[3.5] Say_Ten's Melee Shadow - Murder Everything Cheaply

"
wallesM wrote:
Would 'increased Double Strike Critical Strike Chance' enchant on the helmet be good to have on your bringer of rain?


No, because we use Dual Strike...not Double Strike. Double Strike hasn't gotten much love lately and it probably wouldn't even sell for much, but you could keep it around or try to sell it.

That being said, if you had DUAL STRIKE crit chance, that would be great.

You can get good enchants for all of the following skills:

-Dual Strike
-Lightning Strike (or Frost Blades)
-Herald of Ash
-Blood Rage

The most useful ones are Dual Strike damage (40% is max), Lightning Strike pierces additional targets (3 is max) and Frost Blades damage (40% is max). That doesn't mean that other enchants for the skill aren't good though.

If you get a good enchant for one of those, you might want to pick up another BoR for future enchants to try to get something different better so you can use the one you just buffed.
Optimized my gear a bit more with 30 chaos on rings/amulet etc. Shaper's touch and Cyclopean Coil is such an amazing combination! So much bang for the buck and takes care of all of your DPS problems. You just need to cheap life/resistance ring/amulets with a sprinkle of flat physical attack damage if needed. If anyone is struggling with survival take a look at my set up! Budget friendly!

Now sitting at level 85, 5600 health WITHOUT belly of the beast, 30% block, 38% evade, 75% resistance to all and doing red maps with ease with bloodseeker/offhand axe(mace) cheese. I can say without any question this is stronger than dual strike at least until you get two 350-400 DPS weapons, and it is much easier to play. And even then, a 350-400 DPS claw with a gigantic +80% extra elemental damage offhand will most likely outperform dual strike. Nothing against the skill, it is just blade flurry and reave are too cheese with this kind of set up.

Reave kills everything near you much faster than dual strike so your "+100% damage when no other enemy is nearby" kicks in a lot faster, and with the offhand cheese it matches dual strike in single target damage as well at least according to POB simulation. Until they nerf it, using other melee skills = nerfing yourself.

I can only die to extremely bad map mods (or being new to the game and not recognizing one shot conditions). I am going to swap out maim for fortify so I can pretend I am a champion. Yes it reduces the damage by quite a bit but I think as assassin I should still do more damage than champion? Yes I am supposed to whirlwind every 5 seconds but in the heat of battle it is very easy to miss hitting any enemy, not noticing and take 20% more damage which is one of the biggest causes of random deaths when you are not paying attention.

Just curious, did you ever experiment with acrobatic skills? It is like a permanent vaal grace and combined with vaal grace, more or less makes you invulnerable. On POE ninja it seems to be super popular across most assassin builds. I wonder what should I drop to pick it up.

Maybe something like this? I am going to report back.

https://www.pathofexile.com/fullscreen-passive-skill-tree/3.2.1/AAAABAYBAQAGAQkB3AOHBS0FtQX5DHMNjQ5IEJIRlhHVFCAV8BX2Ff0WvxewG60jNiP2JpUoKioLMHEyMjWSNj06QkMxRfRHfkp9SotLeEz_TZJOKlBHUdlTEFVLV5dbr13yXz9gQWHiYetieWKsY3Bkr2VNbIxtbG87b1dwUnTtdf1343gNeBl5aHpTexR9dYRvhNmHdonTijiLT4w2jX2NgY2_koCTkJS4lWaVzJd5mhebJp2qotmjiqZ_qW6wkrDYsbO0xbVItfK42bxvvTa-p8AawQTBoM96037UI9RC1gfYvdmG2sHdSN2o5FHndOjW7T_tQe4O7w75Y_zF_rr_kw==?accountName=hitmantb&characterName=Hitmantb
Last edited by hitmantb on Mar 30, 2018, 1:09:55 PM
"
Say_Ten wrote:

You can get good enchants for all of the following skills:
-Dual Strike
-Lightning Strike (or Frost Blades)
-Herald of Ash
-Blood Rage

