We are seeing first hand why GGG needs to step in..

Well they missed a beautiful opportunity to increase the EXP/loot availability for those at least 5-10 last levels and linking it more to tiers, but they went instead with an EXP penalty that renders chaining tier 10-12 the fastest and safest leveling experience...

Imagine the game with an increased difficulty due to more dangerous white monsters, smaller packs, smarter mechanics, traps that complement them and boss fights worth to remember when you could level post 90 up to 95 only in tier 11-13 and post 95 only in tier 14-16 working for it gradually, and maybe even increase the chance for better loot there - keep tier 1 uniques rare enough, but stop with those masses of leveling uniques/tier 1-6 maps that drop on red tier bosses...

They should make endgame content feel worthwhile, and give it more meaning... I still consider myself a casual n00b hoarder that plays the game for fun, but if they push the dial on harsher difficulty, they should also push the dial for better EXP/loot too, so even us would strive to reach endgame content...
PSS: Our almighty TencentGGG overlords are very scrupulous regarding criticizing their abilities to take proper decisions and consider everything "needlessly harsh and condescending"...

Good to know "free speech" doesn't apply in any form or manner on the forums these days...
Last edited by sofocle10000 on Jan 19, 2017, 1:33:50 PM
"

3) You clearly have no responsibilities outside of yourself if you think money doesn't matter and that you should always stick to your core principals when designing games. People like you are the exact reasons why so many game developers quit in the first place, because you are petulant spoiled entitled brats who have literally no idea how game development actually works, and the process behind it. I criticized GGG in the past on many things, ranging from QA, poor network code, lack of balance, etc. but I would never criticize GGG for doing things that make them money. Ultimately in the end, this is a business, and GGG has to provide for their families and employees. Those people will always and ultimately come first before some arrogant wannabe elitist like you.


You have absolute no clue how it works...money destroys everything.
The best games ever made were produced by people who want to create a great game out of love to gaming and not to make money. If you have succes the money comes from alone but when it gets to much big companys step in and buy everything out.

So many developers quit cause the way the new companys are going is not what they want.
Biggest example here will be Blizzard North which was the starting of the end of blizzard.


Other example Ubi Soft boss once said, when i first stepped in my first action was to take away the fun out of progamming. We want to get money and dont want to bring fun and joy to the people...

Or an example out of my region. Pirahnabytes, after they forced the progammers to push the game out way to early and released a ton of crap these progammers quit theyr company and worked for free on a community patch which made these game really great for free....

Or look at the great mobas which all were created totally free by people who just love games. Icefrog didnt see any cent in the first days for dota it was just a wc3 mod produced by people who just love gaming...

Or counterstrike or every other real succesfull mod produced by fans complete free just while they loved it....

A game is like a child for the programmer he loves it and wants it to be perfect. But i see you have no experience with real gaming or creating real good games.

Game development these days is just bring the huge money for low costs.

So you are the capitalist elitist who not only ruins our joy on great games but people like you ruin the whole world.

"
Ueblesding wrote:

So you are the capitalist elitist who not only ruins our joy on great games but people like you ruin the whole world.



Brings a tear to my eye.
https://youtu.be/T9kygXtkh10?t=285

FeelsBadMan

Remove MF from POE, make juiced map the new MF.
"
Ueblesding wrote:
"

3) You clearly have no responsibilities outside of yourself if you think money doesn't matter and that you should always stick to your core principals when designing games. People like you are the exact reasons why so many game developers quit in the first place, because you are petulant spoiled entitled brats who have literally no idea how game development actually works, and the process behind it. I criticized GGG in the past on many things, ranging from QA, poor network code, lack of balance, etc. but I would never criticize GGG for doing things that make them money. Ultimately in the end, this is a business, and GGG has to provide for their families and employees. Those people will always and ultimately come first before some arrogant wannabe elitist like you.


