Talisman beating Torment as most boring league !

I would suggest you to stop playing this league if you dont have fun!
Take some time out. Seems like you guys been playing POE for too many month in a row. HArd to satisfie your kind...

I have fun! =)

I think these *new* leagues need more then 1 thing added

If you take std and add 1 mob to every zone that is unique that isn't really new to me and... just play std same thing who cares if one mob is added lol

I know they take the feature from these leagues and see if they can add it to std but the league itself is junk it needs way more stuff

If the whole game was like new..ish? i don't know what im trying to say then it could work but as it is its still just std with 1 thing added

I feel like these leagues should be like torchlight is

League 1 is torchlight
League 2 is torchlight 2 (everything is newish...)
League 3 would be torchlight 3 (again whole new game)

A lot of being here suffering from PoE burnout since leagues are pretty funny since it's just the latest game but updated more.

Why is something like torment league your favorite league when literally there are still ghosts in the game. Wouldn't ghost + more be better.

If you prefer ghosts BEING everywhere then this more of what was your favorite PoE mechanic then acutal league.

"

raics wrote:

So, you're basically saying just asking people which league they liked best gives the same quality of data as the method I suggested? And that their cash influx at the time will show which league was the best?

Ok, that's... enlightening. At level four.

The point is that I never claimed for your method to be bad or wrong. I simply said that one can not objectively judge the quality of a league because its impossible to quantify superiority and inferiority.

Doing it your way would give us insights regarding a leagues popularity and tell us about the league people liked best. But it still doesnt change the fact that its based on opinions, which makes it subjective by default. Rating parts of a league isnt objective because you cant quantify whether X is better than Y. Whether 20% speed is better than bosses or 4 league exclusive uniques are better than 20.

As soon as you look at something like 'profits' you base your analysis on facts. You dont have to estimate the profits, you dont have to guess. You take data and analyze it without an opinion or bias interfering. Which is the exact opposite of what 'weighing' does. Its affected by human error. That doesnt make the procedure useless, it simply doesnt do what you want it to do (because its impossible).

"

nynyny wrote:

Difficulty isnt objective. How would that be objective? Based on how many people died? Let me quickly name a few variables you have to take into consideration when looking at this
balance, internet stability, top played build and its defense, how prone is content to desync, how dangerous must maps be rolled, whats the incentive to run dangerous maps

For readability, i wont quote your whole sodding wall of text. But you need to realize how inane your points are. Of course you can objectively judge if something was more or less difficult. A mob moving 1/4th faster than normal or a chance to meet spinesnap, trying to do everything to do its name honour. A mob moving 1/4th faster than normal or a chance to spawn a vaal detonate dead beyond mob if you dont pay attention.

All the other rubbish you bolded is completely removed from that equasion. Why? Because it has nothing, not the slightest bit to do with league difficulty. Those are either all personal factors or factors of the *game at its time* not exclusive to the league.

If you want to objectively judge a league, the only thing you can judge are the things exclusive to the league. The happy feeling in onslaught you got because you found a girl at that time doesnt count. The sad feeling you got in Talisman because you got dumped? Not a factor.

Things you can judge:
a) League modifier
b) Exclusive uniques
c) Challanges

Everything else is not the scope of comparing leagues, it is "Path of exile was a better game when x league got deployed." and really has nothing to do with anything.

"

Not much of a point in continuing this conversation.

Do you really think what you do is heaving a conversation? You pelt people with insults and completely ignore everything anyone is saying to rave on about things that dont make sense.
You present your subjective and highly questionable thoughts as "facts" completely and irrevocably correct.

So thats that, i agree. No point wasting my breath with you. Have fun raving about "Onslaugt was the best because i had a happy feeling while playing it! All your "facts" are sooo subjective!" And good luck in bizarro world.

With only 2 points maybe you need to give it another shot and play more? I thought rampage was lame as hell too until I got good gear in the 70s and started racking up hundreds of rampages. Then it got fun testing myself to keep kill rates going. Didnt make it live but I wish it did.

"

nynyny wrote:

As soon as you look at something like 'profits' you base your analysis on facts. You dont have to estimate the profits, you dont have to guess. You take data and analyze it without an opinion or bias interfering. Which is the exact opposite of what 'weighing' does. Its affected by human error. That doesnt make the procedure useless, it simply doesnt do what you want it to do (because its impossible).

Look, man, I've really tried to take this discussion seriously, I truly have. And I love a good argument as much as the next guy, well, probably more, but...

First you dismiss solid figures like player retention as irrelevant and then you pull off that income stunt. Are you even aware how many perfectly irrelevant factors is that data contaminated with? If you try to compensate for all of them you won't get facts anymore, you'll get bird droppings.