But best enchants on bosses: Ancestral Protector bonus attack speed > Dual Strike Attack speed > Dual strike damage > Blood Rage attack speed = Punishment Buff (if use) = Ice golem buff
For maps: LS Pierce / FB Damage = Blood rage = Ice golem buff
Last edited by SmokerHell on Mar 30, 2018, 12:11:15 PM
"
hitmantb wrote:
Optimized my gear a bit more with 30 chaos on rings/amulet etc. Shaper's touch and Cyclopean Coil is such an amazing combination! So much bang for the buck and takes care of all of your DPS problems. You just need to cheap life/resistance ring/amulets with a sprinkle of flat physical attack damage if needed. If anyone is struggling with survival take a look at my set up! Budget friendly!

Now sitting at level 85, 5600 health WITHOUT belly of the beast, 30% block, 38% evade, 75% resistance to all and doing red maps with ease with bloodseeker/offhand axe(mace) cheese. I can say without any question this is stronger than dual strike at least until you get two 350-400 DPS weapons, and it is much easier to play. And even then, a 350-400 DPS claw with a gigantic +80% extra elemental damage offhand will most likely outperform dual strike. Nothing against the skill, it is just blade flurry and reave are too cheese with this kind of set up.

Reave kills everything near you much faster than dual strike so your "+100% damage when no other enemy is nearby" kicks in a lot faster, and with the offhand cheese it is really not far behind on single target damage. Until they nerf it, using other melee skills = nerfing yourself.

I can only die to extremely bad map mods (or being new to the game and not recognizing one shot conditions). I am going to swap out maim for fortify so I can pretend I am a champion. Yes it reduces the damage by quite a bit but I think as assassin I should still do more damage than champion? Yes I am supposed to whirlwind every 5 seconds but in the heat of battle it is very easy to miss hitting any enemy, not noticing and take 20% more damage which is one of the biggest causes of random deaths when you are not paying attention.

Just curious, did you ever experiment with acrobatic skills? It is like a permanent vaal grace and combined with vaal grace, more or less makes you invulnerable. On POE ninja it seems to be super popular across most assassin builds. I wonder what should I drop to pick it up.

Maybe something like this? I am going to report back.

https://www.pathofexile.com/fullscreen-passive-skill-tree/3.2.1/AAAABAYBAQAGAQkB3AOHBS0FtQX5DHMNjQ5IEJIRlhHVFCAV8BX2Ff0WvxewG60jNiP2JpUoKioLMHEyMjWSNj06QkMxRfRHfkp9SotLeEz_TZJOKlBHUdlTEFVLV5dbr13yXz9gQWHiYetieWKsY3Bkr2VNbIxtbG87b1dwUnTtdf1343gNeBl5aHpTexR9dYRvhNmHdonTijiLT4w2jX2NgY2_koCTkJS4lWaVzJd5mhebJp2qotmjiqZ_qW6wkrDYsbO0xbVItfK42bxvvTa-p8AawQTBoM96037UI9RC1gfYvdmG2sHdSN2o5FHndOjW7T_tQe4O7w75Y_zF_rr_kw==?accountName=hitmantb&characterName=Hitmantb


if you swap your offhand to another claw, even another bloodseeker, what are your tooltip dps numbers? current and then by using two of them...

assuming you mean overall efficiency by "kills everything near you much faster". dual strike hits with both weapons at over 100% of base damage (over 200% total if you consider a single weapon skill like reave) whereas reave caps out at something like 140%. reave just lets you not have to walk up to stuff to kill it...but same goes for lightning strike with pierce, which caps out at 175% or so.

i used to take acrobatics when the tree was slightly different. it's definitely a good investment still and absolutely provides more defense to an offense-heavy build.

wonder if you'd get about the same damage and life from using a meginord's girdle.

you should ditch that hybrid flask for a rumi's and ideally ditch one of the life flasks for a basalt.
"
SmokerHell wrote:
"
Say_Ten wrote:

