Why do people complain about RNG when you're playing an ARPG?

Sure the currency has no equal distribution, you just get a couple more currency drops from these boxes, but their distribution stays the same as with normal loot from monsters.

This would be broken as hell if it had equal drop rates for every currency.[/quote]



Thus proving my point its not rng its not about being broken or not thats not the point its about the claim everything is rng when clearly its not.

RNG also works with differently weighted elements, these elements don't make it any less random. This fallacy made johnKeys call RNG "PRNG" for a while but gladly he stopped :P[/quote]

That greatly depends on how stacked the numbers r

For example if you put 1000000 yellow marbles in a bag and 1 blue one and you grab one sure each individual marble has the same change of dropping but you r gonna get a yellow one most likely.
Think of it this way you could say if you buy a lotto ticket its rng that you wont win the first price and sure in theorie that works.
But what ppl seem to forget in these discusions is that theorie and reality r 2 different things so in theorie its rng but in the real world it most certainly is not.

I still think there is some room for MORE RNG in our game.

For example, when you are creating character, it always "drops" the one you selected. Revolting! I am amazed this concept even made it past developers.
The same goes with names. Randomly generated names would also solve many "My name is taken" QQ threads with one blow.

Even story zoning has room for more RNG. Might be that there is 25% chance that instead of going forward (~from Ledge to Climb) you instead get lost and appear on the beginning of Ledge again.

Wraeclast has no place for predictability and informed risk taking!

8/10

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Xavderion wrote:

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jackof8lades wrote:

My problem whit the rng in this game that in a lot of instances its not rng.
Look at arcanist boxes if it was truly rng it should drop mirrors(cause the r currency right?)or at least exalted as much as transmutes.
This ofc doesnt happen cause ggg "rigges" the rng and while i can understand there would be balance issues if everyting was true rng i still think its bs to say everyting is rng cause its not.
My point is if you think everyting in this game should be rng then fine let it all be rng.

RNG also works with differently weighted elements, these elements don't make it any less random. This fallacy made johnKeys call RNG "PRNG" for a while but gladly he stopped :P

I only stopped because the term is confusing.
everyone understands what "RNG" is. not everyone has time or is willing to go to Google or Wikipedia, for "Pseudo-Random Numbers Generator".

so yeah it is a software-based, weighted PRNG.
but you can call it "our savior, the one true god Kuduku", if you want.

and P.. ahem "Kuduku", is indeed less random than a TRNG by definition.
which is good actually, because that means GGG can change some of it to stop screwing with a non-trader's sanity, as easily as the flick of a developer's wrist.

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johnKeys wrote:

and P.. ahem "Kuduku", is indeed less random than a TRNG by definition.
which is good actually, because that means GGG can change some of it to stop screwing with a non-trader's sanity, as easily as the flick of a developer's wrist.

No it's not, stop falling back into the fallacy :P The P in PRNG has nothing to do with how elements are weighted within the system. Good PRNGs are also indistinguishable from TRNGs, and most PRNGs are hybrids anyway.

we've been over this a hundred times, Xav.
GGG aren't using a TRNG because it doesn't fit their use-case.
they want the odds to not be equal, and the RNG to not be "indistinguishable from TRNG". because that's how loot rarity tiers and modifier rolls work, for example.
so even if they had the extra cash to spend on a hardware RNG, it just wouldn't fit.
same goes for a hybrid.
so it is likely 100% software and 100% TRNG. for a reason.
no fallacy here.

and my complaint was never about TRNG or PRNG.
it was where that "Kuduku" gets shoved into, and which amount of control it gets.
the answer, is "everywhere" and "too much", respectively.

Just because a number is randomly generated it does not mean that all numbers have an equal chance to be generated. "Random" does not mean what "common sense" dictates. It only means that the outcome cannot be predicted*. It has NOTHING to do with the probability, equal or otherwise weighted, for specific numbers to be chosen.

*or at least in a computer context, close enough to cannot be predicted as to not be relevant

My problem with the RNG in this game is that everything is gated behind it. Everything!

I don't mind that finding good gear is RNG. That's a big part of an aRPG,
but take (uber) Atziri for example:
- first you need good RNG to find currupted areas.
- RNG needed to get sac pieces and not vaal gems.
- RNG needed to get the right sac pieces by rerunning corrupted areas via the mapdevice.
- RNG needed to get mortal pieces.
- RNG needed to get the right mortal pieces.

You want to do maps/endgame?
- RNG to find your first maps. Not that hard honestly:)
- RNG needed to find any maps while in maps (can be partially fixed by spending currency)
- Super good RNG needed to find endgame maps (i'm still stuck at level 78/79, and I map a lot!)

(The massive currency sink for maps is also a thing i really hate, but that is another topic)

Currency?
- You need seriously good RNG to find the good orbs (ex/div) and there is nothing you can do to increase your RNG in that. Everyone finds a chaos orb now and then, or other stuff. But some people find 5 ex in the first week of a new league and some find none for weeks/months. I'd rather pay 50 ex for a crappy unique just as long as exalted orb drop reasonably, then paying 2 ex for a good unique when no exalted orbs drop.
(I had my first ex drop after 4 weeks in the current league and with the WB prices as they are i'm so glad i have a IIR/IIQ flame totem build, with no gear requirment. No need to spend that little currency i have on gear)

For me, when i think of RNG and POE is see too much RNG:
- gear
- maps
- atziri
- currency
- finding masters / not getting the OMGWTF missions that are impossible to do

The succes of your POE experience is entirely gated behind RNG. I have seen people quit POE just because they never had any good RNG whatsoever.
Just a week ago i mapped with a guy that YOLO-alched maps, with no chisels, no rerolling with chaos. just alc and go. Although it were level 75-77 maps, he found upgrade maps in every run were i was stuck at 75 maps for 2 weeks by that time with spending way too much currency with no results. This pissed me off so much i quit playing with him. Mind you, this was before the mapdrop buff of end last week.
There were too many times i get a 68 map drop in my high level map and just think "slap in da face by GGG, again. This should be made illegal". No joke, i think this a lot.

TLDR: RNG is part of an aRPG, but POE has too much imo. finding-gear-RNG okay, rest should be toned down (toned down, not completely gone).

This league I have three at 75-76 and one at 44. Haven't seen a single exalt. All solo play.

But I have found 2 tabulas, 6-8 5 links, and a midnight.

Last league, found none of the above, but finished the league finding a couple of exalts.

RNG is like a ex that comes by between boyfriends unannounced.