Spark

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Tasonir wrote:
Now that spark has 4 projectiles by default, wouldn't hooking it up with multiple projectiles (level 1) actually decrease your damage? 25% more projectiles, -30% damage. Obviously at higher levels it would be positive again, I am just wondering if there is going to be some change to make spark less affected by the damage penalty similar to how it is less affected by added damage, or if it's just not intended that players will use spark + multiple projectile?


Or does spark + MP scale really well at high levels of spark? I have not yet tested that personally, just theorycrafting.
Level 16 Multiple Projectiles is +4 projectiles, so it's twice as many projectiles and -30% damage, for a 40% increase overall. However, the fact that you're hitting more often means you get more benefit from Shocked.
Last edited by Strill on Feb 8, 2012, 4:53:32 PM
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Strill wrote:
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Tasonir wrote:
Now that spark has 4 projectiles by default, wouldn't hooking it up with multiple projectiles (level 1) actually decrease your damage? 25% more projectiles, -30% damage. Obviously at higher levels it would be positive again, I am just wondering if there is going to be some change to make spark less affected by the damage penalty similar to how it is less affected by added damage, or if it's just not intended that players will use spark + multiple projectile?


Or does spark + MP scale really well at high levels of spark? I have not yet tested that personally, just theorycrafting.
Level 16 Multiple Projectiles is +4 projectiles, so it's twice as many projectiles and -30% damage, for a 40% increase overall. However, the fact that you're hitting more often means you get more benefit from Shocked.


Running the numbers you get a 5% increase at the second spark, which is nice, and then a 22.5% increase at the third.

Projectile speed + Multi + Pierce + Faster casts + chaos might be the way to go, or drop faster casts for cold damage. depends on what your build will attempt to accomplish.
-Meteoric Destiny!
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MDragoon wrote:
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Strill wrote:
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Tasonir wrote:
Now that spark has 4 projectiles by default, wouldn't hooking it up with multiple projectiles (level 1) actually decrease your damage? 25% more projectiles, -30% damage. Obviously at higher levels it would be positive again, I am just wondering if there is going to be some change to make spark less affected by the damage penalty similar to how it is less affected by added damage, or if it's just not intended that players will use spark + multiple projectile?


Or does spark + MP scale really well at high levels of spark? I have not yet tested that personally, just theorycrafting.
Level 16 Multiple Projectiles is +4 projectiles, so it's twice as many projectiles and -30% damage, for a 40% increase overall. However, the fact that you're hitting more often means you get more benefit from Shocked.


Running the numbers you get a 5% increase at the second spark, which is nice, and then a 22.5% increase at the third.

Projectile speed + Multi + Pierce + Faster casts + chaos might be the way to go, or drop faster casts for cold damage. depends on what your build will attempt to accomplish.
How did you just "run the numbers"? You need to know the crit chance and shocked chance to be able to figure that out.
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How did you just "run the numbers"? You need to know the crit chance and shocked chance to be able to figure that out.


+2 sparks is 50% more sparks at 30% less damage for a total damage change of (1.5)(.7) = 1.05 or 5% more. +3 sparks gives (1.75)(.7) = 1.225 or 22.5% more. This is just a straight up comparison to the same skill without multi proj, so the other factors don't rly matter since they're the same either way, unless you want to factor in the opportunity cost of using a different support gem in that same slot.
Last edited by bennyr on Feb 12, 2012, 11:47:22 AM
I've just recently attained chaos with my frenzied projectile spell ranger (video here). I attempt to use Ice Spear, Fireball, and Spark, all depending on what the situation is. I've been slowly discovering that Spark with the Pierce support gem usually performs as well as, if not better than, Fireball and Ice Spear with the low-mana supports I have for them. This seems to hold up even when using it on rares in the open field, which makes no sense to me, as Spark clearly isn't designed for this.

I know there are a lot of factors here, including my cast speed bonus from frenzy charges that lets me cast spark more than twice a second. This will result in crits more quickly, which build shocked stacks quickly for more overall damage. But this is one of the main features of spark, and has been for as long as I have used it.

But this doesn't account for why Spark seems to have better damage output against lightning resistant rares that I can rarely even cause a shocked effect on. Usually, I would try to use Ice Spear + Increased Critical Damage at range. It does a pretty good job at keeping most rares frozen and often kills normal mobs in chaos with one or two hits. But often this combo can't outpace spark's damage even without terrain to bounce my sparks for rebound damage.


