SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

Chris just confirmed that no changes will be made to ascendancy points in his interview with ZiggyD (around minute 7).

Only thing that will change is that they would be only one entrance to the labyrinth and that you'll be able to choose the difficulty.

Sorry lab haters...
Last edited by IceDeal on Feb 16, 2017, 7:36:05 AM
"
IceDeal wrote:
Chris just confirmed that no changes will be made to ascendancy points in his interview with ZiggyD (around minute 7).

Only thing that will change is that they would be only one entrance to the labyrinth and that you'll be able to choose the difficulty.

Sorry lab haters...


Find the video, they love it when you find a video and link it and then ignore it as "but GGG hasn't responded to this thread"
https://youtu.be/T9kygXtkh10?t=285

FeelsBadMan

Remove MF from POE, make juiced map the new MF.
"
IceDeal wrote:
Chris just confirmed that no changes will be made to ascendancy points in his interview with ZiggyD (around minute 7).

Only thing that will change is that they would be only one entrance to the labyrinth and that you'll be able to choose the difficulty.

Sorry lab haters...


If it's true, then it will seal the fate of the X Box version as well.
"
If it's true, then it will seal the fate of the X Box version as well.

Dunno about that, there are more frogger games on consoles than on PC, I'd imagine the console people are more open to the idea, if anything, not less.

Haven't got around to watching the interview yet, but I assume one entrance probably means only one set of trials, which is something at least.
Wish the armchair developers would go back to developing armchairs.

◄[www.moddb.com/mods/balancedux]►
◄[www.moddb.com/mods/one-vision1]►
"
raics wrote:
"
If it's true, then it will seal the fate of the X Box version as well.

Dunno about that, there are more frogger games on consoles than on PC, I'd imagine the console people are more open to the idea, if anything, not less.

Haven't got around to watching the interview yet, but I assume one entrance probably means only one set of trials, which is something at least.


Actually many people starting PoE after the lab was introduced likely don't even give a damn about it and I assume console players are similar in this regards.

"
With a mouse you're telling him where to go, even if you hold down the button and move the cursor back and forth to get near-instantaneous reaction. That is where the concept of indirect control comes from. I did not invent it, trust me.


For me this is the definition of direct. And I googled the and I didn't find any source that introduced this definition. The only thing were direct control popped up were actual kinetic controllers. So Direct control seems to be actually swinging a controller to swing a sword or something like that, which is far from what a controller or a mouse does so by that they are both indirect.

The only thing that is present is that controllers are directional while a mouse is non-directional. And you cannot play games like RTS with a directional device (which is why controllers basically function as a mouse and you move the pointer with the pad). A mouse hardly has any of those limitation, exspecially in combination with a keyboard. You could play the first Super Mario Brothers perfectly with just a mouse (although you might need some time to get used to it, but the controls are primitive enough), while you cannot really play a game like Starcraft with a controller. But again that has nothing to do with direct or indirect.

"
But it might help you to understand why more people prefer a gamepad for precision piloting if you remember that mouse controls are analog, so if you want to move in a straight direction you need to be extremely precise about not deviating your mouse position. A button is digital; you just press it and go straight.


You are aware that all control sticks (which are the ones used for walking) are analog. This includes the Xbox, the PS and the new Switch. And I cannot see how that is an advantage. Exspecially with some older controllers it was very easy to hit up and right at the same time. But nowadays they all have control sticks (actually even Atari had them, only the early nintendo controllers had Dpads). So in movement they are pretty much the same, but if you want your character to turn 12° to the right you have to translate that into a direction on the gamepad, with a mouse you just hold your mouse there.

Also there is no controller that has a directional button as far as I'm aware, the most button like directional inputs were the Dpads, but those are long gone.

"
That said, I suspect that Xbone control will use the analog stick, rendering that particular advantage moot, though perhaps not others--the margin of error for precision movement will still be lower. (And indeed, the game outside of the Labyrinth would probably control like shit if it did not use the analog stick.)


Uhm... how would you even control, option one is move the curser with the analog stick option and the other option is directly move the character with the analog stick, you cannot move it without the analog stick. And the second option is basically emulating a mouse, which is much worse than just using a mouse.

"
I'm kinda curious myself regardless of my feelings about parallel xbox development, it seemed pretty smooth in that gamespot interview but yeah, we'll see.


I think they might just cut things that have a hard time working with a controller. Because directional attacks are pretty easy to use. But try using a ground targetted attack like Storm Call while running away from heavy hitters like the Trio.
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Emphasy wrote:
I think they might just cut things that have a hard time working with a controller. Because directional attacks are pretty easy to use. But try using a ground targetted attack like Storm Call while running away from heavy hitters like the Trio.

