Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.

So i read the new posts as good as could after logging in.

The "Leftclick to loot, right click (or whatever button one assign to it) to *unlock* loot is a great idea.
Add to that an infinity timer loot and we have a system we Non-FFAers can work with and play and have fun! :)
Im fine with Instanced loot too btw :)

Also i feel i must point out that as much as this thread has been posted in, it seems that argumenting is much like drawing argument cards.
One has an amount of cards and one plays them and to me it seems the last card that is played by "Forced Only FFA Loot" people is the "The devs wanted it that way, it must never change and its the best idea since toasted bread!".

I dont feel annoyed when i read "FFA Only people", in fact the very purpose of this thread is to fascilitate discussion and promote ideas to improve the game!
I just simply dont understand how some of arguments of the "Forced Only-FFA" people are even possible to use due to knowing how the game currently works.
Even the "Its the devs game, leave it alone" card doesnt work.
As my post stated awhile back in which Chris listens to feedback from players, and seems to even want no timer at all if its possible (im not a dev but many say chris meant the game to played the *Forced Full FFA* way already so i assume it has some grain of truth).
So even now the *vision of the devs* are being subject to change due to outside factors revealing flaws in *their vison*.
Does everything the devs want/envision means its great? No.
Does everything the fans/players wants means its great? No.

But this issue has been through a this blender of posts and we have gotten to the core of the isssue:

Forced FFA-Only loot has many issues and no benefits, which i will not reiterate in detail from all the previous posts of all the people here as that will lead to an even longer wall of text.

Most noteably though it will lead to a hostile community thats fractured into White listed/Non-Whitelisted/Blacklisted players.
And convey *nothing* positive to the game at all, while doing this hate+fracturing of the PoE community.
A choice of Loot style is neccesary for a healthy community that will appreciate this game and have *fun* with this game.
And as far as ive read, every argument that is "Forced FFA-Only is great!" is very easy to poke logical holes in and watch it deflate into a nothing.

Infinite timer is NOT instanced loot, and is a really really bad idea. Imagine seeing all the items a player misses or just doesn't pick, but you would like to pick them, but you can't. Psychological torture that would yield ever greater looting thread than this one.

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moikpei wrote:

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Jackel6672 wrote:

I feel it might not be enough for most of the people arguing for instanced though.

It's possible that most people arguing for instanced are simply using that as a placeholder stance. I've been arguing for instanced but a ten second timer would for sure cover me. I just need enough time to deal with the immediate crowd of monsters, then I'm good to go back and loot.

Most games are all about maximizing efficiency. Once Reds have to risk losing something good because they are waiting to pick up an item that they would vendor for some shards they will adjust their play style. I think a 10-15 second timer would be an excellent compromise.

With an extended timer if you see a ranger chilling next to the rare bow you have enough time chose to keep it for yourself; pick it up and give it them, let the timer give it to them, or alt click to clear the timer.

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Thalandor wrote:

Infinite timer is NOT instanced loot, and is a really really bad idea. Imagine seeing all the items a player misses or just doesn't pick, but you would like to pick them, but you can't. Psychological torture that would yield ever greater looting thread than this one.

Im fine with instanced loot too. :)
It would reduce the mess when doing maps in a party!

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iamstryker

1. That is where you and a lot of other players differ. As another poster said, its torture to the herd of 15 year olds that will flood this game come OB.

2. Depends on implementation.

3. The core of that paragraph was that us, the players, are responsible for maintaining lists if we so choose. Until they decide to implement there own system that basically segregates their own customers into a list of good and bad, its up to us. Since it has not already been done, chances are a lot of people feel a friends list works well enough.

A list in the game is also against the theme of the game itself. Exile's etc.

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wrathmar wrote:

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moikpei wrote:

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Jackel6672 wrote:

I feel it might not be enough for most of the people arguing for instanced though.

