(3.2) [Lighty] 2H RT Cyclone: Dope for Beast League & Lab™

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Archimtiros wrote:

Seems all the sources of increased damage with ailments from attack skills has really supercharged bleed damage with the Brutality build - from avg 1.5k -> ~4k. That doesn't sound like much, but combined with the new notable Crimson Dance can stack up to a non-trivial amount of extra damage, gained with practically no investment.

I've been messing around in the newly updated builder, and despite my previous post, I think I can safely say that the Brutality build can be slightly ahead of the standard Elemental build in terms of raw damage (although Elemental still has an advantage in unique flasks) when using Starforge, with a potential additional bonus from Shock.

The real issue however continues to be generating Endurance Charges without CWDT-Warlords Mark (in favor of Blasphemy-Vulnerability). Outside of the Juggernaut ascendancy, which suffers a huge loss of damage, there really aren't a lot of reliable ways to generate charges other than Enduring Cry, which I personally find very clunky to use alongside Cyclone. I'd be interested in hearing any suggestions to address this weakness.

Really hoping some of the new uniques coming in 3.0 do something to shake up everyone's favorite Spin-to-Win build though, fingers crossed!

Haste imho isnt a great use of 50% of one's mana. I'd rather use Grace or Determination there. Another option for the "full phys" variant is just using Vuln on Hit gloves and Gruthkul's pelt (or Stibnite). this lets you go blood magic and also have a 6 link warchief that maims bosses for even more physical damage. Throw in starforge and its a pretty tanky build, should be able to hit 7.5k life easily enough.

For endurance charges, there's really only The Red Dream or The Red nightmare if you don't want to use enduring cry. If you want to be ghetto about it, you can use Lochtonial Caress, and those are so cheap you can probably hit vuln on hit as a corruption easily enough. I wish there were an endurance charge on hit mechanic, the only one right now is with Staves on crit, or the Daresso chest which is fun but unreliable.

Hey lighty, what build do u will start in 3,0 tomorrow? I think I ll go for your cyclone build, what do you think, is that a good stater build?

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Samir316 wrote:

Haste imho isnt a great use of 50% of one's mana. I'd rather use Grace or Determination there. Another option for the "full phys" variant is just using Vuln on Hit gloves and Gruthkul's pelt (or Stibnite). this lets you go blood magic and also have a 6 link warchief that maims bosses for even more physical damage. Throw in starforge and its a pretty tanky build, should be able to hit 7.5k life easily enough.

For endurance charges, there's really only The Red Dream or The Red nightmare if you don't want to use enduring cry. If you want to be ghetto about it, you can use Lochtonial Caress, and those are so cheap you can probably hit vuln on hit as a corruption easily enough. I wish there were an endurance charge on hit mechanic, the only one right now is with Staves on crit, or the Daresso chest which is fun but unreliable.

You're right in that Haste isn't very impactful, though since there really aren't any other good offensive options, I consider it an interchangeable slot to swap depending on what content you're facing and which ascendancy you take (Grace for a Berserker/Haste for a Juggernaut, defensive for more dangerous maps/offensive for farm ones).

I really don't like running Blood Magic unless I'm using Hezmana; having to put a BM support in Cyclone and Warchief is such a huge opportunity cost in damage, while 15% mana left over from Blasphemy should be enough alongside a backup mana/hybrid flask.

I don't think Gruthkul's Pelt is worth under any circumstance - no auras, no CWDT, no Golems, no Totems pretty much cripples the build in every way. Vuln on hit gloves are a possibility, but I think the mana cost for Blasphemy is worth it, especially since the corruption is limited to level 12.

I thought about Red Nightmare/Dream for Endurance Charges; it's a bit wasteful in terms of skill point investment, but there is a very nice node for it in the Marauder section just below Barbarism. It's certainly a viable option, as is simply playing Juggernaut. While it suffers in damage, I'm starting to lean that way simply for the utility, given that one of Slayer's main advantages was better leech enabling Melee Phys on Full Life, and there are now so many more competitive damage links in Brutality, Maim, and Ruthlessness.

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Quizzlemanizzle wrote:

Did you have a look at my PoB String? What do you think?

If you want to play a Scion, it's fine, though most of the builds effectiveness is coming from your gear, rather than the choice of Ascendancy. That said, you are missing out on a lot of single target damage by not having a Totem, as well as the ability to shift Maim onto it (though it is still better in the main weapon setup, it would free you up to use Fortify or IncAoE/Conc Effect), not that the build necessarily needs damage with the gear setup you have, but if you're planning to use this in a new league, I wouldn't expect to have 20/20 gems and a hundred exalts worth of gear from the get go either.

There's really no answer except for what I already gave you - if you want to run Fortify, you have to give up something, or be ready to Leap Slam your way around. Personally, I'd just drop Artic Armor to free up mana, drop Blood Magic to free up a link, and not be dependent on L4 Enlighten.

Definitely starting this league off with a good ol' fashion cycloner considering the AoE buffs and QoL changes, but I can never decide between slayer and zerker for cyclone.

Zerker is always amaze-balls because vaal pact is just straight up OP, but with the massive buffs to boss life slayer 20% cull will be pretty damn good as will the extra AoE for clear speed. Leaning towards Slayer simply because going full phys with brutality, won't really have to care about reflect which is usually my primary reason for going zerker/vaal-pact.

Would love to hear some thoughts; I know I've been reading a few people above debate between zerker/slayer, and also Juggernaut. Tough choice.

Why no Vaal-Pact on Berserker tree?

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moooff wrote:

Why no Vaal-Pact on Berserker tree?

feels shit as rt, blood rage feels better, pretty far away, not needed in t16+ due to leech rate.

Also can't decide between slayer and zerker :( RIP me

Appreciate the build update Lighty. Loving the title by the way lol.

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Archimtiros wrote:

I don't think Gruthkul's Pelt is worth under any circumstance - no auras, no CWDT, no Golems, no Totems pretty much cripples the build in every way. Vuln on hit gloves are a possibility, but I think the mana cost for Blasphemy is worth it, especially since the corruption is limited to level 12.

You can use warchief with gruthkul. It's not as bad as you thought. http://i.imgur.com/tE2utrE.png With vuln on hit gloves, and gruthkul, you get more damage than haste. And with all these gems that dont need ele to work... well, its probably easily something you can take into red maps especially with a starforge that makes use of shock. And as I said, the main advantage isnt offense, it's defense because this setup naturally specs into blood magic which is an e-z 40% life for 4 points that classic Lighty cyclone doesnt get. That's the gain you get for giving up auras (which are weak with starforge anyway), CWDT (which I don't even use so I stay at max endurance charges), and Golems which are a pain in the ass to keep up.

Im not saying Im gonna use it - I prefer kaoms heart. But its not a totally terrible chest. Also, 15% character size can't be under-estimate, very valuable for AFK in Sarn meta.