risk/reward isn't coming. ever. [I give up]

Anyway, I agree with title - risk/reward wont be ever in this game. I got the most rare & 'expensive' items from the most faceroll content.

The currently closest thing to it is Atziri (it's also a really fun fight, on top of that). Too bad it's gated behind menial bot-like tasks, instead of something fun*

* eg. to get an atziri set you'd have to beat a descent-champions like dungeon in a time limit. You could also set the dungeon difficulty ranging from 50% (doable with good gear) to 100% (extreme difficulty), which would also be the chance a set drops at the end. You'd spend the same time in game to get a set as you do now, it wuld just be a fun gameplay time, instead of playing a bot simulator.

/ranting

"

MoonYu wrote:

Good luck John, I always like your posts, hope you find another game to enjoy.

edited OP to clarify, Moon.
I'm not quitting, but I am tired of getting ignored by GGG - so no more posts about the loot system.
it is what GGG wanted to do all along, and it is far too late for them to change anything, without making the same kinds of players they deem "hardcore" feel frustrated and bored.

making me and players like me frustrated? sure.
but making a top-tier no-life Streamer who's also a multi-thousand-exalts trade-tycoon and multi-client MF grinder + leader of a party/guild of Cullers, frustrated? obviously not. for obvious reasons.

John, perhaps you should add to the thread title that you do not quit. You've got so many people confused :D.

I'm not much of a trader and would also like some stuff to be less gated, so that I could really find it without relying on RNG.
I still have no idea, though, how risk/ reward would work. Perhaps a feasible way would be to remove low level drops from hard enemies. Now that we have Vorici, we don't even need those ilevel 50+ quill rains anymore to get 6L on them.

"

johnKeys wrote:

but I still wonder, why did they design the game around trade in the first place, back when they did have a choice?

I dont think you have a choice between "around trade" or just "sometimes trade". It's either a trade game or BoA game. Because when trade is allowed it's automatically superior to trade. So what they had to do is ratchet down drops with trade in mind to keep peoples interest. Even with heavy trading, knowing itemization and many builds to make solid trades it still takes most players all season to suit up GG. Working as intended.

"

BerMalBerIst1_AKA_GrammerPolise wrote:

"

morbo wrote:

instead of playing a bot simulator.

/ranting

What's a bot simulator

Forced gameplay in search of corrupted zones. Using tricks like the door one, or estimating loading times, to speed up the proces at which resource X aquisition should naturally happen (if it wasat locked out from maps). Reloading the same instance over and over and getting taged as a bot for it :))

Try it. Its fun ARPGing

"

johnKeys wrote:

but I still wonder, why did they design the game around trade in the first place, back when they did have a choice?

Because they always said they made the game they wanted to play, and as they also said several times, they think that getting loot that might be useful for others and trade with them is fun. I find it fun too. I find a game more boring when you can't do anything with the godly loot you just got but doesn't suit your class/build. Now there is still a gap between that mindset and the "24/7 a1n sitting flipper", which a lot of trading-haters over here seem to ignore.

"

morbo wrote:

Forced gameplay in search of corrupted zones. Using tricks like the door one, or estimating loading times, to speed up the proces at which resource X aquisition should naturally happen (if it wasat locked out from maps). Reloading the same instance over and over and getting taged as a bot for it :))
Try it. Its fun ARPGing

deadly cycle which feeds itself, man.

trade-centred design and tight, unforgiving, virtually-unbiased, all-mighty RNG - created these practices.
and once these practices are in place and used by a majority of players - you need to tighten RNG even more, else those players will get bored and demand new things to do, before you can provide these...

the end result as I see it, won't be just mandatory trade/bot-like-grind.
it will soon enough be trade/bot-grind as the only means of progress - even at low content - but when RNG will be too tight and nothing will be dropping to feed the trade pyramid, that same trade won't be able to sustain itself.
implosion.

"

johnKeys wrote:

No one from GGG seems to give a shit.

At this point, you can say that about pretty much every topic at hand.
They're in full on turtle mode and only respond to vapid zippyD-like posts.

Here is the problem. People like johnKeys have a vague concept of what they want from the game based on the expectation of what their changes would bring. He and many others don't understand they are being shortsighted and things won't work out how they imagine them.

The reason PoE's itemization and trade system are the way they are is because it is intended to reflect the variable reward and value systems of games like Magic The Gathering. There is a reason they called MTG cardboard crack. Not knowing what the reward will be and having no guarantees to the value creates a level of anticipation and eventually a massive "high" when finding something rare and valuable. This causes the compulsion to seek that "high" again and again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRxCeO2KIS8 - Jump to 8mins.


Now the point I'm getting to is that variable reward and value systems in MTG and other games are dependent on the scarcity and rarity of the rewards. Scarcity in the face of infinite demand is what determines value, value is what makes things rewarding, and the variability between finding common rewards and very rare rewards creates the high that makes you want to chase the next fix.

So what johnKeys is asking for in his risk/reward campaign actually undermines this. He wants a level of guarantee or quality control so that it is more likely he will get rarer items for harder content, which would effectively make them less scarce spoiling the long term reward system.

You will be missed.