How is GGG going to stop D2JSP and similar scum?

o and to add... the whole point of this game is A) get really kick ___ items on your own. B) climb the ladders.

by buying or allowing the buying of items for real money or allowing cross league trading, you are defeating the purpose of A and making it easier to do B which then gives you less satisfaction than if you found A on your own, and was able to do B because of you doing A yourself.

its the same in almost every ARPG.

Y'know what'd be really handy, if dupes ever become an issue? An in-game item authenticator. Either a command or interface option which runs a review of an item's history, red-flagging any suspicious elements, or, if GGG wanted to be immersive, have it be an NPC function.

Wouldn't that be embarrassing? Nessa says, "This sword is a phantom item, made by the foulest sorcery. Don't trust its bearer."

Heheh. Duper outed by Nessa. =^[.]^=

"

troublekid wrote:

hmm... couldn't GGG make a report button, have the report button have a question attatched to it asking for what reason are u sending a report, then have a warning system and/or a number system that will ban the player based on the amount of reports received? i mean as long as a majority of the league/server reports the person then he will be autobanned... i mean in wow as soon as i see a goldfarmer/itemseller bot i auto report... perhaps having a majority report and or 30% population report system will make autobans possible.

The only rule to this system would be that the the person has to be reported for the same thing by everyone.

the report could look like this

Report (button)

Scrolls down, Select a choice for report:

Item/currency selling

player harrasment,

Troll.

Seems like a good way for a group of trolls to ban legitimate players.

"

DragoonWraith wrote:

At this point, I would say anyone who trades for an obvious dupe in D2 — say, any rune over Gul — is not that innocent,
....
Because in D2, the dupes are well-known.

So um how is an old, more or less dying game where all the players know everything about rarity and drops and stuff in the same category as a new game attracting new and inexperienced players?

"

Cheating ruins the game. Cheaters should lose everything and have to start over.

Sure.

The problem is finding the cheaters and not hurting new or stupid players. (Also, buying items isn't the same as duping but whatever.)

Lol? I can't believe you people. Sites like d2JSP keep games running. And however much companies try to hide it, they love it. It keeps games (diablo 2) running much longer, fuller lives than they would have had without it.

And jsp isn't the birthplace of hacks so why is there so much of that in this thread?

The real world doesn't use a barter economy for a reason, to expect real world people to not want this in a virtual world as well is odd. Stability is key.

"

DragoonWraith wrote:

Dupes created, I'll remind you, by JSP members, to use JSP to make money off the game. They are damaging Blizzard's servers and ruining the game's economy, all thanks to JSP.

If you have a dupe, you should lose it, period. If you create a dupe, you should lose your entire account, period.

Cheating ruins the game. Cheaters should lose everything and have to start over.

Im a Citizen of The United States. Much like the founder of JSP and a vast majority of its memebers. Cant say I dupe, hack, cheat steal or kill though.


You a memeber of "Westboro Baptist Church" DragoonWraith?
generalizations are the devil's work!

"

Version wrote:

Lol? I can't believe you people. Sites like d2JSP keep games running. And however much companies try to hide it, they love it. It keeps games (diablo 2) running much longer, fuller lives than they would have had without it.

A. that doesn't actually really make them money most of the time.

B. when subscriptions are involved, they typically actively fight such scams because they actually take money away from the company. This will go doubly for Diablo III, where JSP would constitute a black market, avoiding Blizzard's "tax" on the system. While some of the examples I'll go into here will be less straight-forward, legally, if JSP ever allows the use of FG for D3, they will be committing a very obvious crime that no court would ever hesitate about.

C. the sale of another's property is illegal, and in-game items existing on the company's servers are their property. Selling it is theft.

D. using the obfuscation of "Forum Gold" would make little-to-no difference in a court of law, any more than stealing chips at a casino would.

E. even ignoring that, JSP incentivizes and encourages other illegal activity (attacks on the company's servers) in order to dupe and generate wealth.

"

Version wrote:

And jsp isn't the birthplace of hacks so why is there so much of that in this thread?

