Summoners in the CB:

"

Summoner is a mess. How can you argue with that when summoners wont even be using golems? Melee Splash is nerfed, god knows what else summoners rely on.
Quoting me like I don't know what I'm talking about, or maybe I'm just making things up for the hell of it?

"

Where's your summoner? I cant find it...

"

AusterlitZ wrote:

blablabla

"

AusterlitZ wrote:

"

Summoner is a mess. How can you argue with that when summoners wont even be using golems? Melee Splash is nerfed, god knows what else summoners rely on.
Quoting me like I don't know what I'm talking about, or maybe I'm just making things up for the hell of it?

So because summoners don't get much out of golems (which i disagree with,the Chaos golem is good just for the mitigation it offers,even unlinked),they are suddenly a "mess" ?

Summoners were skeptic about golems anyway,for one simple reason,lack of slots to run one.

Melee Splash got a mechanic change,the less splash dmg is mitigated by more single target dmg,not to mention only zombies use the gem,and some builds drop it endgame anyway.

Quoting me like I don't know what I'm talking about

So let's conclude,you say summoners are a "mess" because:

A:Golems are not great for them

B:Melee Splash got nurfed qq


Yeah,we can all conclude the sentence in bold is correct

"

Where's your summoner? I cant find it...

.

"

Saltychipmunk wrote:

"

AusterlitZ wrote:

"

Summoner is a mess. How can you argue with that when summoners wont even be using golems? Melee Splash is nerfed, god knows what else summoners rely on.
Quoting me like I don't know what I'm talking about, or maybe I'm just making things up for the hell of it?

So because summoners don't get much out of golems (which i disagree with,the Chaos golem is good just for the mitigation it offers,even unlinked),they are suddenly a "mess" ?

Summoners were skeptic about golems anyway,for one simple reason,lack of slots to run one.

Melee Splash got a mechanic change,the less splash dmg is mitigated by more single target dmg,not to mention only zombies use the gem,and some builds drop it endgame anyway.

Quoting me like I don't know what I'm talking about

So let's conclude,you say summoners are a "mess" because:

A:Golems are not great for them

B:Melee Splash got nurfed qq


Yeah,we can all conclude the sentence in bold is correct

"

Where's your summoner? I cant find it...

.

hmm, then how about some one with a history of saying why summoners are a mess addresses both parties.

Summoners really are a mess. right now there really is no such thing as a pure summoner. summons by themselves lack the means to perpetuate their own viability. this has been a HUGE problem since the creation of poe and it is the major reason why summoners are terrible to level.

they are too dependent on other mechanics such as necronomic aegis and specific shields and or auras.

they have no physical mitigation and no real means to get it without using extremely limiting mechanics,

they have no real method of life restoration. you have to use a rejuve totem or rolled animation flasks or regeneration auras . 5 or 6 things to get life restoration levels that a simple life potion would give to everything else. and if you lack specific combinations of those things your minions die faster than one can summon them.


summoners are over dependent on unique items with almost no options on rares. why do i have to use bones of uller, vis mortis and queen's decree/ midnight bargain just so the specter gem is viable? I though unique items were not supposed to be bis , yet here we are what 2 years in now? and behold not 1, not 2 but 3 unique items are definitively bis for this build and they arent even high level like mjolnir or shavs, two are in the 20s and one barely passes 40.

and it is not like rares are full or minion mods. what do summoners get on wands? cast speed, mana and resists. that is the grand total of all random mods on wands that are useful to asummoner. mods so generic you can be forgiven for thinking this was launch day diablo 3.

And whats worse is that the few minion mods we do get are master gated and limited.


this is why srs is the best build. i can use ANY +2 fire / minion item in the game and my build is good to go, no god damn bones of uller , no bloody midnight bargain NONE of that bull shit. and guess what as SRS i get to do 2 - 10 times the damage yay balance.


But let us talk about gems. i dont know or care if you were around for this but back in the day summoners did not get things like convocation , or desecrate or bone offering. and even back then they had gem slot issues. But every time there was some sort of glaring issue with summoners for ggg to solve. what do they do? they add a gem to solve it. Where the HELL are we so supposed to fit all these god damn gems? HMMM? tell me?

minions stuck in the tunnel maps? well find room for convocation.
minions lack attack speed or defenses ? pack some offerings.
boss doesn't have ads to get corpses from? better have room for a desecrate.

again where the heck do we put all of these things? why do we need a gem slot just to get the minion equivalent of a desynch fix? why is that not just an inherent mechanic?

flesh and bone offering are nice and all that , but it is clear that gem space issues have created a clear winner there with flesh offering. It is so bad that any build that needs to rely on bone offering is considered inferior due to the hit on clear speed.

and then there is desecrate. ugh.......