You can get good enchants for all of the following skills:
-Dual Strike
-Lightning Strike (or Frost Blades)
-Herald of Ash
-Blood Rage

But best enchants on bosses: Ancestral Protector bonus attack speed > Dual Strike Attack speed > Dual strike damage > Blood Rage attack speed = Punishment Buff (if use) = Ice golem buff
For maps: LS Pierce / FB Damage = Blood rage = Ice golem buff


forgot about ice golem, good point. having different helms with those enchants would surely be useful, albeit annoying to swap on the fly since you have to stop doing things. same principle as bringing different gems with you except that's a lot easier to deal with.
"
Say_Ten wrote:
"
hitmantb wrote:
Optimized my gear a bit more with 30 chaos on rings/amulet etc. Shaper's touch and Cyclopean Coil is such an amazing combination! So much bang for the buck and takes care of all of your DPS problems. You just need to cheap life/resistance ring/amulets with a sprinkle of flat physical attack damage if needed. If anyone is struggling with survival take a look at my set up! Budget friendly!

Now sitting at level 85, 5600 health WITHOUT belly of the beast, 30% block, 38% evade, 75% resistance to all and doing red maps with ease with bloodseeker/offhand axe(mace) cheese. I can say without any question this is stronger than dual strike at least until you get two 350-400 DPS weapons, and it is much easier to play. And even then, a 350-400 DPS claw with a gigantic +80% extra elemental damage offhand will most likely outperform dual strike. Nothing against the skill, it is just blade flurry and reave are too cheese with this kind of set up.

Reave kills everything near you much faster than dual strike so your "+100% damage when no other enemy is nearby" kicks in a lot faster, and with the offhand cheese it is really not far behind on single target damage. Until they nerf it, using other melee skills = nerfing yourself.

I can only die to extremely bad map mods (or being new to the game and not recognizing one shot conditions). I am going to swap out maim for fortify so I can pretend I am a champion. Yes it reduces the damage by quite a bit but I think as assassin I should still do more damage than champion? Yes I am supposed to whirlwind every 5 seconds but in the heat of battle it is very easy to miss hitting any enemy, not noticing and take 20% more damage which is one of the biggest causes of random deaths when you are not paying attention.

Just curious, did you ever experiment with acrobatic skills? It is like a permanent vaal grace and combined with vaal grace, more or less makes you invulnerable. On POE ninja it seems to be super popular across most assassin builds. I wonder what should I drop to pick it up.

Maybe something like this? I am going to report back.

https://www.pathofexile.com/fullscreen-passive-skill-tree/3.2.1/AAAABAYBAQAGAQkB3AOHBS0FtQX5DHMNjQ5IEJIRlhHVFCAV8BX2Ff0WvxewG60jNiP2JpUoKioLMHEyMjWSNj06QkMxRfRHfkp9SotLeEz_TZJOKlBHUdlTEFVLV5dbr13yXz9gQWHiYetieWKsY3Bkr2VNbIxtbG87b1dwUnTtdf1343gNeBl5aHpTexR9dYRvhNmHdonTijiLT4w2jX2NgY2_koCTkJS4lWaVzJd5mhebJp2qotmjiqZ_qW6wkrDYsbO0xbVItfK42bxvvTa-p8AawQTBoM96037UI9RC1gfYvdmG2sHdSN2o5FHndOjW7T_tQe4O7w75Y_zF_rr_kw==?accountName=hitmantb&characterName=Hitmantb


if you swap your offhand to another claw, even another bloodseeker, what are your tooltip dps numbers? current and then by using two of them...

assuming you mean overall efficiency by "kills everything near you much faster". dual strike hits with both weapons at over 100% of base damage (over 200% total if you consider a single weapon skill like reave) whereas reave caps out at something like 140%. reave just lets you not have to walk up to stuff to kill it...but same goes for lightning strike with pierce, which caps out at 175% or so.

i used to take acrobatics when the tree was slightly different. it's definitely a good investment still and absolutely provides more defense to an offense-heavy build.

wonder if you'd get about the same damage and life from using a meginord's girdle.

you should ditch that hybrid flask for a rumi's and ideally ditch one of the life flasks for a basalt.