You have absolute no clue how it works...money destroys everything.
The best games ever made were produced by people who want to create a great game out of love to gaming and not to make money. If you have succes the money comes from alone but when it gets to much big companys step in and buy everything out.

So many developers quit cause the way the new companys are going is not what they want.
Biggest example here will be Blizzard North which was the starting of the end of blizzard.


Other example Ubi Soft boss once said, when i first stepped in my first action was to take away the fun out of progamming. We want to get money and dont want to bring fun and joy to the people...

Or an example out of my region. Pirahnabytes, after they forced the progammers to push the game out way to early and released a ton of crap these progammers quit theyr company and worked for free on a community patch which made these game really great for free....

Or look at the great mobas which all were created totally free by people who just love games. Icefrog didnt see any cent in the first days for dota it was just a wc3 mod produced by people who just love gaming...

Or counterstrike or every other real succesfull mod produced by fans complete free just while they loved it....

A game is like a child for the programmer he loves it and wants it to be perfect. But i see you have no experience with real gaming or creating real good games.

Game development these days is just bring the huge money for low costs.

So you are the capitalist elitist who not only ruins our joy on great games but people like you ruin the whole world.




Without capitalism you wouldn't even have a job. You're probably some hippie ass kid who thinks that the world simply works because of dreams and goals, and anything can be accomplished with hardwork, love, and dedication. Bullshit. That's not the real world. Try getting a job and not living in your mom's basement before insulting someone. And by a real job, I'm talking about an actual salaried job where you have actual benefits, and not working somewhere flipping burgers or waiting tables.



Two, I've been involved in game development before, and I'm telling you right now in real world situations every company outside of Valve who just sits on a literal gold mine of the Steam platform has to make concessions and sacrifices out of necessity. Not everyone has the luxury of Valve and Blizzard with the ability to sit around and polish, think of shit up, and try and make the greatest best game possible. GGG is neither of them, doesn't have the resources of either of them, so why anyone criticizes them for attempting to expand their game and bring in more income is beyond me.
Last edited by allbusiness on Jan 19, 2017, 5:56:21 PM
"
goetzjam wrote:
"
allbusiness wrote:



1) Don't talk DotA 2 to me, the new patch makes it extremely casual. I play at the 6k+ level meaning I'm playing top flight public players and pros. 'Theorycrafting' is silly especially considering the XP/Gold changes has made laning phase almost non-existent at this point, and the meta literally comes down to cluster fuck teamfights and pray you have the stronger AoE/disables at this point.

2) GGG clearly doesn't give a fuck about you. Evidence? Game's coming to Xbox one. Suck it up, get over it. And yes, GGG has posted numbers. Every league they make the game 'easier' according to you. Every league the game has more and more players, and higher levels of player retention. Hrm. Could be a coincidence. Could not be (cough, it's not).

3) You clearly have no responsibilities outside of yourself if you think money doesn't matter and that you should always stick to your core principals when designing games. People like you are the exact reasons why so many game developers quit in the first place, because you are petulant spoiled entitled brats who have literally no idea how game development actually works, and the process behind it. I criticized GGG in the past on many things, ranging from QA, poor network code, lack of balance, etc. but I would never criticize GGG for doing things that make them money. Ultimately in the end, this is a business, and GGG has to provide for their families and employees. Those people will always and ultimately come first before some arrogant wannabe elitist like you.

4) A fraction of the population will ever see top tier items like Shavs or Disfavour. Please, stop. You're making it sound like it's reigning Atziri Disfavours everywhere when that is clearly not the case. This isn't D3 where everyone literally gets a free set.


1) Ok then I won't, just that you view it as a more casual approach, while others view it as icefrog adding a way to ensure that heros have the proper spikes in power that was not possible to balance around as "easily" as it is now. Example would be snowballing QOP now has "immortal mode" as people like to say with level 25 and blademail.

