most important part of the game

If they make changes to the game which were influenced by SSF concerns: Would they advertise it as such? Doing so would implicitely advertise for SSF. If they can avoid it I would expect them to do that (avoiding it). With the separate SSF ladder they were unable to avoid it.

They did not want to make SSF easier since the main focus of GGG is the economy, that is the most important thing to them.

The only reason why they "gave up" there is because they new that the community was already split because many people were already playing SSF.
They have been giving more and more to the players because PoE is attracting more and more casual players that keep QQing that stuff should be easier to get, and since it makes GGG grow bigger, it's not likely to stop.


By following your logic, should we also pretend that powercreep is a clear sign that GGG wants to encourage solo play since group play was already crushing everything ???
-> Definitely not.

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Fruz wrote:

They have been giving more and more to the players because PoE is attracting more and more casual players that keep QQing that stuff should be easier to get, and since it makes GGG grow bigger, it's not likely to stop.

Now apply this argumentation to the SSF case and it makes sense for them to support it(SSF). Which they are doing.

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Fruz wrote:

By following your logic, should we also pretend that powercreep is a clear sign that GGG wants to encourage solo play since group play was already crushing everything ???
-> Definitely not.

Encouraging != supporting

Encouraging SSF to attract new player ?? When we KNOW that their focus is the economy ?

I'm starting to think that you really don't know GGG at this point, and therefore you don't really know what we are talking about right now.

For example, a line on the SSF manifesto :

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Chris_GGG wrote:

It's important to stress that the expectation is that most SSF characters do turn into regular characters eventually. Some players just last longer than others before they decide to party up or trade.

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Zrevnur wrote:

Encouraging != supporting

This is literally the first definition that pops up when googling "encouraging" ( from my pc of course ) :

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encouraging
ɛŋˈkʌrɪdʒɪŋ,ɪŋˈkʌrɪdʒɪŋ/
adjective
adjective: encouraging

giving someone support or confidence; supportive.
"she gave me an encouraging smile"
positive and giving hope for future success; promising.
"the results are very encouraging"

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Fruz wrote:

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Zrevnur wrote:

Some of those changes were probably made for SSF league addition.

Absolutely nothing indicates that.
There has been recently an actual SSF_ladder that might have shown GGG that the SSF community was there and has changed their mind from the opposite opinion : whether or not they should implement a SSF league.

Apart from that, we cannot real tell anything ( or if you have something relevant and significant enough to show .... ).
GGG had always been against SSF so that the community would not get split an penalize players that want to trade and play the economy -> the most important of the game to GGG, nothing indicates otherwise until recently afaik.

I'd go one step further and say they were probably made for a ssf style game (aka xbox 1 version). Even if xbox 1 has trade or an AH, it still needs to be more loot friendly then the current version of POE. Perhaps GGG is testing the waters to see what is too much so they don't fuck it up with the xbox 1 release, at the expense again of making the game less fun for someone like me.


GGG has this thing where they say one thing, but do a completely different thing. Perhaps everyone does it, including all devs, but this is something i've not really noticed GGG being so bad at so it could just be a recently development.


The perfect example is when you see pissed off players like ProjectPT post a rant about the game, when back in december he asked the question that is in my signature about alienating old players to acquire new ones, if GGG truly cared about us players from open beta or before more then attracting mass players they would not have drop rates this high, they would not have diviners boxes that follow no rules, they would not have mmorpg style bosses be the upper end of the difficulty with nothing but really one shots inbetween.


I am still waiting on that post from anuhurt

They haven't exactly just upped the drop rates at once, they've been on a slippery slope for a long time.
But they've been pretty following their lines,
They somewhat gave up on FFA at some point but it had been a harsh fight here.


About Xbox, we will see .... that would actually be something relevant here, I will definitely give you that.
Let's see if trade isn't too tedious on it.
Anyway, since the realms will not be shared, they will likely tweak many things, it's really far to tell.

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Fruz wrote:

Spoiler

Encouraging SSF to attract new player ?? When we KNOW that their focus is the economy ?

I'm starting to think that you really don't know GGG at this point, and therefore you don't really know what we are talking about right now.

For example, a line on the SSF manifesto :

"

Chris_GGG wrote:

It's important to stress that the expectation is that most SSF characters do turn into regular characters eventually. Some players just last longer than others before they decide to party up or trade.

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Zrevnur wrote:

Encouraging != supporting

This is literally the first definition that pops up when googling "encouraging" ( from my pc of course ) :

"

encouraging
ɛŋˈkʌrɪdʒɪŋ,ɪŋˈkʌrɪdʒɪŋ/
adjective
adjective: encouraging

giving someone support or confidence; supportive.
"she gave me an encouraging smile"
positive and giving hope for future success; promising.
"the results are very encouraging"

Look here: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-forum/dev-manifesto

In the first page there is one thread which has the most pages. It is named "Solo Self-Found Support in 2.6.0". So if "encouraging" == "supporting" (which I do not agree with - they are different words with different meaning but you appear to believe it) then this says "Solo Self-Found Encouragement in 2.6.0". Now look at your claims and maybe see GGG from a new perspective.

And if you believe they suddenly/magically/whatever changed their stance then I do not share your opinion. IMO they are merely "coming out" now and were hiding it better before. But this is (at this point) "only" my opinion and I dont have hard proof for it.

And the GGG quote doesnt contain proper hard facts. So from my POV it is "PR".

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Zrevnur wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

The drops and ease to access anything has been getting increased since ... the start basically, the game has become more casual, it attracts more player => more money => the company is growing.

Look at many/most of the Divination cards: The influence on SSF player is huge. The influence on trading player is small.

Aren't all of the div cards designed by players?