If you use two blood seekers, double strike and dual strike are balanced the way it should be, one is great single target damage with weaker AOE damage, one is great AOE damage with more range.

It is completely stupid once you use something that adds 38% extra fire damage from physical / 30% AOE damage in offhand for 1 chaos. Until they nerf this, there is no way for other melee skills to compete.

Using POB and my gear which is far more accurate than in-game tooltip (why can't they fix the in-game tool tip?). Ruthless/Maim/Multistrike/Melee for both skills. Critical damage for dual strike, concentrated effect for reave.

Double Blood Seeker is perfectly balanced

Dual strike: 95001
Reave: 78586

Blood Seeker + Stat Stick Offhand is not, AOE damage now does better single target damage as well
Reave: 102674 (WTF?)

Just for kicks, I tried the stat stick offhand cheese Blade Flurry with fire damage and chance to bleed:

Blade Flurry (hold at 6 stage): 135276
Blade Flurry (hold to 6 stage and release): 184634

I don't really like the way blade flurry works as you have to channel it and maintain the cycles. Sometimes I miss the target and die. Reave just seems easier to use with its huge range at 4 stacks, even with concentrated effect.
Last edited by hitmantb on Mar 30, 2018, 1:28:18 PM
"
hitmantb wrote:
"
Say_Ten wrote:
"
hitmantb wrote:
Optimized my gear a bit more with 30 chaos on rings/amulet etc. Shaper's touch and Cyclopean Coil is such an amazing combination! So much bang for the buck and takes care of all of your DPS problems. You just need to cheap life/resistance ring/amulets with a sprinkle of flat physical attack damage if needed. If anyone is struggling with survival take a look at my set up! Budget friendly!

Now sitting at level 85, 5600 health WITHOUT belly of the beast, 30% block, 38% evade, 75% resistance to all and doing red maps with ease with bloodseeker/offhand axe(mace) cheese. I can say without any question this is stronger than dual strike at least until you get two 350-400 DPS weapons, and it is much easier to play. And even then, a 350-400 DPS claw with a gigantic +80% extra elemental damage offhand will most likely outperform dual strike. Nothing against the skill, it is just blade flurry and reave are too cheese with this kind of set up.

Reave kills everything near you much faster than dual strike so your "+100% damage when no other enemy is nearby" kicks in a lot faster, and with the offhand cheese it is really not far behind on single target damage. Until they nerf it, using other melee skills = nerfing yourself.

I can only die to extremely bad map mods (or being new to the game and not recognizing one shot conditions). I am going to swap out maim for fortify so I can pretend I am a champion. Yes it reduces the damage by quite a bit but I think as assassin I should still do more damage than champion? Yes I am supposed to whirlwind every 5 seconds but in the heat of battle it is very easy to miss hitting any enemy, not noticing and take 20% more damage which is one of the biggest causes of random deaths when you are not paying attention.

Just curious, did you ever experiment with acrobatic skills? It is like a permanent vaal grace and combined with vaal grace, more or less makes you invulnerable. On POE ninja it seems to be super popular across most assassin builds. I wonder what should I drop to pick it up.

