[1.0] Queen_Frostburn | AoF Burning Dual Ice Spear Totems | No longer Updated

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Unislash wrote:

Hmm, yea, that looks viable as well. Thanks for the input :-)

In the end, you're trading 48% spell damage for Whispers of Doom, which does increase the damage from burn by 50% (via the added temporal chains). Unfortunately this extra damage is just a result of the burn lasting longer, meaning that the mobs are alive for actually longer than they would be should you have just taken the damage. Also, although we do a lot of damage from the burn, approx 1/3 of the damage is done by the original hit, which temporal chains doesn't benefit. With that said, although I haven't actually played a dual curse burning build before, I would lean towards the damage.

As for shock duration, I'm not sure how the math works out, but I'd guess temporal chains is probably more effective at it. However, it does require you to cast an extra curse for every pack, reducing your clear time :-).

It may very well be that whispers of doom is a very effective route to take (especially in maps due to the mob slowdown), but I would rather take out the stuff by the shadow before taking out the nodes in the middle of the witch tree.

Also, it's interesting that you would go for the dual hexes before the dual totems. Any reasoning behind that?

Does that all make sense? Let me know if I'm thinking about this the wrong way :-)


As for planning a build with 80 points... well, I prefer to do 110+. For me, it's generally an easy judgement call when it comes to where I should head as I'm leveling--it's easy for me to see what is simply hopeful thinking in the build vs what's absolutely essential. On the other hand, if your build is stretching to simply make essential keystones under 80, then you've got a problem.

Shock duration and freeze duration are based on what percentage of the mobs life the cold and lightning damage took away. all we are using is a lightning support gem so the damage even with a crit wont be huge. This means insanely short shock durations that you might not even be able to make use of. Temporal chains ensures that shese debuffs stay on long enough which means that you are gaining damage since shock will be on long enough to double or even triple stack. same goes for freeze duration since we are taking away around 70% of the cold damage.

As far as getting double curse first. Its just safer imo. And for this build to be HC viable you need a safe build.

In the end I believe that temporal chains not only increases the buff length but depending on how high the lightning damage goes it out does the 48% spell damage by allowing shock to stay on long enough for stacks.

(on a side note i didnt mention it but my build wont be using LMP or GMP. I am basing my build purely on burn damage and elemental proliferation.

I dont think we need lmp(although untested atm) because it lowers our initial hit. By lowering our initial hit by 30% our burn is weaker, our freeze lasts a shorter time, our shock lasts a shorter time.

The way I invision this build is the first crit puts shock on em and freezes em. the next crit puts a bigger burn on and shocks em again and so on.

If i had to pick my 6 slot it would be

spell totem, ice spear, added lightning dmg, cold to fire, elemental prolif, faster casting/fire penetration/increased burning damage

the last slot is debatable.

(edit)

level 20 lightning damage gem does
5-101 damage
in my build we get 92% damage (not counting fire damage bonus nodes obviously) we will also assume a perfect searing touch roll so +50% additional
for easier math we will assume the damage before crit is 100
100x2.42=242 before crit
242x2.5(base crit multiplier)=605 lightning crit damage

I honestly do not know how much hp mobs have so this part is based off assumptions.

I hear people saying merciless mobs have 30k+ hp

i cant find any sources that give a formula for shock if the damage is not higher then monster life /3

As of right now it looks like we wont get any shock duration out of that gem, however i could very well be wrong. I think we need more crit multiplyer

http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgABt9YIZ9tZLaixkIMJRnHhiB2qtAw0CjdmLKaQ1pMnHNx_xsHFLL-GrhXX14ZWY-wYw20RlnC72RMvb6brN4Pquij66-64k6cIj0bQ0Juh99esmBSwOjA5Urw3Tm1YB6eU0f2drhJpFxxxeRps5CIpT4KbZ704G7UEXcZG1-w4OthN2Ix2hX0WQGaeEdvAGlnzKhPDEyyno_Kiow_E3Mc7fFqmuMpbWZ-0WK6OZA==

reorganized the build.

now gives 24% less fire dmg and 20% less burn damage

however it now gives

110% more crit multiplier
70% more crit chance

havent tested the numbers but i can say for sure the initial burn damage will be slightly reduced due to losing fire damage however if this build makes shock stay long enough then it would be a dps increase

Also for 3 more points u can get spell power and gain 40% multiplier and some more int


After seeing the math i hope you can see how important temporal chains really is for this build tho.

