Dear Chris, thanks for that almost killing joke! :)

It's a non issue on Reddit, so it essentially doesn't exist :)

"

Xavderion wrote:

It's a non issue on Reddit, so it essentially doesn't exist :)

This! ;-)

"

vio wrote:

as much as i hate it myself, the death penalty is a neccessary evil to make the game work.

There are alternatives, like the survival bonus in sacred 2, but I suppose this works too. I'm absolutely against making the game a zerg free for all so there has to be some kind of penalty for dying.

Of course in all this time here I still haven't been shown a build that absolutely needs those 6-7 final passive points and if it's bragging rights, well, just work for them like the gamers of old did. We're talking something in the vein of no-save-knife-only resident evil runs or hunting pigeons in gta, it's kinda pointless but it's something to do and it isn't really worth anything if anyone is skilled and/or persistent enough to pull it off.

"

Boem wrote:

Having a couple thousand of posts complaining about the death penalty is "no one is complaining about them".

It means getting a perspective and realizing that not even 1% of the population having an issue with something is in fact, irrelevant.

I'm reminded of the whole "look at the forums, clearly we have a scam epidemic and GGG should fix trade" stuff from some months ago.
People actually convinced themselves that 28 threads about scams in a period of 4 weeks was a relevant data point for assesment.
(just to give you a rough ball-park, we would have needed 280 threads in a month for it to be 1% of the total community and im not sure even that would warrant attention, other then PR attention)

That has got to be the silliest thing you've ever typed on this forum. It's like having 30 people in a group and then claiming that since only 5 people complained about something this something is not a problem in the general population because thousands of people would have had to complain for it to be significant.

"

raics wrote:

Spoiler

"

vio wrote:

as much as i hate it myself, the death penalty is a neccessary evil to make the game work.

There are alternatives, like the survival bonus in sacred 2, but I suppose this works too. I'm absolutely against making the game a zerg free for all so there has to be some kind of penalty for dying.

Of course in all this time here I still haven't been shown a build that absolutely needs those 6-7 final passive points and if it's bragging rights, well, just work for them like the gamers of old did. We're talking something in the vein of no-save-knife-only resident evil runs or hunting pigeons in gta, it's kinda pointless but it's something to do and it isn't really worth anything if anyone is skilled and/or persistent enough to pull it off.

Well, a survival bonus would be light years better than having the current 10% death EXP penalty slap on the wrist where it doesn't matter (aka the first 95 levels), and having it asininely exponential on the last 5...

PoE was always a "zerg free" experience due to TencentGGG having "the wisdom" to slap the dreaded level 100 status ON EVERY DAMN LEVEL UP, and relying on those few puny skill points to "make the difference" (which was the worst decision they could have made, next to their danger/reward ratios being skewed regarding loot AND EXP when talking about end game scenarios)...

If we're talking about "bragging rights", let's have some real challenge added to leveling those last 5 levels, by actually making content, and I mean END GAME content DIFFICULT - while also requiring an exponential increase in the number of required "runs" of lesser difficulty content.

Skill should be valued a "tad more" than persistence, and what better way to show your skill beside navigating the end game without resorting to all the asinine items/mechanics/skills and interactions, in the regular way which converted PoE into a "meta or bust" scenario???

#MAKE POE A REAL ARPG AGAIN! #REAL CHOICE MATTERS etc., etc.

"

Turtledove wrote:

"

Boem wrote:

Having a couple thousand of posts complaining about the death penalty is "no one is complaining about them".

It means getting a perspective and realizing that not even 1% of the population having an issue with something is in fact, irrelevant.

I'm reminded of the whole "look at the forums, clearly we have a scam epidemic and GGG should fix trade" stuff from some months ago.
People actually convinced themselves that 28 threads about scams in a period of 4 weeks was a relevant data point for assesment.
(just to give you a rough ball-park, we would have needed 280 threads in a month for it to be 1% of the total community and im not sure even that would warrant attention, other then PR attention)

That has got to be the silliest thing you've ever typed on this forum. It's like having 30 people in a group and then claiming that since only 5 people complained about something this something is not a problem in the general population because thousands of people would have had to complain for it to be significant.

Saying something is a problem and proving it needs to be acted upon are two different things.