This leads me to the conclusion that the combination of 4 projectiles, high crit rate, faster base cast speed than other spells, and cheap mana cost make the new spark too powerful in comparison to the other projectile spells.
Urist McDwarfy has been happy lately. He admired an exceptional ARPG recently. He took joy in slaughter lately. He has been attacked by the dead recently.
Check out the Path of Exile wiki: http://en.pathofexilewiki.com
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UristMcDwarfy wrote:
I've just recently attained chaos with my frenzied projectile spell ranger (video here). I attempt to use Ice Spear, Fireball, and Spark, all depending on what the situation is. I've been slowly discovering that Spark with the Pierce support gem usually performs as well as, if not better than, Fireball and Ice Spear with the low-mana supports I have for them. This seems to hold up even when using it on rares in the open field, which makes no sense to me, as Spark clearly isn't designed for this.

I know there are a lot of factors here, including my cast speed bonus from frenzy charges that lets me cast spark more than twice a second. This will result in crits more quickly, which build shocked stacks quickly for more overall damage. But this is one of the main features of spark, and has been for as long as I have used it.

But this doesn't account for why Spark seems to have better damage output against lightning resistant rares that I can rarely even cause a shocked effect on. Usually, I would try to use Ice Spear + Increased Critical Damage at range. It does a pretty good job at keeping most rares frozen and often kills normal mobs in chaos with one or two hits. But often this combo can't outpace spark's damage even without terrain to bounce my sparks for rebound damage.


This leads me to the conclusion that the combination of 4 projectiles, high crit rate, faster base cast speed than other spells, and cheap mana cost make the new spark too powerful in comparison to the other projectile spells.
Why is mana cost even a consideration for you? Aren't your flasks enough?
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Strill wrote:
Why is mana cost even a consideration for you? Aren't your flasks enough?

Usually, yes. However, there are occasionally situations (especially before I switched from 1 diamond flask/4 mana) where I'll have to use a flask to finish up a fight, then lose a bunch due to overage before I get to the next fight. Spamming Ice Spear on a particularly beefy rare also tends to take a lot of out me, and I think that's my main mana drain issue.

The problem is finding a support for Ice Spear single target that will give me the biggest bang for my buck. I tried an Added Lightning Damage, but that wasn't as effective as I'd have liked, and ended up draining me quite a bit. It worked well on magics and normals, but they usually come in packs anyway. I often failed to get any shocked effect on all but the weakest rares. I guess the damage/duration just isn't high enough. Adding crit damage multiplier would probably help, but I don't have any decent gear that has it.

I could try leveling a chaos support too, but I think lightning is probably a better choice for this application.
Urist McDwarfy has been happy lately. He admired an exceptional ARPG recently. He took joy in slaughter lately. He has been attacked by the dead recently.
Check out the Path of Exile wiki: http://en.pathofexilewiki.com
Spark is my main skill and... it rocks :p
This is more of a minor gripe with the skill, but would it be possible to change the impact on rocks and treasure chests so the sparks go OVER them instead of bouncing off them and shooting backwards away from you?

The reason I ask is because there are many times when mobs are coming at you from the opposite side of the screen (duh) and you are positioned between them and a boulder or chest. Firing off spark doesn't yield any hits because they all bounce off those objects, meanwhile the mob is pounding on you and you're dying, not them - not fun.

I understand the rational behind having spark bounce off certain objects, but you'd think that a witch would be able to cast a spell over a 1-foot tall chest/boulder.
Brixtan [Default League]
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Arda_EAC: LV 67 Summoner
Brixtan: LV 27 Templar
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Brixtan wrote:
This is more of a minor gripe with the skill, but would it be possible to change the impact on rocks and treasure chests so the sparks go OVER them instead of bouncing off them and shooting backwards away from you?

The reason I ask is because there are many times when mobs are coming at you from the opposite side of the screen (duh) and you are positioned between them and a boulder or chest. Firing off spark doesn't yield any hits because they all bounce off those objects, meanwhile the mob is pounding on you and you're dying, not them - not fun.

I understand the rational behind having spark bounce off certain objects, but you'd think that a witch would be able to cast a spell over a 1-foot tall chest/boulder.


This also occurs with invisible walls, such as those at the edge of bridges and cave paths over water. Rather strange that you can shoot an arrow across a river but you can't do the same with a spark.

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