Announcements - State of Exile Community Podcast - Episode 40 - Featuring Developers Chris and Carl - Forum

" Snorkle_uk wrote: doesnt matter what you do to questing, if Im playing the game a lot Im going to hit maps on day 2 or 3 of a league and still be playing maps on day 60. Im not alone in that, far from it. So far virtually all of the content creation has gone into questing and not endgame, I say they should spend some time on endgame and you jump right in telling me no, they should spend more time on that first 2 days play that has already recieved basically ALL of the serious dev time so far and by its very nature will always be 5% of the time invested into the characters I play. Yes it would be nice if it wasnt filler, leveling 1-70 is never going to take that long though, how much more time are they going to spend developing just that bit? If I play a character for 1 week Ive already spent more time in maps than the quest game, if theyre looking at their player base and thinking how do we keep players playing for more than 2 or 3 weeks at the start of a league then sorting out how shit leveling 1-20 is when youre done with that in the first hour of character is not giving the game any longevity at all. How do you make sure people are still playing 12 weeks into a league? By spending as much time developing what they do for weeks 2 to 12 as theyre spending developing what they do in week 1. Im aware other people exist thanks, Im not concerned with how much of their game time is spent in quest zones one by one to be honest. Theres an awful lot of people for whom endgame/racing is 50%+ of their time spent and the quest part has already received the vast majority of the development. NeroNoah created an interesting thread about it in GD. An article I actually already read a while ago before it was posted. This hyperfocus on endgame by some players is really starting to boil my blood. Keep in mind that you are a very small minority. You breeze through the entire game in 2 days and you EXPECT that your way of gaming is a representation of the average PoE player? Then you have the nerve to outright say that the questing and story (which is the core game by the way) should take a backseat. I am actually very grateful of what GGG has done with the lore, story and atmosphere of this game. The gameplay itself is topnotch. There are only a few number of pc games that ever amazed me in that regard. And PoE is one of them. That is saying something. Leveling is not a burden at all in my eyes. I just love to see my character grow as in any classic rpg. I also like the journey itself; smashing my way through hordes of monsters in very gratifying ways. And I get an entire skill tree AND set of twink items at my disposal to make that possible. (Twink uniques which are considered shit by the community. Well anything is shit in their eyes if you cant cash it in for some exalts but that is another story entirely.) Spice it up a little bit. Actually you just want GGG to cater your own PERSONAL needs. I hope GGG never caves in to the legion of WoW-zombified entities and their vision of an online game. Fuck WoW is such a shitty, uninspired game. Like most games these days. Like pretty much else these days. Guess it is part of our time. Heart of Purity Awarded 'Silverblade' to Talent Competition Winner 2020. POE turned into a ratrace for the most div/hour. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDFO4E5OKSE	Posted by Reinhart on Oct 13, 2015, 1:14:46 PM Quote this Post
" Snorkle_uk wrote: doesnt matter what you do to questing, if Im playing the game a lot Im going to hit maps on day 2 or 3 of a league and still be playing maps on day 60. Im not alone in that, far from it. So far virtually all of the content creation has gone into questing and not endgame, I say they should spend some time on endgame and you jump right in telling me no, they should spend more time on that first 2 days play that has already recieved basically ALL of the serious dev time so far and by its very nature will always be 5% of the time invested into the characters I play. Thing is that it takes a lot of time and practice to get to that point of ending there in 2 or 3 days. From a retention point of view, it's stupid to have the "core" part of the game so late. " Snorkle_uk wrote: Yes it would be nice if it wasnt filler, leveling 1-70 is never going to take that long though, how much more time are they going to spend developing just that bit? If I play a character for 1 week Ive already spent more time in maps than the quest game, if theyre looking at their player base and thinking how do we keep players playing for more than 2 or 3 weeks at the start of a league then sorting out how shit leveling 1-20 is when youre done with that in the first hour of character is not giving the game any longevity at all. How do you make sure people are still playing 12 weeks into a league? By spending as much time developing what they do for weeks 2 to 12 as theyre spending developing what they do in week 1. Have you thought that there are other ways like bringing mapping early rather than overworking questing? I've even thought about other solutions, but that would be nice for everyone. If you like mapping so much, the way to do it is to put it early so it's easier to justify spending money there. GGG doesn't spend so much in maps for a good reason. There are not a lot of Atziri like bosses for a reason. It's all about the return on investment. " Snorkle_uk wrote: Im aware other people exist thanks, Im not concerned with how much of their game time is spent in quest zones one by one to be honest. Theres an awful lot of people for whom endgame/racing is 50%+ of their time spent and the quest part has already received the vast majority of the development. Yes, they are an awful lot, but what's their percentage? 20% 30%? Now think that, but compared to potential new players that could bring money to the game. Your problem is to think that you are part of the majority without a lot of proof. You are as valuable as any player out there, and I sympathize your call for more efforts on mapping (and I actually support them), but at the end of the day, you are a minority here, and the hyperfocus in Endgames has been problematic on other games (think of MMORPGs), because it makes truly hard to sustain a reasonable level of effort for any part of the game (be levelling or endgame), it's the worst of two worlds. Add a Forsaken Masters questline https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2297942 Last edited by NeroNoah on Oct 13, 2015, 3:23:08 PM	Posted by NeroNoah on Oct 13, 2015, 2:16:38 PM Quote this Post