If 5 out of 30 people experience a problem, the burden is on them to come up with a solution that wont trouble the other 25 while absolving themselves of the problem.

And im not even sure what your adressing, the whole "scams everywhere" fiasco or the death penalty argument.

Because a couple thousand of posts saying the death penalty "doesn't feel good" over a span of six years is indeed redundant.
Firstly the aim of the death penalty is to "not feel good", so we can give a /slow clap for the observation being made and the numbers are really low when compared to the traffic the game has had over that time period.

Peace,

-Boem-

"

Boem wrote:

"

Turtledove wrote:

"

Boem wrote:

Having a couple thousand of posts complaining about the death penalty is "no one is complaining about them".

It means getting a perspective and realizing that not even 1% of the population having an issue with something is in fact, irrelevant.

I'm reminded of the whole "look at the forums, clearly we have a scam epidemic and GGG should fix trade" stuff from some months ago.
People actually convinced themselves that 28 threads about scams in a period of 4 weeks was a relevant data point for assesment.
(just to give you a rough ball-park, we would have needed 280 threads in a month for it to be 1% of the total community and im not sure even that would warrant attention, other then PR attention)

That has got to be the silliest thing you've ever typed on this forum. It's like having 30 people in a group and then claiming that since only 5 people complained about something this something is not a problem in the general population because thousands of people would have had to complain for it to be significant.

<deleting your response since it had absolutely nothing to do with my post>

First off, I'm not going to get into a long discussion with you. My experience is that such a thing would be less than useless.

In your post I responded to, you imply that the population of the group of people that post on this forum are not a separate group from the total population of PoE players and that one must consider posts on this forum as random posts from the total population of PoE players as a whole. This a flat out false assertion/assumption. Which is easily proven false by looking at the percent of posts on this forum that are first posts on the forum by those authors. My experience is that less than 1% of the posts on this forum are first posts. If you don't believe this then you can easily check it out yourself.

snorkle is right about it being one of the most complained-about things

as audience of poe grew increasingly casual and instant gratification-oriented, obviously things like death penalty, map drops, general drops (this was 'rectified' a long time ago theres almost an opposite cry of 'everything is worthless', who would've thought ?), ie basically anything that make PoE a grinding and carrot-on-a-stick-but-not-quite-there game, are under attack.

it will be fun to watch people finally get automated AH in PoE2 and then realize
their stuff is completely worthless.

maybe PoE will finally turn into a game about how to dress up a barbie in 15 different ways. there wont be penalties, just extra rewards for not dying 23411240192 times. there wont be gated content, you could go just from story end into endgame bossing provided you got your gear (and you got it via automated AH). everyones happy. well, everyone but some original fans, but hey that will be such a tiny minority it wont matter.

Poe will be a true sandbox without wrong choices that 'waste' time. Without any penalty for doing shit you're not supposed to do. because, hey, its a sandbox, maybe I want to play cast on death build.

well, that Chris' claim is more of wishful thinking than reality

truth is - this game already turned Clicker, long time ago. all vestiges of 'hardcore' game are gone except for unhealthy time required to pay the time tax (built in as a feature!)

the game has been DELIBERATELY streamlined and casualised to the point of 'you new? pick the 'reworked' stuff, youll be fine no matter what'. DELIBERATELY.

having a hardcore and great game is fantastic. but it doesnt make money. 250 hardcore fans of great games dont pay for living. to earn money you slowly but surely do what POE did - casualise, streamline, make things easier and easier, apply LUDICROUS power creep and wherever possible replace skill with luck and time investment.

the hardest and most hardcore part of POE right now is not the gameplay but the UI/UX

keeping the death penalty is an act - POE pretends to still be the game of 2015. but thats just an act.

oh and just wait for the Casual Fiesta of bow league. cannot wait for buffs to tornado shot (that rain of tornado shots + GMB + FORK that 60% of playerbase is going to pick..)

"

sofocle10000 wrote:

Well, a survival bonus would be light years better than having the current 10% death EXP penalty slap on the wrist where it doesn't matter (aka the first 95 levels),

they already addressed this "survival bonus" for not dying. and decided against it cause it would demotivate players to continue playing after a death cause they would need to build something up again.

a single setback is likely easier to stomach, at least i feel this way.