It is getting absolutely ridiculous, you will have to pull off something really solid if you want to continue this.

I think it speaks volumes about the league that the last few easy to get challenges all happen to relate to talismans.


Talisman as a league is lettuce , utterly forgettable due to a very notable lack in incentive to use its mechanics.


there is no point in picking up low level talisman of any quality unless you are doing so just to get to rigi for the achievement

there is no real novel interaction between talismans and the players. you can't influence their drop quality with rarity and their over all quality is abysmal.

the fact that you cant roll talismans mean you are entierly dependent on drop rng that is notably muted.

this lack of options to improve your odds is i think the largest reason why this league sucks.

This is a game about planning and preparation to tip the odds . but there is very little to plan around talismans.

"

raics wrote:

"

nynyny wrote:

As soon as you look at something like 'profits' you base your analysis on facts. You dont have to estimate the profits, you dont have to guess. You take data and analyze it without an opinion or bias interfering. Which is the exact opposite of what 'weighing' does. Its affected by human error. That doesnt make the procedure useless, it simply doesnt do what you want it to do (because its impossible).

Look, man, I've really tried to take this discussion seriously, I truly have. And I love a good argument as much as the next guy, well, probably more, but...

First you dismiss solid figures like player retention as irrelevant and then you pull off that income stunt. Are you even aware how many perfectly irrelevant factors is that data contaminated with? If you try to compensate for all of them you won't get facts anymore, you'll get bird droppings.

It is getting absolutely ridiculous, you will have to pull off something really solid if you want to continue this.

Is this supposed to make me laugh? How exactly is player retention a solid figure?

League A goes from January to March
League B goes from April to June

Finals in the US and EU are in February (for the sake of argument). League A now loses its players rather quickly because they are focusing on their studies. League B however doesnt have that problem, because people arent abandoning the league to do something else. Doesnt that mean that it was superior? Or did the league itself have literally nothing to do with players leaving early this time?

The more variables you throw into the pot the higher the probability that youre right in assuming something. That still doesnt make it objective.

I get it, youre too incompetent to understand that superiority and inferiority cant objectively be proven unless you put them in relation to something, like profits. Just saying that A is better than B because of subjective figures is pants on head retarded. I doubt that you even understand what objectivity is at this point.

There isnt a point in continuing this.

___________________________________________________

"

For readability, i wont quote your whole sodding wall of text. But you need to realize how inane your points are. Of course you can objectively judge if something was more or less difficult. A mob moving 1/4th faster than normal or a chance to meet spinesnap, trying to do everything to do its name honour. A mob moving 1/4th faster than normal or a chance to spawn a vaal detonate dead beyond mob if you dont pay attention.

All the other rubbish you bolded is completely removed from that equasion. Why? Because it has nothing, not the slightest bit to do with league difficulty. Those are either all personal factors or factors of the *game at its time* not exclusive to the league.

If you want to objectively judge a league, the only thing you can judge are the things exclusive to the league. The happy feeling in onslaught you got because you found a girl at that time doesnt count. The sad feeling you got in Talisman because you got dumped? Not a factor.

Things you can judge:
a) League modifier
b) Exclusive uniques
c) Challanges

You mean, like the balancing, the general approach to map rolling etc? If you need to roll difficult maps to get a return, while in Beyond you were able to roll blue maps and still get a return, then the league that forces you to take additional risks sure as hell isnt easier because the implicit map mod is.

You can judge exclusive unique based on what? You can judge a league modifier based on what? Youre pulling the same stuff the other guy did: how are more exclusive uniques objectively better. Simply answer the question. How are added bosses objectively better.

"

Everything else is not the scope of comparing leagues, it is "Path of exile was a better game when x league got deployed." and really has nothing to do with anything.

It has everything to do with the league unless you assume that all the other content is developed and released independently and without the league in mind. Which I highly doubt it is.

"

Do you really think what you do is heaving a conversation? You pelt people with insults and completely ignore everything anyone is saying to rave on about things that dont make sense.
You present your subjective and highly questionable thoughts as "facts" completely and irrevocably correct.

See above. You claim that a league can be objectively judged. Then why dont you do it? I havent seen you provide a single valid point that proves that X is better than Y. More isnt objectively better. Its your opinion that it is, but that doesnt make it objective. This isnt a contest where 'more content' wins the prize. Its a questionnaire. So more isnt objectively better. Thats up to the questioned person to decide.

So please, could you finally provide proof for your claims? Because it seems that I am too stupid to understand how Beyond bosses are objectively superior to a 20% speed buff.

"

nynyny wrote:

it seems that I am too stupid to understand how Beyond bosses are objectively superior to a 20% speed buff.

mhm