And how about all of those unused minions? skeletons? why the hell would anyone use these when srs do double the dps, move twice as fast and hit almost twice as fast?

animate weapon? they die on load screens T-T come on.

And how is animate guardian doing? don't know? well that is not surprising since almost no one uses that poor fella. turns out losing items on death is not a popular feature.


If we want to turn this into mud slapping game , i can flood this thread with enough toxic bile to turn everyone into the toxic avenger.

"

Saltychipmunk wrote:

"

AusterlitZ wrote:

"

Summoner is a mess. How can you argue with that when summoners wont even be using golems? Melee Splash is nerfed, god knows what else summoners rely on.
Quoting me like I don't know what I'm talking about, or maybe I'm just making things up for the hell of it?

So because summoners don't get much out of golems (which i disagree with,the Chaos golem is good just for the mitigation it offers,even unlinked),they are suddenly a "mess" ?

Summoners were skeptic about golems anyway,for one simple reason,lack of slots to run one.

Melee Splash got a mechanic change,the less splash dmg is mitigated by more single target dmg,not to mention only zombies use the gem,and some builds drop it endgame anyway.

Quoting me like I don't know what I'm talking about

So let's conclude,you say summoners are a "mess" because:

A:Golems are not great for them

B:Melee Splash got nurfed qq


Yeah,we can all conclude the sentence in bold is correct

"

Where's your summoner? I cant find it...

.

hmm, then how about some one with a history of saying why summoners are a mess addresses both parties.

Summoners really are a mess. right now there really is no such thing as a pure summoner. summons by themselves lack the means to perpetuate their own viability. this has been a HUGE problem since the creation of poe and it is the major reason why summoners are terrible to level.

they are too dependent on other mechanics such as necronomic aegis and specific shields and or auras.

they have no physical mitigation and no real means to get it without using extremely limiting mechanics,

they have no real method of life restoration. you have to use a rejuve totem or rolled animation flasks or regeneration auras . 5 or 6 things to get life restoration levels that a simple life potion would give to everything else. and if you lack specific combinations of those things your minions die faster than one can summon them.


summoners are over dependent on unique items with almost no options on rares. why do i have to use bones of uller, vis mortis and queen's decree/ midnight bargain just so the specter gem is viable? I though unique items were not supposed to be bis , yet here we are what 2 years in now? and behold not 1, not 2 but 3 unique items are definitively bis for this build and they arent even high level like mjolnir or shavs, two are in the 20s and one barely passes 40.

and it is not like rares are full or minion mods. what do summoners get on wands? cast speed, mana and resists. that is the grand total of all random mods on wands that are useful to asummoner. mods so generic you can be forgiven for thinking this was launch day diablo 3.

And whats worse is that the few minion mods we do get are master gated and limited.


this is why srs is the best build. i can use ANY +2 fire / minion item in the game and my build is good to go, no god damn bones of uller , no bloody midnight bargain NONE of that bull shit. and guess what as SRS i get to do 2 - 10 times the damage yay balance.


But let us talk about gems. i dont know or care if you were around for this but back in the day summoners did not get things like convocation , or desecrate or bone offering. and even back then they had gem slot issues. But every time there was some sort of glaring issue with summoners for ggg to solve. what do they do? they add a gem to solve it. Where the HELL are we so supposed to fit all these god damn gems? HMMM? tell me?

minions stuck in the tunnel maps? well find room for convocation.
minions lack attack speed or defenses ? pack some offerings.
boss doesn't have ads to get corpses from? better have room for a desecrate.

again where the heck do we put all of these things? why do we need a gem slot just to get the minion equivalent of a desynch fix? why is that not just an inherent mechanic?

flesh and bone offering are nice and all that , but it is clear that gem space issues have created a clear winner there with flesh offering. It is so bad that any build that needs to rely on bone offering is considered inferior due to the hit on clear speed.

and then there is desecrate. ugh.......


And how about all of those unused minions? skeletons? why the hell would anyone use these when srs do double the dps, move twice as fast and hit almost twice as fast?

animate weapon? they die on load screens T-T come on.

And how is animate guardian doing? don't know? well that is not surprising since almost no one uses that poor fella. turns out losing items on death is not a popular feature.


If we want to turn this into mud slapping game , i can flood this thread with enough toxic bile to turn everyone into the toxic avenger.

"

xSyK0TiC wrote:

Can't disagree here. Other ARPGs do a summoner archetype well. But I think in PoE it's not as easy, or rather it becomes more complicated because of the adaptability of the tree and characters, plus the gems and then gear.

"

Saltychipmunk wrote:

please realize that is exactly why there is a problem, stop trying to fix the bloody issue by throwing crap at it.
we already got crap, make it not crap.