risk/reward isn't coming. ever. [I give up]

"

Xavderion wrote:

EVE Online has risk vs reward. You risk your super expensive ship to destroy some other guy's super expensive ship and salvage/loot his stuff. That's risk vs reward. Pls tell me where the risk is in playing a diablo-style game x) I could maybe understand this from a hardcore point of view where you can lose your character with good gears every time you attempt a ridiculous boss but Mr. Keys ain't playing hardcore so I don't get it!

Hell yeah fucking steal people shit haha and their like in communication PLEASE DON'T DON'T TAKE MA SHIT and my crew like FUCK THAT TAKE HIS SHIT YEEEEEEEEEE

"

morbo wrote:

"

Peterlerock wrote:

"Risk vs Reward" cannot be implemented.

What is a "risk" to player A with his gear/tree, will be faceroll content to player B.

How should the game handle this?

By introducing more fights that are mostly skill-check, instead of gear check. (normal) Atziri is the perfect example, where a skillfull player will do just as good, if not better, than an overgeared player.

Of course there needs to be a certain level of gear check, else gear looses its meaning. But the game definitelly needs more Atziri and less Spinner of false hope.

(yea, there is desync that shits on the whole "combat positioning" thig, unfortunatelly)

Okay but that isn't "risk vs reward" because if I can have the boss on farm like you can do now there is no "risk". It's just harder content for more reward. The only "risk vs reward" applies to hardcore is that there is an actual "present" risk to you.

When you die in this game you lose nothing, nada, 0 things important unless you think time to farm back xp is an true lost. You can try things an infinite amount of times, any amount of gear and circumvent a skill-check eventually and when you have enough skill then there is no risk.

Risk verses reward implies the "Risk" part does not mean "harder."

It means you are "risking" something to gain something greater.

The game already scales gear if it gets harder.

"

I_NO wrote:

"

Xavderion wrote:

EVE Online has risk vs reward. You risk your super expensive ship to destroy some other guy's super expensive ship and salvage/loot his stuff. That's risk vs reward. Pls tell me where the risk is in playing a diablo-style game x) I could maybe understand this from a hardcore point of view where you can lose your character with good gears every time you attempt a ridiculous boss but Mr. Keys ain't playing hardcore so I don't get it!

Hell yeah fucking steal people shit haha and their like in communication PLEASE DON'T DON'T TAKE MA SHIT and my crew like FUCK THAT TAKE HIS SHIT YEEEEEEEEEE

"Pay 10m ISK if you don't want to get podded" "O-okay *pays up*" "*Pods him anyway* get rekt scrub"

Such is life in Soviet Lowsec.

the reward will never come, 100% agree

"

Xavderion wrote:

You're just bitter for some reason. GGG has never stopped caring about how players think about their game, they're constantly changing it to accommodate the players' needs. Just because they don't do what YOU specifically want, doesn't mean they don't listen to feedback.

Right, so we can now turn off skill effects to reduce strain on our computers.
-They have shifted focus from making new content to optimizing the current content.
-They removed accuracy and other factors that cause more desync.
-They made the 70-100 grind a lot, lot less tedious. Not forcing us to abandon characters at lvl 80.
-They shifted focus from constantly having to roll maps for experience to changing the maplevels all the way up to lvl 95. leaving rollable maps for good loot.
-They've promoted group play, rather than enforce it, with better xp and only seeing your own loot. Like a true permanent allocation mode. To reduce the lag even more. Since having an entire screen filled with white junk doesn't actually invoke good feelings. It just makes a person feel like they have to wade through a swamp of excrement for that one chip of a blood diamond.


Let's go with no. Except for masters and strongboxes(both solid decisions), they've remained very stubborn about these other issues. For no good reason whatsoever.
They're most likely afraid people will stop buying mtx if they allow for turning effects off, but here's the kicker. If I can't play together with people with mtx, I won't see them anyway. Nor would I ever buy them since they make the game slower. All it does however, is drive people away since grinding alone is boring for most and unrewarding for the rest.

"

morbo wrote:

"

Peterlerock wrote:

"Risk vs Reward" cannot be implemented.

What is a "risk" to player A with his gear/tree, will be faceroll content to player B.

How should the game handle this?

By introducing more fights / content that are mostly skill-check, instead of gear check. (normal) Atziri is the perfect example, where a skillfull player will do just as good, if not better, than an overgeared player.

1. I'm pretty sure there's some guys facetanking/AFKing or nearly one-shotting normal atziri.
Those guys get the same reward (and they get it quicker) then someone who struggles and uses "Skill instead of gear".

2. I actually like gear-checks and overgearing.
If I wanted a game to be challenging, I'd play a challenging game (ideally against humans).
In games like PoE, I can equip some crazy gear (*) and murder harmless and innocent poor little monsters. With one hand. And then I loot their corpses. That's quite entertaining and all this genre is about (to me): "Get geared up to a point where everything is trivial and there are no more challenges."

(*) Not talking 100 Ex mirror stuff. You already get this experience by using gear for ~15 Ex total. Or in lower levels when using stuff like "mightflay".

"

choopk1993 wrote:

LET IT RAIN EXALTED ORBS,MIRRORS,DIVINE ORBS AND 6 LINK ITEMS AND TOP TIER UNIQUES TO SOLVE THE WOES OF EXILES.

rain of currency would actually make the game better
the prices will adjust considering the o/d and people will start trading items for items and currency will be more used for whats its meant to be, crafting, without the fear of loosing wealth

reading this you understand the reward will never come

http://www.grindinggear.com/

'we understand what is required to make an addictive action RPG with visceral combat' (desync) 'and a complex item economy' (flipping).

"

Peterlerock wrote:

"Risk vs Reward" cannot be implemented.

What is a "risk" to player A with his gear/tree, will be faceroll content to player B.

How should the game handle this?
Should it notice that player A died 3 times in the map and his health pool jumped up and down like crazy, and it took him 3 hours to complete it, so he gets a shiny new item in the end?
While player B gets nothing, because he wasn't challenged?
How should that work? How should the game even know what "a good item upgrade" would look like for player A?

Also there's the spiral of "get better gear, still want better gear".
What would change if, let's say, low level affixes were removed from highlevel content, or bad affixes were removed entirely, or specific uniques would no longer be 1:10^324554?
Step 1: all players would find better gear in highlevel content.
Step 2: 90% of players would still see even better gear than theirs on the other 10%.
Step 3: they would again farm for currency and trade or qq the forums about "shitty drops".

---

The only thing that PoE can do is what it currently does:
make it all random.
That way it doesn't matter if you faceroll or struggle, the reward is equal.
Equally shitty, but equal.

+1 i was suprised that it took that long until someone sums it up properly

just a small notice to the "usual" people who always seem to try and "counter" my arguments, with anything from personal attacks, to straw arguments, to "acting dumb" as if this game is their first-ever ARPG played, to repeating questions like "well how would you do it?", even though they got their answer a thousand times over:

1) I'm not giving up the fight because of you. don't flatter yourself.

2) I won't argue your straws for the millionth fucking time, repeating the same answers to the same questions.

3) it's possible to debate and counter-argument properly, without assuming the other side is a bloody idiot, and without making a fool out of yourself.

4) when you understand (1) and (2), and are ready to act according to (3) - we will discuss this.
but I'm not making any more risk/reward threads because the point is gone.
GGG aren't listening, and I'll be damned if they ever did.

I'll discuss it here, only for the sake of discussing.
there will be no changes to the core game, I'm sure of it. you can be happy because you got exactly what you wanted, from GGG.