It's possible that most people arguing for instanced are simply using that as a placeholder stance. I've been arguing for instanced but a ten second timer would for sure cover me. I just need enough time to deal with the immediate crowd of monsters, then I'm good to go back and loot.

Most games are all about maximizing efficiency. Once Reds have to risk losing something good because they are waiting to pick up an item that they would vendor for some shards they will adjust their play style. I think a 10-15 second timer would be an excellent compromise.

With an extended timer if you see a ranger chilling next to the rare bow you have enough time chose to keep it for yourself; pick it up and give it them, let the timer give it to them, or alt click to clear the timer.

Pros/Cons of each loot type as far as i gathered:
Alt+Left Click or whatever would be used to Quick-Unlock loot.

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Jackel6672 wrote:

3. The core of that paragraph was that us, the players, are responsible for maintaining lists if we so choose. Until they decide to implement there own system that basically segregates their own customers into a list of good and bad, its up to us. Since it has not already been done, chances are a lot of people feel a friends list works well enough.

A list in the game is also against the theme of the game itself. Exile's etc.

Here is the thing, this game is going to be a FTP game, it is going to attract the worst kind of people imaginable. People that their only purpose is to ruin other peoples playing experience, even if they get banned.

As I posted before from games with community made whitelists



If someone comes up with a large and good community whitelist, I won't be giving my money to the devs, I would give it to the maker/maintainer of said whitelist for making public games playable for me.

For those who keep saying "loot tension" is the main reason why FFA has to stay. Everyone already gets around loot tension. Every single player that plays solo has no loot tensions. Every player that plays with friends has no loot tensions. Everyone that says "Just make friends and play with them, thats what I do" is avoiding the loot tension completely. The only people that loot tension is forced upon is new players that are not familiar with the game. The same people that the game wants to retain to actually succeed. The only real thing loot tension does is scare away new players, while older and experienced players just use ways to get around it.

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Cons:
Depending on timer and if loot is destroyed or unlocked and if the item dropped out of sight or was overlooked, players may choose not to *tell other players about certain loot* and to grab it oneself or let it be destroyed.

This con isn't really a con. Its the players fault for it being overlooked, and if its picked up and the guy is already on the next screen it was never his in the first place.

Whey they don't know wont hurt them.

All the other stuff seems right pro and con wise. Just seems really slow paced and hard to do while fighting monsters. Of course there is voice chat.

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Planetsurvival wrote:

Instanced Loot has issues to as it prevents a player with no intention to pick up loot to give it to someone else easily, it adds the step of stopping and chatting: "Hey this sword dropped? want it?" and unlock it with Alt+left Click or whatever.

For random public games, this one I don't see much as a con, since you rarely do this sort of thing with strangers. I pick up the yellows with my name on it, vendor the crap and repeat. I might show off the odd good piece I find, but my team mates don't expect me to give it to them. We're strangers.

For "regular" groups though, they might surely miss this feature. But then, they won't, because regular groups will show off and give any good loot they found to their friends so that the group gets stronger as a whole, whether that loot was instanced to them or not.

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Dinin wrote:

If someone comes up with a large and good community whitelist, I won't be giving my money to the devs, I would give it to the maker/maintainer of said whitelist for making public games playable for me.

For those who keep saying "loot tension" is the main reason why FFA has to stay. Everyone already gets around loot tension. Every single player that plays solo has no loot tensions. Every player that plays with friends has no loot tensions. Everyone that says "Just make friends and play with them, thats what I do" is avoiding the loot tension completely. The only people that loot tension is forced upon is new players that are not familiar with the game. The same people that the game wants to retain to actually succeed. The only real thing loot tension does is scare away new players, while older and experienced players just use ways to get around it.

This is how i feel too, if someone makes a decent Whitelist id gladly help to by paying them to keep it updated, rather then paying GGG for skins/stash slots/cosmetic items.
What matters to me is having *fun* in PoE and avoiding people i met in LoL and such.... so called communities.