No, but it started a site devoted to a (stolen) bot program. Knowing its history tells a lot about the people running it.

"

Version wrote:

Im a Citizen of The United States. Much like the founder of JSP and a vast majority of its memebers.

Not sure of the relevance here; I never questioned anyone's citizenship in any country.

"

Version wrote:

Cant say I dupe, hack,

Not directly, but you fund those who do.

"

Version wrote:

cheat

You do, in fact, cheat. Using Forum Gold is not a supported method of gaining wealth in any game currently on the market; it is an illegitimate method of gaining an advantage over other players (for the slow, they have a word for that: "cheating").

"

Version wrote:

steal

As mentioned, yes, you do, actually. Selling property that is not yours to sell is theft.

"

Version wrote:

or kill though.

Never suggested you did. Your hyperbole weakens your argument.

"

Version wrote:

You a memeber of "Westboro Baptist Church" DragoonWraith?
generalizations are the devil's work!

Annnd now you've taken that to an extreme. Frankly, I'm offended, and will thus be dealing with that appropriately.

"

DragoonWraith wrote:

long ramble of nonsense

lol alright Dragoon we will blame JSP for the inlaid human desire that is greed. it will be the crux of our crusade!

Please let this thread die already. OP is rambling since the first page, stating his own opinion as facts and not discussing anything and it's not getting better. This isn't beta feedback anymore, it's a few people on a crusade against windmills.

"

DragoonWraith wrote:

C. the sale of another's property is illegal, and in-game items existing on the company's servers are their property. Selling it is theft.

UHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

i'm no doctor of lawology but i'm pretty sure it doesn't qualify as theft since the property never leaves the servers and it is exchanged through methods provided by the company by individuals who also happened to make an agreement about exchanging money or other commodities as well and the company is never deprived of it. (in fact, the property doesn't really exist; it's just the company keeping a list of who possesses what numbers)

it could easily be a violation of the eula.

i doubt you can get away with calling it theft, that's all.

unless you want to find a real lawyerologist to explain how it constitutes theft.

ps: circumventing in game real money trading might arguably deprive company of profits from the use of the service and stuff. that might be fraud though.

"

caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaps wrote:

UHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

i'm no doctor of lawology but i'm pretty sure it doesn't qualify as theft since the property never leaves the servers and it is exchanged through methods provided by the company by individuals who also happened to make an agreement about exchanging money or other commodities as well and the company is never deprived of it. (in fact, the property doesn't really exist; it's just the company keeping a list of who possesses what numbers)

it could easily be a violation of the eula.

i doubt you can get away with calling it theft, that's all.

unless you want to find a real lawyerologist to explain how it constitutes theft.

It's illegal to sell what you don't own. If you claim to own it, accept money, and then don't produce, that would be fraud. If you do produce the item, however, which you exchange for money despite not owning it, that is theft. The right of sale is a component of property ownership rights, and taking another's right to their property is a reasonable definition of theft.

I'm not a lawyer either, so I could not comment on exactly what the charge would be in court. It would certainly be illegal, however. The main problem is that virtual goods are a very new concept and laws have not been precisely tested with respect to them. I've researched the issue, though, and legal commentors have stated that a company like Blizzard would have a very strong case, were it worth it to them to pursue it.

EULAs, on the other hand, are legally meaningless, most likely. Again, it's an untested thing, but most commentary that I have read states that it's extremely unlikely that any court will accept as binding any agreement that is only presented after a sale, and the only signature on which is the pressing of an "I Agree" button.

"

caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaps wrote:

ps: circumventing in game real money trading might arguably deprive company of profits from the use of the service and stuff. that might be fraud though.

It would, I imagine, go under the same heading that other "black market" affairs would. It's... kind of like ticket scalping, maybe? Certainly illegal, though, and Blizzard will have absolutely no trouble demonstrating damages (which is most likely what has made it not worth their trouble in the past; to get any thing out of it, Blizzard would need to demonstrate some concrete damages, which is somewhat harder with D2 — in D3 it will be very, very easy to do).