Im done theory crafting till i see your thoughts on my posts tho.

Temporal chains will definitely work better for shock stacking. The 48% damage increase on top of some 75%+ damage we already has will only increase the overall shock duration by 48/175%=.27%--vs the 50% that temporal chains gives.

Now, the question is do we actually need it? Here is someone who has tried to do the math (not sure if it's right, but plenty of people looked over it and didn't say it was wrong):
http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/1c8hqz/roughly_how_much_health_to_map_monsters_have/

And yes don't go LMP unless you're one-shotting anyways :-)

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Unislash wrote:

Temporal chains will definitely work better for shock stacking. The 48% damage increase on top of some 75%+ damage we already has will only increase the overall shock duration by 48/175%=.27%--vs the 50% that temporal chains gives.

Now, the question is do we actually need it? Here is someone who has tried to do the math (not sure if it's right, but plenty of people looked over it and didn't say it was wrong):
http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/1c8hqz/roughly_how_much_health_to_map_monsters_have/

And yes don't go LMP unless you're one-shotting anyways :-)

based on that it seems my revised tree is the way to go.

my revised tree gives you a 375% crit damage

Another option is to get the nodes below the 2nd totem nde that all together give 45% increased debuff time

and several nodes below that is a cluster with 50% more multiplier

Ah, I must have missed your post with the revised tree. Hmm, ok. So the deal is that I'm just not sure what will be best for shock stacking--the +70% crit multiplier or the +44% spell damage. I'll search around for some super awesome mathy spreadsheets today (I had some from pre-release at one point) and hopefully report back some cold, hard numbers.

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Another option is to get the nodes below the 2nd totem nde that all together give 45% increased debuff time

Hmmmm, I'm not sure if debuff counts towards elemental statuses. Nope, it doesn't look like it :-( http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/560765

The extra crit multiplier nodes down from dual totems are an option. We'll see if 1) crit multiplier is useful at all to get for this build and 2) if it's worth going down there vs settling for Throatseeker.

Also, I think that the way burn damage is calculated will make the Immolation node cluster quite a bit stronger than it may appear (if it's applied after the spell damage/elemental damage rolls, it's far better than it would appear). Another thing to figure out.

Lastly, some alternatives to the the 6th Link:

Increased Burning Damage [+61%] +2 levels from searing touch
Fire Penetration [+37%] +2 levels from searing touch
Increased Critical Damage [+109%]
Remote Mine [+51% MORE damage] --and you can make use of the +29% mine damage nodes by shadow

(Spell Totem, Ice Spear, Added Lightning Dmg, Cold to Fire, Elemental prolif, Faster Casting)

i checked it out, and i think we should ditch added lightning damage.

and in its place use increased critical strike damage. it goes past 100% increased which far out does shock

Shock does 30% MORE elemental damage per stack. Keep in mind that it's multiplicative, not additive like critical multiplier.

im gonna make a remote mine version of this. seems alot more interesting

http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgAAt9bbWS2osZCDCUZx4YgdqrQMkycc3H_Ggh5MLaBDI18OjhdQAP0UsDowCGeTOr0nGDz56EGHtz7-CvJFOuGmV-djiPHbC6yY99ebodDQz2VVxo9GpwjYJDbFNtjvhYgb7FWdrhJpFxxxeRpsGYUkqjbp42onqVptJDynXOwYj_rb5zIYswNvvFMxoqPB8w_E3Mc7fFqmuMpJURGWDkiiLl3yFVATg-OE7hW3dQ==

If you are going mine, you should probably grab clever construction. Mines getting destroyed by aoe is quite a problem without it. Also be advised that even if you get Volatile Mines to trigger mines instantly, triggering the traps will stop you from moving momentarily.

Also, Path of the Warrior is a great node for health-based characters. I'd definitely grab it at one point considering you're right next to it.

Zakktb, sorry for stealing your thread :-p. I'm curious to hear your input :-)

Just another idea:
- no avatar node to keep the cold dmg with freeze
- tarin's shiver 6L staff to get more dmg on frozen targets
- new kaom's heart = +40% fire damage

You can have a good party buff on everything that's frozen as well as for yourself, have 500 life from kaom's adding to survivability and have +1 ice spear level (empower for +3?) to buff it's damage, with +600% crit chance in second form of ice spear you do not need to stack too much crit chance on nodes an gear to get to the crit cap, you want max multiplier as that would drastically buff the damage

I seriously might just reroll my weapon throwing scion to this, superb idea