" NeroNoah wrote: Yes, they are an awful lot, but what's their percentage? 20% 30%? Now think that, but compared to potential new players that could bring money to the game. Your problem is to think that you are part of the majority without a lot of proof. he is not and i think 20-30% of the paying player base make it to maps. some comments on the podcast: if i race i normally run with and end up with constantly half the level as the winner. i got quite used to that but i fear that individual race starts will kill that "competitional aspect" i've been always uder the impression that giving mtx as challenge prices already must have fucked up sales of gear, i mean freebies just had to do two leagues to get 2 complete and amazing sets of gear ... i don't think most players don't want much more. charging for those one month races would have been the right thing to do. if you can earn mtx there must be an entrance fee. aternatively, what about giving out currency as race rewards towards accounts that did a certain threshold of races already? item to skin transfer option, amazing idea, really. improve communication about racing, always a good idea. although feeding the wiki with info would have been enough. on a related note: when i see a dev write: "the wiki is wrong about" that i never understood why he didn't wrote "the wiki was wrong about that" spectating the top racers? not interested. i can watch their twitch streams if i feel like it and that's ok. Spoiler how old are the fixed images of chris and carl? and i think i know why they didn't show up live (sorry zeno). Spoiler age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill! Last edited by vio on Oct 13, 2015, 3:53:53 PM	Posted by vio on Oct 13, 2015, 3:27:48 PM Alpha Member Quote this Post
" vio wrote: " NeroNoah wrote: Yes, they are an awful lot, but what's their percentage? 20% 30%? Now think that, but compared to potential new players that could bring money to the game. Your problem is to think that you are part of the majority without a lot of proof. he is not and i think 20-30% of the paying player base make it to maps. Well, it seems Chris confirms what I said then (isn't it?). That being said: maps don't receive as much effort, but builds are thought around the endgame, so it's partially true to say that most of the effort is not in the endgame. The whole levelling-endgame dichotomy must end someday, else you'll end with two factions fighting for developer attention. Add a Forsaken Masters questline https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2297942	Posted by NeroNoah on Oct 13, 2015, 3:46:38 PM Quote this Post
" NeroNoah wrote: Well, it seems Chris confirms what I said then (isn't it?). yep, that's wha i looked it up. " NeroNoah wrote: That being said: maps don't receive as much effort, but builds are thought around the endgame, so it's partially true to say that most of the effort is not in the endgame. endgame is a relative term, my definition is: it's the area where the majority of dedicated players gets stuck. according to chris it's not endgame maps if you take my definition of "dedication" which is: supporting the game. " NeroNoah wrote: The whole levelling-endgame dichotomy must end someday, else you'll end with two factions fighting for developer attention. there can only be winners if th game improves as a result. age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill!	Posted by vio on Oct 13, 2015, 4:09:03 PM Alpha Member Quote this Post
" vio wrote: endgame is a relative term, my definition is: it's the area where the majority of dedicated players gets stuck. according to chris it's not endgame maps if you take my definition of "dedication" which is: supporting the game. Well, there are many ways to be stuck in this game (racing, levelling alts, hideouts, even pvp, :P). The development manifesto post about maps in 2012 says this explicitly. But maps is the most visible aspect, for almost anyone, even if a minority gets there. ... Before someone makes the point: no, dedication and support are not that strongly correlated. Add a Forsaken Masters questline https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2297942	Posted by NeroNoah on Oct 13, 2015, 4:16:00 PM Quote this Post
So... which week should I book off work in December? 7pm EST (NA) ~ 11pm EST	Posted by phoenixrage on Oct 13, 2015, 4:28:20 PM Quote this Post
WTF? I haven't listened to the podcast for awhile and am surprised that the picture of Chris hasn't been updated. Why haven't they asked Chris for a new picture, or better yet, why can't he be streamed too? I know NZ ia way out in the middle of nowhere but don't they have any fast Internet there? Down under shouldn't mean that Internet speed is down under too. "You've got to grind, grind, grind at that grindstone..." Necessity may be the mother of invention, but poor QoP in PoE is the father of frustration. The perfect solution to fix Trade Chat: www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2247070	Posted by Arrowneous on Oct 13, 2015, 11:42:23 PM Quote this Post
" Arrowneous wrote: Down under shouldn't mean that Internet speed is down under too. i didn't see any tcp-packet transport sheep in the new office' pictures, let alone the high speed ones. age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill!	Posted by vio on Oct 14, 2015, 4:13:34 PM Alpha Member Quote this Post