Yeah, I think Jonathan said in the interview that they will have to cut some skills that don't work well with a controller. So, if you want to play Storm Call you need to join the master race.

At least we now know why you can't place Orb of Storms wherever you want.
Wish the armchair developers would go back to developing armchairs.

◄[www.moddb.com/mods/balancedux]►
◄[www.moddb.com/mods/one-vision1]►
"
raics wrote:

Haven't got around to watching the interview yet, but I assume one entrance probably means only one set of trials, which is something at least.


Nope, you'll have to do all the trials. No changes until act 3 then they'll spread the 12 left into the remaining acts.


"
Find the video, they love it when you find a video and link it and then ignore it as "but GGG hasn't responded to this thread"


Here it is, it start right when they are talking about the labyrinth :
https://youtu.be/a11NfvfTDUI?t=6m30s
Last edited by IceDeal on Feb 16, 2017, 10:24:56 AM
"
Emphasy wrote:
Spoiler
"
raics wrote:
"
If it's true, then it will seal the fate of the X Box version as well.

Dunno about that, there are more frogger games on consoles than on PC, I'd imagine the console people are more open to the idea, if anything, not less.

Haven't got around to watching the interview yet, but I assume one entrance probably means only one set of trials, which is something at least.


Actually many people starting PoE after the lab was introduced likely don't even give a damn about it and I assume console players are similar in this regards.

"
With a mouse you're telling him where to go, even if you hold down the button and move the cursor back and forth to get near-instantaneous reaction. That is where the concept of indirect control comes from. I did not invent it, trust me.


For me this is the definition of direct. And I googled the and I didn't find any source that introduced this definition. The only thing were direct control popped up were actual kinetic controllers. So Direct control seems to be actually swinging a controller to swing a sword or something like that, which is far from what a controller or a mouse does so by that they are both indirect.

The only thing that is present is that controllers are directional while a mouse is non-directional. And you cannot play games like RTS with a directional device (which is why controllers basically function as a mouse and you move the pointer with the pad). A mouse hardly has any of those limitation, exspecially in combination with a keyboard. You could play the first Super Mario Brothers perfectly with just a mouse (although you might need some time to get used to it, but the controls are primitive enough), while you cannot really play a game like Starcraft with a controller. But again that has nothing to do with direct or indirect.

"
But it might help you to understand why more people prefer a gamepad for precision piloting if you remember that mouse controls are analog, so if you want to move in a straight direction you need to be extremely precise about not deviating your mouse position. A button is digital; you just press it and go straight.


You are aware that all control sticks (which are the ones used for walking) are analog. This includes the Xbox, the PS and the new Switch. And I cannot see how that is an advantage. Exspecially with some older controllers it was very easy to hit up and right at the same time. But nowadays they all have control sticks (actually even Atari had them, only the early nintendo controllers had Dpads). So in movement they are pretty much the same, but if you want your character to turn 12° to the right you have to translate that into a direction on the gamepad, with a mouse you just hold your mouse there.

Also there is no controller that has a directional button as far as I'm aware, the most button like directional inputs were the Dpads, but those are long gone.

"
That said, I suspect that Xbone control will use the analog stick, rendering that particular advantage moot, though perhaps not others--the margin of error for precision movement will still be lower. (And indeed, the game outside of the Labyrinth would probably control like shit if it did not use the analog stick.)


Uhm... how would you even control, option one is move the curser with the analog stick option and the other option is directly move the character with the analog stick, you cannot move it without the analog stick. And the second option is basically emulating a mouse, which is much worse than just using a mouse.

"
I'm kinda curious myself regardless of my feelings about parallel xbox development, it seemed pretty smooth in that gamespot interview but yeah, we'll see.


I think they might just cut things that have a hard time working with a controller. Because directional attacks are pretty easy to use. But try using a ground targetted attack like Storm Call while running away from heavy hitters like the Trio.
Spoiler


There is a difference between a dpad and an analog joystick. Both can be used to move an avatar on the screen. One method uses digital input, the other uses analog input. There are disadvantages and advantages to each.

Um, yeah. I'm not trying to be an ass, but I genuinely don't understand why that distinction confuses you, so I'm not sure what your point is.
Wash your hands, Exile!
It is VERY disappointing GGG isn't doing anything about the Lab in 3.x. So much good stuff with the bad still mixed in :(
All that and a bag of chips!
Still 4 labs in 3.0.0? YES.
U MAD?

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