Maybe something like this? I am going to report back.

https://www.pathofexile.com/fullscreen-passive-skill-tree/3.2.1/AAAABAYBAQAGAQkB3AOHBS0FtQX5DHMNjQ5IEJIRlhHVFCAV8BX2Ff0WvxewG60jNiP2JpUoKioLMHEyMjWSNj06QkMxRfRHfkp9SotLeEz_TZJOKlBHUdlTEFVLV5dbr13yXz9gQWHiYetieWKsY3Bkr2VNbIxtbG87b1dwUnTtdf1343gNeBl5aHpTexR9dYRvhNmHdonTijiLT4w2jX2NgY2_koCTkJS4lWaVzJd5mhebJp2qotmjiqZ_qW6wkrDYsbO0xbVItfK42bxvvTa-p8AawQTBoM96037UI9RC1gfYvdmG2sHdSN2o5FHndOjW7T_tQe4O7w75Y_zF_rr_kw==?accountName=hitmantb&characterName=Hitmantb


if you swap your offhand to another claw, even another bloodseeker, what are your tooltip dps numbers? current and then by using two of them...

assuming you mean overall efficiency by "kills everything near you much faster". dual strike hits with both weapons at over 100% of base damage (over 200% total if you consider a single weapon skill like reave) whereas reave caps out at something like 140%. reave just lets you not have to walk up to stuff to kill it...but same goes for lightning strike with pierce, which caps out at 175% or so.

i used to take acrobatics when the tree was slightly different. it's definitely a good investment still and absolutely provides more defense to an offense-heavy build.

wonder if you'd get about the same damage and life from using a meginord's girdle.

you should ditch that hybrid flask for a rumi's and ideally ditch one of the life flasks for a basalt.


If you use two blood seekers, double strike and dual strike are balanced the way it should be, one is great single target damage with weaker AOE damage, one is great AOE damage with more range.

It is completely stupid once you use something that adds 38% extra fire damage from physical / 30% AOE damage in offhand for 1 chaos. Until they nerf this, there is no way for other melee skills to compete.

Using POB and my gear which is far more accurate than in-game tooltip (why can't they fix the in-game tool tip?). Ruthless/Maim/Multistrike/Melee for both skills. Critical damage for dual strike, concentrated effect for reave.

Double Blood Seeker is perfectly balanced

Dual strike: 95001
Reave: 78586

Blood Seeker + Stat Stick Offhand is not, AOE damage now does better single target damage as well
Reave: 102674 (WTF?)

Just for kicks, I tried the stat stick offhand cheese Blade Flurry with fire damage and chance to bleed:

Blade Flurry (hold at 6 stage): 135276
Blade Flurry (hold to 6 stage and release): 184634

I don't really like the way blade flurry works as you have to channel it and maintain the cycles. Sometimes I miss the target and die. Reave just seems easier to use with its huge range at 4 stacks, even with concentrated effect.


http://poe.trade/search/uyenimimosirik

could also buy a claw for 1-5c that has %phys added as whatever and has multi on it

did not check for area damage yet

plus im at work and cant do anything anyway and poe.trade has been aids with ads
A second claw does not work.

The cheese for reave/blade flurry is you disable the offhand and only use main hand.

This way you don't care about physical damage, only the huge extra damage buffs. Your main hand hits 100% of the times.

If you use stat stick for dual strike or lightning strike or any skill without restriction, you will lose a lot of offhand damage due to low physical damage.

Frankly it feels like a bug to me. There should be attack speed penalty if you dual wield and offhand does not support your skill.
Last edited by hitmantb on Mar 30, 2018, 2:17:12 PM
"
hitmantb wrote:
A second claw does not work.

The cheese for reave/blade flurry is you disable the offhand and only use main hand.

This way you don't care about physical damage, only the huge extra damage buffs. Your main hand hits 100% of the times.

If you use stat stick for dual strike or lightning strike or any skill without restriction, you will lose a lot of offhand damage due to low physical damage.

Frankly it feels like a bug to me. There should be attack speed penalty if you dual wield and offhand does not support your skill.


i meant for dual strike. the reave cheese has always been around and probably why they nerfed reave both in AOE and damage awhile ago.
so i bought a "stat stick" just to see how powerful the shaped mods were and they are, indeed, powerful.

bought this claw for 4c, crafted added phys % for 2c and q20'd it and it out DPS's a double wasp nest setup.



Last edited by Say_Ten on Mar 30, 2018, 5:24:54 PM

Report Forum Post

Report Account:

Report Type

Additional Info