2) I actually think this is funny, of all the people you think would be upset about the console thing you would think it would be me right? I guess my line of thinking is that if GGG is making a console version with a separate balance set and realm, then they can make it more casual and pull in the casual reigns of the PC realm. Its not coincidence, its GGG giving players more and more, which people love this instant gratification thing, eventually though people will get sick of it, even with new "content", as seen with what happened to D3, eventually GGG will run out of interesting ways to power creep the game and thats why its important to take a step back in 3.0 for the longevity of the game. The alternative is that GGG redoes the skill tree and increases max level and readjust accordingly.

3) I don't need to have responsibilities to understand that selling a product to later change it to something unrecongizable to those that supported your design, when you needed it the most should far outweigh massively expanding the team. Ima brat, but I know if you make a grindy ARPG game and sell it as such, you can't just increase it to D3 of drop rates and power and expect the people that supported you to be OK with it. Again, I'm entitled to my point of view, disagree with it if you want, but name calling is unnecessary.

A) Not criticizing them for making the game less fun, because they get a bigger paycheck? That is what companies like blizzard do to cater to the masses and answer to stock holders, that isn't something an "indie" company does.

4) Dude faction this fraction that, fuckoff I don't give a fuck if casuals don't get a fucking shavs or disfavor, these are things to work towards and if they don't putforth the effort to get them, then they should never get such items, however the required effort now is far too little investment. From a "design perspective" the game has moved the most rewarding experience to be one that just does fucking t11 maps in linear fashion fast, instead of running t15-16 maps, which should overall be more rewarding, but nope.

A) This isn't d3 where everyone gets free unique items, but this is D3 where power acquisition and other powerful gear is easier to access. If anything AC classes alone give more power then any set of gear you can get in the game, D3 has nothing even comparable in terms of player power increase.



A) The fact that you are even talking about QoP alone has already discredited anything you have to say regarding DotA. QoP is a bottom tier trash hero even after the changes.

B) People are having fun, GGG is making money. Pretty sure they could give two shits about what you think.

C) You don't make great games without money. As much as people like to praise Valve, do remember Valve has an almost complete monopoly over online video game distribution. Valve makes great games because they have the luxury of time and money on their side, unlike many other companies. Other companies have to make sacrifices somewhere.

D) 'I don't give a fuck about casuals' already shows how much of an [Removed by Support] you actually are, despite the fact that you are unable to actually complete the hard content in this game in the hardest mode (HC). And no, Ascendancy nodes are equivalent of anywhere from 25-30 nodes at best. D3 sets give you a power increase of well over 2000% easily.


So yeah, you are actually a [Removed by Support] who believes that everything should be your way and fuck everyone else. This game only survives if you have money flowing through. No money, no game development. Just stop, GGG is in this to make money, bottom line. It's a job that they love, but they can't do it without money. And in order to expand and continue to develop, they need MORE money. Welcome to the bottom line of any industry.
Last edited by Tyrone_GGG on Jan 20, 2017, 11:39:54 PM
"
allbusiness wrote:



A) The fact that you are even talking about QoP alone has already discredited anything you have to say regarding DotA. QoP is a bottom tier trash hero even after the changes.

B) People are having fun, GGG is making money. Pretty sure they could give two shits about what you think.

C) You don't make great games without money. As much as people like to praise Valve, do remember Valve has an almost complete monopoly over online video game distribution. Valve makes great games because they have the luxury of time and money on their side, unlike many other companies. Other companies have to make sacrifices somewhere.

D) 'I don't give a fuck about casuals' already shows how much of an [Removed by Support] you actually are, despite the fact that you are unable to actually complete the hard content in this game in the hardest mode (HC). And no, Ascendancy nodes are equivalent of anywhere from 25-30 nodes at best. D3 sets give you a power increase of well over 2000% easily.


So yeah, you are actually a [Removed by Support] who believes that everything should be your way and fuck everyone else. This game only survives if you have money flowing through. No money, no game development. Just stop, GGG is in this to make money, bottom line. It's a job that they love, but they can't do it without money. And in order to expand and continue to develop, they need MORE money. Welcome to the bottom line of any industry.


