risk/reward isn't coming. ever. [I give up]

@RagnarokChu it was a call-out to Xav.
I'll read your post and respond as soon as I successfully load Cruel Barracks and get the WP, without disconnecting to login screen.

no need to rape my eyes with flashy bold underlined text.

"

johnKeys wrote:

@RagnarokChu it was a call-out to Xav.
I'll read your post and respond as soon as I successfully load Cruel Barracks and get the WP, without disconnecting to login screen.

no need to rape my eyes with flashy bold underlined text.

No need to respond directly mines, stuff like Peterlerock or Poutsos are alot more clear if you want clear concise points to respond too if you prefer or need a better understanding.

The general gist of it is that risk vs reward is not coming because it's modeled after D2.

Unless the game is built from the ground up to enforce skill based play, it's modeled after the outdated game that we all know and love.

Spot on John.
I feel you.

And no, that wasn't a wall of text, I just got warmed up... could have read much more about it.

"

Aim_Deep wrote:

I dont think you have a choice between "around trade" or just "sometimes trade". It's either a trade game or BoA game. Because when trade is allowed it's automatically superior....

Yes. Maybe allow 10 trades per day. Or make items which you got via trade BOA.
That would allow people to trade for missing items to play with, but not become insanely rich off it.

"

johnKeys wrote:

"

Xavderion wrote:

"

RagnarokChu wrote:

Why are you actling like it's either strawman, acting dumb or personal attacks?

Because he can't refute our valid points. It's a classic strategy from Mr. Keys.

make one valid point. one.
explain it. with respect towards both yourself, and the one you're explaining to.
no strawmen and no BS.
no insults and no trolling.

for reference, search this forum for posts by RogueMage, DalaiLama and Raics. maybe some old ones by Scrotie.
just a couple examples to get you started.

when you are ready, I'll gladly respond.
consider this a call-out.
an "I don't think you can write mature posts" call-out, to be exact.

I'm not biting bro. Either you counter my points, or you pussy out. Your choice.
Just to make it clear, my point was: there is no real risk in an ARPG so the whole risk/reward thing is redundant. We get more loot for killing bosses instead of trash mobs and that's it.

"

Treffnix wrote:

"

Aim_Deep wrote:

I dont think you have a choice between "around trade" or just "sometimes trade". It's either a trade game or BoA game. Because when trade is allowed it's automatically superior....

Yes. Maybe allow 10 trades per day. Or make items which you got via trade BOA.
That would allow people to trade for missing items to play with, but not become insanely rich off it.

Why would people trading and becoming insanely rich off of it have anything to do with the base game itself?

If I suddenly removing trading it doesn't fix the problems with the game.

"

RagnarokChu wrote:

If I suddenly removing trading it doesn't fix the problems with the game.

B-but then we could make a self-found paradise and the perfect ARPG out of PoE, like Blizz did with D3 Kappa

"

johnKeys wrote:

[EDIT to clarify: this isn't a "quitting game" thread. I'm still playing.]

Is it a "quitting risk v reward threads" post?

If so, can I has your...


uhhm :/

Play other games, serious.

Path of Exile is three acts repeated three times. Nothing more, nothing less. It's not built to endure hundreds of hours of actual play. They already substantially diminished the level of rng with Masters, the only really annoying thing that remains is the RNG gated content. All this time, and it's still nothing more than endless Baal runs.

If the map system generated entire actual acts, with quests that had rewards, that would be a horse of an entirely different color.

killed Cruel Dominus. with about 1k life, uncapped resistances (and awful cold res), under-leveled -2. Tornado Shot is so OP :)
died to 2nd form once though... well gear check is gear check I suppose.

right, enough off-topic. here's the response I promised, RagnarokChu.

"

RagnarokChu wrote:

"Most casual players won't see uber artizi or have a 6-link shavs." (Which isn't valid, most people period do not see uber aritzri or a 6link shavs by intention because they are suppose to be the hardest and rarest items)

not a valid point. you can still casually drop a Shavronne from some barrel in a white map, then casually 1 Jewel 1 Fuse it all the way to 6-link.
all the while someone who's taking on the game's most crazy challenges solo, gets nothing even near that.
and playing a copied OP build, being a trade-tycoon with mirrored gear that knows more about trade than about game mechanics - will get you to at least face Uber Atziri a couple times.
someone who just plays? well good luck with that.

"

They added "real crafting" with masters, progressively made the game easier and make mostly everything accessible.

semi-correct. it would be real crafting if their "prices" were in things you attain by doing their missions, or by beating content challenges.
when their "crafting" is priced in economy-currency, which forces you to trade (unless there are vendor recipes for the high orbs, I'm not aware of) - it's not yet crafting. close, but no.

"

No do not tell me D2 has "risk vs reward".

the least we can agree about D2, is it actually had gear tiers. you didn't drop Caps in Hell Difficulty.

"

Do not tell me "medianxl" had risk vs reward.

MXL had crazy uber zones, crazier uber zones, and impossible uber zones.
you could do the crazy ones with gear from content, and they would drop you stuff you could then use to attempt the crazier ones, and so forth.
enough skill and determination, and you'd have the gear and build which could do a subset of the impossible ones.

"

Do not tell me "torchlight" had risk vs reward, there was no risk what so ever for any amount of reward.

don't bullshit me man. TL2 is one of my favourite games, and if you think it's easy - I highly recommend actually trying it in Elite Difficulty. in Hardcore, where you actually fucking lose your character if you die. doing NG+ Uber Zones I never could do. doing Tarroch's Tomb I never had the balls to do in HC.
my only real gripe with it, is Elite didn't have better loot than a lower difficulty.
its amount of Risk/Reward is something Path Of Exile would never have, even if GGG wanted to.
the loot system in there, is a fucking masterpiece.
the monster and boss AI there (in solo at least), is an example how to challenge players without necessarily one-shotting them left and right.
ask GGG where they got inspiration for Vaal Oversoul from. then ask them why the fuck didn't they follow-up on this great boss, and instead opted for one-shot gear-checks and screen-full of GPU-killing particle mess their own engine can't handle.

"

Even the hardest game like roguelikes (like rogue) do not have risk vs reward

I shamefully admit playing Rogue with my own "loaned" saves.
ask Shagsbeard how he played it. it had no risk/reward, but was fucking awesome.

"

You complain and complain but don't offer any actual content, your similar to people who posts they want perfect world peace. Which sounds nice but in reality is extremely complicated thing to do.

strawman. and I do offer suggestions. some very detailed ones. mostly dating back to Open Beta when it wasn't yet too late.
I suggest you just go ahead and read these - mine and not - before expecting me to repeat all of it just because you can't be bothered to.