Yet Another Map drop Rant
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That's why I sell all t13+ maps hehehe
Peace, -raxleberne- |
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" Newsflash: It doesn't. Maybe it did once, but I have never read it and right now I could not find anything about that. It says: " BTW the "competitive PVP" is also pretty much non-existant. " Not quite correct. There is a lot of things about mapping that are not bell curves (Gaussians). The maps you run with a certain strategy for example are strongly non-Gaussian. Why? Because the map you run next depends on what you drop now, but the map you run after that depends on both your luck this run and next run. Layered RNG. Also, maps do not drop maps of all possible tiers equally (high map drops drop a lot less low-tier maps than about-equal-tier-maps, even though it doesn't seem so), but that is only a side note. " 80 maps at 10 maps per hour, which is already quite fast considering you have to do some trading in between as well, is 8 hours per day, i.e. a full-time job. As I said, this game is not my job and I do not intend to make it mine. Neither do a lot of others. Also I wonder: Why cannot you balance the game for both casual players and more hardcore players? You would not even have to increase the average map tiers that can be run in an infinite-map-runs setting to make it more fun to casual players. You just need to lower the amount of layered RNG. Also, you could balance Standard league, where a lot of long-term casual players hang around, slightly differently. But all I ever hear from the "hardcore" players is: Learn to play, you don't roll your maps properly. They really should say: Learn to have no life. Remove Horticrafting station storage limit.
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" Well I said "sometimes I clear close to 80 maps a day" (5-6 minutes per map including occasional trading with any buyers and sorting out tabs). I should have made myself more clear: When I have the time (for instance a whole saturday with nothing to do) I can clear close 80 maps in such a day. Of course this does not happen every day. Why can't you balance the game for both casuals and hardcore players? In general terms I think every MMO, ARPG or other loot driven game fails when they start catering to much to the casual segment. WoW is the prime example of this. There has to be that reward for putting in those extra hours to achieve certain items (such as Skyforth or Acuity). The second you make everything avaible to casuals is the second no one wishes to play the game because everything is served to you on a silver platter. That is my view in general. Always has been even when I was "a casual". As for maps and the balance between casuals and hardcore players: I view T15 maps (and to a certain extend T14) as semi-unique content. It takes some effort to get there. It is not handed to you on a silver platter. Like a mortal hope (okay Hope is a bit harder to come by). It gives you something to strive for. To set a goal like "I wanna kill Core Malachai". If you have endless shots at him it becomes trivial. It you have a limited amount times you can run Core you have to make a strategy on how to achieve that goal. If you stopped layering content my suggestion would be to completely remove the map system and start using a Rift system like D3 or something similar. A system I find utterly boring. But also such a system is bad for a game such as PoE because we do have a much higher build diversity. If you wanted to do those "Tier 20 maps" in such a system you would be pigeonholed into a very few builds that could actually handle it. I actually find the current map system quite good, all though it is a bit tedious and grindy. GGG already stated they are working towards creating more endgame content besides map. Rigwald, Vinctars plaza, uber atziri and maybe labyrinths are imho the way to go. |
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" I think what he is trying to say is you cannot recieve a +1 or +2 map drop in a tier 15 map, so you cannot sustain those maps at the very end of the map pool. So sustaining T14 is hard. If those +1 and +2's are just replaced by a map of the same tier then there is no problem. |
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if casual players can beat the game by leveling a char to 100 in a temp league where is the challenge for no-lifers?
to have the same carrots for casuals and nolifers, ggg would have to split the game into two with separate difficulties. which is highly unlikely. age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill!
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once and for all:
if you get to maps in this game you are no fucking casual (in terms of games in general). also pls explain who you consider hardcore and who casual? what qualifies you to be in one or the other group? a friend of mine is playing T12+ maps (also had a T15 and some T14) but he played like half the amount of maps i did in this league. i just depleted nearly all of my T8+ maps and only ever dropped 2 T11 the whole league. am i the casual and he is the hardcore player? while i play my own build and he is copying some fotm bladefall build. i could also say you are casuals who buy their gear and get it handed to them ON A FUCKING SILVER PLATTER, YES! you are not even finding your own stuff. in some games this is actually considered casual. i can't stand this shit "i am doing it right and all others are some plebs, filthy casuals. get on my level." NO! even ppl who only play this game 2 hours a day (lol) can get to 100 or T15 maps. then others, who invest way more time might never see a T15 map (at least xp is not rng gated). " |
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you nailed it, Ruefl2x.
Peace, -kcstar- Have a problem with something I said? PM goetzjam don't derail a thread.
'There's plenty that needs to change. And back in my day we had real game devs.' - TheAnuhart Last edited by ScrotieMcB on February 30, 2016 0:61 PM Help Charan color the board - use [u color] to make your posts shine. |
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When you finally understand that map drops is only an "extra", a possible reward, you end up complaining. You must enter a map to gain experience and not to wait for that "extra gift."
Bethesda is known for having good ideas and terrible realization of them. GGG is a Bethesda subsidiary or what?
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" Our views don't differ much there. I have no problem with Skyforth being worth 120 exalt. I can do a lot of builds without getting Skyforth. But I cannot find challenge without getting T12+ maps, because most of the T10/T9/T8 maps are just very boring. So, gate items, but do not gate content. Applies for Uber as well, btw, though I have just kind of given up on Uber. What I do have a problem with are three things: 1) The extreme difference in character strength between a "casual" and a "hardcore" player, mostly made possible by Eternals, Mirrors, and legacy items, 2) The scarcity of challenging content. I got a good build now, and I can run all kinds of shit, and it is mostly, well, not very interesting. Most of all, however, I dislike 3): the fact that on a short-term basis (less than 1000 map runs), the content you play is not determined by how you roll your maps, but by RNG. So if you get unlucky, you just have a problem. Of course, you can buy maps, but that feels unrewarding to start with and not getting returns from them feels even more unrewarding. " True, but consider this: I found 4 (!) Mortal Hope before I found my first T15 map. I had two T14s at the time I found my last of those four Mortal Hopes. One of those T14s came from an Uber run. One of the reasons for this is that Mortal Hopes are gated by two layers of RNG rather than 15. The main problem with the map system is not the fact that high-level maps are too scarce. The main problem is its insane variance. This hits casual players specifically hard - or makes them specifically lucky (see example given here in the thread by Ruefl2x. " Not necessarily. Also, I suggest to not remove the layering, but to dampen it. For example by allowing standard monsters to drop +1 maps, magic/rares +2 and the boss +3, while adjusting map drop rates accordingly. That would, surprisingly, not increase mapping variance, but decrease it (trust me, I have done the math). It would also probably feel better. Furthermore, it would help if T9/T10 maps were made easier to acquire and sustain, such that it is less likely for someone who properly rolls maps (alch-and-go or alterate for packsize for T6/T7 for example) to get stuck in those tiers. " That is true, but the map system could use an overhaul as well. Right now, there is not much other end-game content for the casual player. I have hopes for the Labyrinth, but then again I fear that it will be max. lvl 65 or 70, i.e. useless. It is good that Zana will sell T11s though, though I fear they will be an exalt or sth stupid to make it completely irrelevant that she sells them. " Can we please discuss on a basis of mutual respect? Thanks. Otherwise I will start ridiculing what you say as well, and that doesn't help to make a civilised discussion. Remove Horticrafting station storage limit.
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" No, maps are a necessity, because otherwise I cannot play the game. Farming Dried Lake at lvl 95 for me is not exactly "playing the game". Remove Horticrafting station storage limit.
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