A) LOL ok brah your just so much better then anyone else. You have the best logic ever. Glad to see you are a nice contributing and valuable member of this community /s

B) Having fun is important, its almost like its important that I have fun as well, but nope guess not as long as other people are having fun with my little pony level of holding your hand.

C) GGG made Poe with supporter money, money given in good faith that the continue to improve the game and make sure its enjoyable in the future.

D) I'm an asshole because I don't give a fuck about dumbing down the game for casual players, the dumb down isn't from making mechanics less interesting, its about making drop rates that rival perandus, likely even higher at this stage.

"unable to complete the 4-6 bosses" Honestly, you can take those bosses and do something with them, if you need further explanation please let me know. The "challenge" is building a character to not get 1 shot and just facetanking with leech, a mechanic that GGG was "suppose" to remove in 2.0

People aren't using the power and item acquisition to do the challenging 4-6 bosses, they are using it to trivialize shaped fucking strands, because its not really "rewarding" to play in any other way due to 1 shot mechanics and things like finding diviners boxes that can drop any fucking card. But its ok because i haven't done the hardcore, hardcore, hardcore mode yet so there is still apparently more I need to do.

D3 obviously gives you more power, I was being facetious, the fact of the matter is GGG is increasing power level, not because they are making the overall game more challenging, but because they are adding challenging content at the very top, even if there is challenging content at the very top, if you can get the rewards outside of doing that content (aka disfavor axe) before people even do it, then perhaps the whole its ok if everyone shits on 99% of the content because the 1% is out there isnt the right line of thinking. But you don't understand this because your too busy with your head stuck up somewhere.


The bottom line, is that they can get more money from me with tactical changes, with considering the negative implementation that might not seem obvious from things like diviners boxes.

You obviously disagree with GGG doing anything to try to improve the game for me, because it might offset your casual view on how things should be. I don't care to have a discussion with you anymore because you are the exact sort of issue of the instant gratification playerbase that GGG is apparently catering to now, honestly its fucking pathetic.
https://youtu.be/T9kygXtkh10?t=285

FeelsBadMan

Remove MF from POE, make juiced map the new MF.
Last edited by Tyrone_GGG on Jan 20, 2017, 11:42:20 PM
The reality is that your money has always been an insignificant drop in a massive barrel. And now that their main income is going to come via the XBox version, your money is even less significant than it was before.

They've given the 12 hour per day guys enough attention over the years. Don't you think it's time GGG began making some money? I think they've earned that right, no?
"
The reality is that your money has always been an insignificant drop in a massive barrel. And now that their main income is going to come via the XBox version, your money is even less significant than it was before.

They've given the 12 hour per day guys enough attention over the years. Don't you think it's time GGG began making some money? I think they've earned that right, no?


As if they didn't make money the last 5 years, what an ignorant ass statement from the peanut gallery.
https://youtu.be/T9kygXtkh10?t=285

FeelsBadMan

Remove MF from POE, make juiced map the new MF.
"
goetzjam wrote:
"
The reality is that your money has always been an insignificant drop in a massive barrel. And now that their main income is going to come via the XBox version, your money is even less significant than it was before.

They've given the 12 hour per day guys enough attention over the years. Don't you think it's time GGG began making some money? I think they've earned that right, no?


As if they didn't make money the last 5 years, what an ignorant ass statement from the peanut gallery.


You're forgetting that the PoE of back then only had a few mouths to feed. Now, there are 100 mouths to feed.

I feel that ignorance is thinking that they can survive on a few dozen guys like you.
"


You're forgetting that the PoE of back then only had a few mouths to feed. Now, there are 100 mouths to feed.

I feel that ignorance is thinking that they can survive on a few dozen guys like you.


You pretend like they can't make the game enjoyable for both me and other players that are more casual. They can and I hope they do.
https://youtu.be/T9kygXtkh10?t=285

FeelsBadMan

Remove MF from POE, make juiced map the new MF.

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